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How do I maximize Highway MPG?

Highway MPG

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69 replies to this topic

#21 OFFLINE   drdiesel1

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 12:55 AM

New tire technology has changed a lot. Gone are the old bias ply tires that were balloons.

Today's tires are designed with CAD technology. How do you think they get a PSI rated to 51 psi.

I've been running 55 psi in mine since new (4K miles) and just bumped them up to 60. My tires are

wearing even, smooth, anf flat. The car handles much better.

 

I run 75 psi in my diesel pickup. It has 10 ply tires. They wear very flat and the truck handles way better.

They're rated @ 80 psi, but that's a little harsh so I run 75 and it works great. The door label calls for

65 front and 80 rear @ max load. With the diesel engine, it's front heavy and 65 makes the tires roll

on the wheel when turning hard. It wants to wonder on the mountain roads. The extra pressure makes

it handle much better and the tires wear even without feathering the edges.


Edited by drdiesel1, 31 January 2015 - 01:01 AM.

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#22 OFFLINE   Adrian_L

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 12:30 PM

It is true, I have had it happen on multiple vehicles. Excessive inflation causes the tire to inflate like a donught, which causes increased wear in the middle of the tire. I have seen it happen numerous times.wear_patterns.jpg

 

Absolutely correct.  The maximum rated tire pressure is there for a reason--safety.  I wouldn't go higher than 44 psi on the Michelin eco tires.

 

http://www.wheels.ca...are-a-bad-idea/


Edited by Adrian_L, 31 January 2015 - 12:35 PM.

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#23 OFFLINE   drdiesel1

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 01:22 PM

Absolutely correct.  The maximum rated tire pressure is there for a reason--safety.  I wouldn't go higher than 44 psi on the Michelin eco tires.

 

http://www.wheels.ca...are-a-bad-idea/

Considering the tires on my car are stamped 51 PSI @ Max Load, 44 is low. Don't forget the rating has a safety margin too.

It's not gonna have any problems @ 51 or they wouldn't rate it to that number.


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#24 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 04:10 PM

Absolutely correct.  The maximum rated tire pressure is there for a reason--safety.  I wouldn't go higher than 44 psi on the Michelin eco tires.

 

http://www.wheels.ca...are-a-bad-idea/

The maximum tire pressure is 51PSI on the sidewall of our Michelin's . Legally Michelin is not going to recommend anything different than the car manufacturer.   So 50PSI is not over inflating or a safety hazard according  to Michelin. :)

 

Paul


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#25 ONLINE   Plus 3 Golfer

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 05:56 PM

What PSI should I run - probably one of the most debatable subjects on car forums.   The picture below describes my experience with pressure in tires for about 40 years. :)

 

gallery_167_32_24850.jpg


Edited by Plus 3 Golfer, 31 January 2015 - 07:02 PM.

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#26 OFFLINE   Kelleytoons

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 09:12 PM

Sorry just can't help this (from "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas - 1973"):

 

At first I thought it was only because the tires were soft, so I took it into the Texaco station next to the Flamingo and had the tires pumped up to fifty pounds each—which alarmed the attendant, until I explained that these were “experimental” tires.
 
But fifty pounds each didn’t help the cornering, so I went back a few hours later and told him I wanted to try seventy-five. He shook his head nervously. “Not me,” he said, handing me the air hose. “Here. They’re your tires. You do it.”
 
“What’s wrong?” I asked. “You think they can’t take seventy-five?”
 
He nodded, moving away as I stooped to deal with the left front. “You’re damn right,” he said. “Those tires want twenty-eight in the front and thirty-two in the rear. Hell, fifty’s dangerous, but seventy-five is crazy. They’ll explode!”
 
I shook my head and kept filling the left front. “I told you,” I said. Sandoz laboratories designed these tires. They’re special. I could load them up to a hundred.
 
“God almighty!” he groaned. “Don’t do that here.”
 
“Not today,” I replied. “I want to see how they corner with seventy-five.”
 
He chuckled. “You won’t even get to the corner, Mister.”
 
“We’ll see,” I said, moving around to the rear with the air-hose. In truth, I was nervous. The two front ones were tighter than snare drums; they felt like teak wood when I tapped on them with the rod. But what the hell? I thought. If they explode, so what? It’s not often that a man gets a chance to run terminal experiments on a virgin Cadillac and four brand-new $80 tires. For all I knew, the thing might start cornering like a Lotus Elan. 

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#27 OFFLINE   SnowStorm

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 09:50 PM

Be careful buying replacements as there are two versions of Energy Saver A/S tires.  The 93V is OEM with the 51 psi rating but there is also a 94V with only a 44 psi rating.  No idea why.

 

Today it seems almost all abnormal wear is from misalignment or failure to rotate (cupping).


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#28 OFFLINE   SnowStorm

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 10:22 PM

.... but seventy-five is crazy. They’ll explode!”

Years ago I was filling up when there was a very loud "pow".  I looked around towards the air pump just in time to see the hose hit the ground - thrown down disgustedly by the poor angry chap who had just "blown up" his tire.  I guess the cornering wasn't good enough.... :lol: or, most likely, there wasn't any gauge on the pump.

 

Gone are the "easy days" where you would turn the little crank until the correct value appears in the "digital display", pump up the tire, ding - ding - ding - - - ding -  -  -  -  - ding  -  -  -  -  - was that the last one?  Shucks, pumping up your tires was kinda fun! :play:


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#29 OFFLINE   scottwood2

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Posted 01 February 2015 - 08:16 AM

Absolutely correct.  The maximum rated tire pressure is there for a reason--safety.  I wouldn't go higher than 44 psi on the Michelin eco tires.

 

http://www.wheels.ca...are-a-bad-idea/

That was a nice write up.  Thx for sharing.  



#30 OFFLINE   SPL Tech

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Posted 02 February 2015 - 03:45 AM

You say this after I explained my actual experience of 64K miles on my first set of tires on my CMAX with 50PSI with no wear problems, really! ;)

CMAXers want to know what members have experienced, not unrelated info on other cars. IMHO :)

 

Paul

Well good for you, but like I said I have seen it happen multiple times. Those photos are an exact replica of what I have seen in the field on multiple cars. I used to have a Geo Metro and I ran the car at the max pressure listed on the sidewall since I bought the tires brand new. Once the tires were ready for replacement, they looked exactly like the photo above.

 

The manufactures dont just make up the number they post on the door. They know what they are doing. That number takes into account multiple factors including traction, stability, rolling resistance, wear and heat dissipation. You can max out the pressure in your tires but it WILL reduce traction. You are reducing the footprint on the ground, it's not hard to see how that reduces traction.

 

The number posted on the tire is the maximum pressure the tire manufacturer says the tire can withstand, it is NOT the pressure you should necessarily run the tire at. That pressure assumes the tire is loaded to the maximum safe load as printed on the sidewall of the tire. Unless you are running that load, the tire manufacturer will tell you to follow your car manufacturer’s printed recommendation.

 

Mythbusters has tested whether it is a good idea to overinflate the tire. They found it was not. They found the fuel savings was negated by increased tire wear, and it reduced the traction of the vehicle, just like I said.

 

Run the tire at 5 PSI over door stamp and call it done. Going higher than that will just reduce traction. If you get into a crash, your fuel savings are out the door for life. 1,000,000 miles with overinflated tires will save you less money than you will spend repairing just one crash. Not exactly a good tradeoff.


Edited by SPL Tech, 02 February 2015 - 03:49 AM.


#31 OFFLINE   C-MaxSea

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Posted 02 February 2015 - 12:40 PM

38 psi too low for most load conditions (and it only drifts lower (& more underinflated) over time), 60 psi too high, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47 +- cold (and drifting lower over time) just right.  :) :) :)   Just my two cents worth, nothing more.  Driving in the slow lane under 70 mph, mild temps..............  Nick

 

(93Vs - 51psi max load OEM tires)


Edited by C-MaxSea, 02 February 2015 - 01:04 PM.


#32 OFFLINE   kblast523

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 11:48 AM

Hi all, newbie C-Max Hybrid owner here.  My first experience with a hybrid ended abruptly in 2009 why my 'silverfish' 2005 Prius got the dreaded 'screen of death'  The two Toyota dealers in Tulsa both told me to 'walk 'til we can look at it', (a week or ten days out), so I headed to Ford.  ended up with a 2009 Fusion SE 2.3 that was a decent car....fast forward...so was the 2012 Focus SE, but after a trip to Scottsdale in early December, the wife decided it was time to get an 'upgrade'.  Searched Ford and found one new SE white over black cloth, and not another single C-Max closer than 300 miles.  Certified Used produced two vehicles, a 2014 SE in Witchita, Ks, and a 2013 SEL in Stillwater, Ok.  No doubt the Ice Storm SEL Pano was the choice, bought it over the phone, picked it up Dec 24.

Now for the tire pressure issue.  Has anyone read the NTSB Ford Explorer/Firestone Tire report?  Ford specs for the tire and tire pressure on the 1998-2001 Ford Explorer were a perfect  match for disaster all in the name of ride quality.  Jaques Nasser personally falsified the vehicle weight when presenting the specifications to Bridgestone/Firestone engineers who argued the tire needed more capacity AND inflation.  Firestone had been asked to remove 18% of  the shoulder tread which compromised the carry capacity of the tire.  At recommended pressure (26 psi), a Ford Explorer with 325 lbs of passengers in the front seat, 42 lbs in the left rear, would experience catastrophic tire failure of the left rear tire at ambient temperature over 86 degrees, traveling 70 mph continuously, between 42-54 min.

Tire experience I have had on recent vehicles: 2005 Prius, came with Goodyear Integrity 15" tires. Junk and replaced them with set of Yokohama Avid all season at 8k.  Yokos going strong at 35k when traded, ran at 45psi.  2009 Ford Fusion had Continentals that got noisy, but held 45 psi quite well, made 25k miles with even wear and anticipated life near 40k.  2012 Focus wore Continentals smooth out at 20k, running 45psi.  Replacement Bridgestones got noisy at 25k, but showed little wear and two were replaced under warranty just before trade.  Also ran 46-48 psi in these with no trouble.  2009 Ford Flex with Yokohama Avid Ascent Blue Earths that have 40k on them at 40 psi and still have 9/32nds tread on all four, even treadwear, silent operation.  Running 42 psi in  the Michelins on the C-Max, and even though this was a Hertz rental unit in a previous life, all four tires have even wear and 8/32nds at 25k miles.

Happy Motoring, all....


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#33 OFFLINE   markd

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 12:17 PM

Welcome.

#34 OFFLINE   fbov

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 01:02 PM

To quote the end of Adrian's link:

The Michelin report concludes, “The key learning is that inflation pressure affects the tire-vehicle interaction, and the only correct inflation pressure for proper balanced performance is what is specified by the vehicle manufacturer on the placard."

 

For those who may not be immediately aware, that's written by a lawyer, not an engineer, so it's substantially false.

 

The real "key learning" was to reduce financial risk to the tire manufacturer by never answering the question. Every tire company says the same thing, in hopes that you sue the car maker, not them.

 

As kblast notes, the "correct inflation pressure ... specified by the vehicle manufacturer" is what got Ford Explorer drivers killed.

 

Do we really need graphic pictures of high speed rollover accidents as counterpoint to uneven tire?

 

Frank, who reads specs from sidewalls, not placards.


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#35 OFFLINE   Adrian_L

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 06:16 PM

Frank, with respect:

 

Are you suggesting, in all these years of automotive engineering, that GMC, Ford, Volvo, BMW, you name it can't figure out the safest, most efficient, most economical tire inflation pressure and put it on the placard?   

Seriously? 


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#36 OFFLINE   SStoner

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 07:05 PM

I raised my tire pressures up to the rating on the tire. It's a little stiffer ride and kinda seems to handle better.


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#37 OFFLINE   Adrian_L

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 09:09 PM

My main concern with that would be when the tire gets hot you're over the safety limit put there by Michelin.

Welcome to the forum. We're a mellow bunch but some of us get cranky when we misplace our false teeth or walking sticks.
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#38 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 10:14 PM

My main concern with that would be when the tire gets hot you're over the safety limit put there by Michelin.

Welcome to the forum. We're a mellow bunch but some of us get cranky when we misplace our false teeth or walking sticks.

The higher the pressure, The lower the tire temperature.  The Tire Companies put a Maximium Safe Cold Tire Inflation Pressue on the sidewall of our tires which is 51PSI for our Michelin's.  You get great tire wear, for me it was 64K mi. before I put on my new ones. :)

 

Paul



#39 OFFLINE   SStoner

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Posted 27 February 2015 - 10:54 PM

My main concern with that would be when the tire gets hot you're over the safety limit put there by Michelin.

Welcome to the forum. We're a mellow bunch but some of us get cranky when we misplace our false teeth or walking sticks.

 

 

The higher the pressure, The lower the tire temperature.  The Tire Companies put a Maximium Safe Cold Tire Inflation Pressue on the sidewall of our tires which is 51PSI for our Michelin's.  You get great tire wear, for me it was 64K mi. before I put on my new ones. :)

 

Paul

 

I would agree with ptjones on this subject. Thanks for the welcome Adrian_L



#40 OFFLINE   fbov

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Posted 02 March 2015 - 12:52 PM

Frank, with respect:

 

Are you suggesting, in all these years of automotive engineering, that GMC, Ford, Volvo, BMW, you name it can't figure out the safest, most efficient, most economical tire inflation pressure and put it on the placard?   

Seriously? 

Very much so! No one can serve two masters, not even engineers...

 

"Engineering" can be defined as the science of picking the right tradeoffs between conflicting requirements and capabilities. Car companies seek tradeoffs that will spur sales and maximize profits, the latter requiring risk analysis and mitigation if they're to keep the money they make. As a result, any publish tire pressure must will work with all tires, not just their OEM choice, for all uses and conditions, as well as all drivers and driving styles.

 

When they get risk analysis wrong, and owners follow the placard, you get the chain of events discussed in post #32.

 

When an owner takes responsibility for their car, based on specific and detailed information the car manufacturer can't know, you get posts like those on this thread suggesting that about 50psi is a good place to set tire pressures with the OEM tires.

 

Have fun,

Frank, whose been known to ignore sidewall pressure ratings when the application warranted.


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