Dead 12V Battery In My C-MAX

[locot]

are dealers replacing batteries under warranty or are you having to pay for a new battery?  Or are they being PIA's and blaming the customer that they left the lights on etc etc?

[RedLdr1]

are dealers replacing batteries under warranty or are you having to pay for a new battery?  Or are they being PIA's and blaming the customer that they left the lights on etc etc?

 

My 12V battery was replaced under warranty after it failed a load test.   Since the car automatically shuts down lights and other accessories it is hard to blame the owner... 

Edited March 2, 2013 by RedLdr1

[locot]

Actually it doesn't auto shut down all the lights at shutdown under certain scenarios. Example you have your headlights on (not the auto position). You power car down, headlights do get shutoff. However, even with doors locked etc the window mirror and corner lights are still on. I realized it after I found my car with its lights still on after I went into the house. If headlights are on autoposition then yes everything powers off.

 

That may be another reason why some owners are draining their batteries?

[Max Power]

Actually it doesn't auto shut down all the lights at shutdown under certain scenarios. Example you have your headlights on (not the auto position). You power car down, headlights do get shutoff. However, even with doors locked etc the window mirror and corner lights are still on. I realized it after I found my car with its lights still on after I went into the house. If headlights are on autoposition then yes everything powers off. That may be another reason why some owners are draining their batteries?

Did you lock the car?  My approach lights don't shut off until I lock the car.  Having the lights on auto or manual doesn't seem to matter.

[locot]

Yes I locked the car ( I'm pretty sure). Also if one of your doors are not closed completely the approach lights also will stay on.

[RedLdr1]

 

Actually it doesn't auto shut down all the lights at shutdown under certain scenarios. Example you have your headlights on (not the auto position). You power car down, headlights do get shutoff. However, even with doors locked etc the window mirror and corner lights are still on. I realized it after I found my car with its lights still on after I went into the house. If headlights are on autoposition then yes everything powers off. That may be another reason why some owners are draining their batteries?

 

 

See Page 75, quoted below, of your Owners Manual.  The lights, and other power, will stay on for 10 to 30 minutes before automatically shutting down....

 

• Battery Saver

  If the courtesy lamps, dome lamps or headlamps are left on, the battery saver will shut them off 10 minutes after the ignition has been turned off.

  Accessory Mode Battery Saver for Intelligent Access Keys (If Equipped)

  If you shut off the engine and leave the ignition in the on or accessory mode, the ignition will shut off after 30 minutes.

 

 Also if one of your doors are not closed completely the approach lights also will stay on.

 

That is a good example of "user error" and not Ford's fault...  I'm sure if I go out of my way to find a way I could make the lights stay on and kill the battery in any car...

[RetiredGuy]

I'm new to this forum, but my 1 mo. old CMax Energi also had a "dead" 12v battery a week ago, called Ford Roadside and the service guy siccessfully used a portable jump start unit to jump the leads under the hood, (had to use the removable little "T" key in the smart key to get into the car). Not sure, but the rotary head light switch may have been left on position 3.

 

Then yesterday, after towing the CMax energi behind our RV for 45 minutes or so, I stopped to disconnect and watched it's main Ford-Sync display say "Power Saver - System Off", while filling a blue progress bar, and then the car was totally dead again, had to back up the RV in the middle of the road to get a set of jumper cables to reach.

 

I called FORD's emergency number, got a case number assigned and we'll see where this goes. The car was plugged in (120v cord) overnight, it appears to have charged it's high voltage battery. Not sure about the12v though. I think the glitch has spmething to do with the "Power Saver - System Off" routine it does before going 100% dead to the owner.

 

I wish I had checked the voltage at the actual battery terminals under the rear hatch area before jumping it and then having plugged it in overnight to charge.

 

I did a little battery challenge test this morning, I left it's Key FOB in it, turned on it's parking lights and radio, tailgate open to the actual battery under the rear deck, and measured the battery at 12.3 v initially. After exactly 30 minutes, the car shut off the interior lights and the radio, but left the 8 parking light bulbs on. The 12 v battery had dropped to 12.05 volts. After 30 minutes longer, the battery was down to 11.8 volts, and I quit the test. By my figuring the battery was then 20-50% discharged although it had only seen maybe 15 amp/hours of use figuring running light bulbs at about 0.6 amps each. Then I plugged it's 12 v cord back in, it lite its full blue circle (Its high voltage battery was still fully charged)

 

I think the CMax Energi does also charge its 12v battery when plugged in to 120v power as it took 0.21 kwh of power after being plugged in for an hour and a half (I have a handy little "Kill A Watt" meter it's plugged in to) and after that short time, its 12v battery then reads 14.2 volts (i.e. it's being charged). I think that calculates to it only taking 16 amp/hours to recharge, not sure how many amp hours it's 12 v battery is, since its rated in CCA vs Amp/hours, but the charge power equals the power I calculated it would have used during my challenge test.

 

Not sure what to make of this data, I think I'm going to order a Clore JNC300XL Jump Starter for $58 from Amazon to have on hand while I wait for FORD to figure out what's wrong.

 

The car says "Microsoft" right in the middle of the dash and you have to push a button that says "Start" in order to "Stop" your car.

[RetiredGuy]

Further info,

FORD says the "No Start Issue" is "known" and that an "update" will be out in the next couple weeks, that the dealership will arrange, and to stay in contact with them regarding having it performed.

Time will tell . . .

[Laurel]

I think we have a precursor of a battery problem.  We can't sit and listen to the car radio with the car in accessory mode without a message coming up to turn the car off to save power or start the engine.  This is new and I think is indicative of a low charge on that 12 v. battery.  Tip is due for her first servicing next month (the sticker says May or 10,000 km we are super low mileage at 2500 km so May is when it will happen).  So I will be putting this on the servicing list.  In the mean time hubby says he will go and charge up the 12v. battery.  I wonder if this is happening because of no long trips?  We seem to do lots of 10 to 20 k trips lately.

Edited April 5, 2013 by Laurel

[jmckinley]

Hey Retired guy, you can forget towing this thing without a charge line back from the motorhome.  Too much residual drain going on for that little bitty battery. 

 

An alternative is to use elanstri's suggestion to manually override the shifter interlock and put it in neutral without turning on the ignition.  Seems to work well and it will eliminate most of the problem.  Check the thread on Towing with a Motorhome for details. 

 

Of course there still is the problem with some cars where the battery runs down all the time just sitting in the garage.  Jury is out on that one.

[Triple Ford Owner]

Yesterday, Ford's Roadside Asst  jumped my C-max (the first time I called AAA), I happily drove it back to the Dealership service dept. for a check up --for the second time (6 1/2 weeks since first dead battery)

They called yesterday to say they replaced the battery, are trying to get permission to clean/dry the interior (bc the windows mysteriously went down sometime during the day--it rained all day) and are planning to keep it until Monday/Tuesday to check everything out.  Offered a rental but I declined bc I didn't think it necessary.  I really want this to be fixed and move on. 

 

NOW, Almost am afraid to mention this bc I know we are going to sound like a crazy family... but I will.  We own three Fords. AND, Up until Feb 15 (when the new C-Max battery was dead) Never had an Issue..seriously...  Today, April 5, My daughter and I drove to Texas A & M  at 5:30AM for a campus tour. Parked our 2008 Ford Escape Hybrid in the Visitor Garage 8:45 AM.  Left Campus at 12:45 AM--so car in no way  hot, weather perfect, etc.  My almost 17 year old was driving us home when 30-35 minutes in a warning light came on,  "Safely Pull Over NOW " came up and ----TOTAL LOSS OF POWER--.  Never been so afraid in my life...bc of the scream! (I was trying to nap LOL)   I thought she had overreacted, told her to pull over, turn car off,etc.  We did then started back up. Then back on the small state highway..and it happened again about 10 minutes later. Needless to say experienced driver took over.  In order to shorten the story, it took us 6 hours to get home (normal 3 hour drive) had 9 more total loss of power events, forced to drive access roads and uncharted territory to avoid Interstate, 18 wheelers and concrete construction blocks all of which could have led to an unpleasant death.  

 

Should have taken Ford Service Dept up on loaner car!  Now - Afraid to drive anywhere in Escape without a shoulder to"Safely" pull over on or store to pull in..Who are they kidding--65 MPH to total DEAD--no warning--scary doesn't begin to describe   I am THANKFUL I was with her and we are both alive. Looks like Ill be searching a new Forum in a minute...after I finish my much needed Margarita... 

[erwhitham]

I think we have a precursor of a battery problem.  We can't sit and listen to the car radio with the car in accessory mode without a message coming up to turn the car off to save power or start the engine.  This is new and I think is indicative of a low charge on that 12 v. battery.  Tip is due for her first servicing next month (the sticker says May or 10,000 km we are super low mileage at 2500 km so May is when it will happen).  So I will be putting this on the servicing list.  In the mean time hubby says he will go and charge up the 12v. battery.  I wonder if this is happening because of no long trips?  We seem to do lots of 10 to 20 k trips lately.

Laurel, I noticed the same "turn car off to save power notice" a couple times as I listened to the radio in accessory mode. Started a pitter patter in my heart but this was 6 weeks ago and I've had no battery issues. My trips are two 6 minute jaunts each day, the same for the past 7 years with my Prius. I question the correlation between hybrids and small 12 volt battery problems, however, I'm a sampling of one. Please post if your service visit answers any of your concerns.

[Triple Ford Owner]

Yippie!  My C-max is back today--dropped my 2008 Ford Escape Hybrid in its place due to near death experience on highway...complete power failure--multiple times without warning I might add--bad "CARma" in our house right now...

 

Some of  what the our service paperwork on the C-Max  SE  says:

 

PERFORM TSB per Ford Hotline   CAUSE:..... MT 1121108A  2756  WF.....N/C (no charge)

PARTS:....  (?)  6398 121108A 0.40 Contacted Hotline and was instructed to perform TSB #12-11-8 and REPROGRAM the FCDIM. per 12-11-8 (?)

 

MT BATTERY 2756 WF

1 BXT*67R* BATTERY

1 WPRD 10655

....... Verified concern tested, charged and retested battery, and found battery will not hold a charge..REPLACED BATTERY

Multipoint Inspection Performed... (No Charge N/C)

 

They also removed all of my seats and carpet and throughly cleaned and dried them due to the rain damage...

(N/C no charge)

 

So----- thanks to all of you who helped get the ball rolling on the changes needed!!!! I hope this is our last unscheduled visit for the C-Max  :)

[Laurel]

Laurel, I noticed the same "turn car off to save power notice" a couple times as I listened to the radio in accessory mode. Started a pitter patter in my heart but this was 6 weeks ago and I've had no battery issues. My trips are two 6 minute jaunts each day, the same for the past 7 years with my Prius. I question the correlation between hybrids and small 12 volt battery problems, however, I'm a sampling of one. Please post if your service visit answers any of your concerns.

I have it on my list for when I book the first servicing in May so I will let you know what they say.  I have only one other item so far which was the not going into reverse that happened once this past week.

[bob61571]

Had postcard from dealer on Recall 13A01, at least they called it an "Urgent Recall Notice".  Couldn't find it as a Recall, but is a TSB, Technical Service Bulleting, I think!

 

Found this on a Ford TSB site:

"   5962 - 2013 C-MAX - 12-Volt Battery Discharged - Will Not Hold Charge - Radio With 4.2-Inch Display Only - built on or before 2/5/2013
See TSB: 13-04-13 for details. 13-04-13 "

 

Link

http://www.vrep.fordtechservice.dealerconnection.com/vdirs/oasis/oareq.asp?broadcast=ON&from

 

Have not called for appmt yet, but will report back.

Edited April 29, 2013 by bob61571

[bob61571]

Here's the PDF on TSB 13-04-13

 

http://www.fordservicecontent.com/pubs/content/~WT/~MUS~LEN/3569/tsb13-04-13.pdf

[67gtcougar]

We bought our CMax Energi on Feb. 7th, and thought we were immune to the battery problem until yesterday morning.  Also, the night before my battery died I noticed that my Level 2 Charging station continued to stay on even though the high voltage battery was fully charged.  I turned off the charging station and later unplugged the cable.  When I opened the door, the doom lights flashed and I got a message on the LCD screen "Battery Saver - System Off".  When I plugged 240 volt charging cable back in, the dash lit up like normal and I was able to run the car.  This morning the condition was worse.  When I opened the door the dome light came on, but nothing else.  I tried plugging the 240 Volt charging cable in but nothing happened.  I then used jumper cables to get the car running again.  The MFM hasn't been working since April 26th, but after the jump I got the notification:  "[your car] had experienced a fault while charging. Please verify that there isn't a problem with your power source.  If the problem persists, contact your dealership."  Crap!  My car was probably built in January, but I haven't received a recall notice. 

[barrier2entry]

I've had the dead battery issue 3 times (the latest was this morning).  In my case, even attempting to jump start did not help (it did let me shift into neutral, at least).

 

The first time, after owning the car less than a week, they just recharged the battery.

It failed again about 3 weeks later.  After a week of tests, they decided they needed to replace the battery.

I had no problems for almost 5 weeks after that -- until this morning.

 

When I asked the dealer what they would try different from the last time, they just said they'd wait to see what Ford told them to do.

 

*sigh*

[jmckinley]

If you battery pukes, you can get into neutral by popping off the gearshift boot plate. 

 

Look down in there and you'll find a white plastic thing about 4 inches down.

 

Flip it back and you can shift into neutral. 

 

The owner's manual is totally wrong on the procedure to defeat the Brake Shift Interlock to get the vehicle in neutral with a failed interlock or a dead battery.

[wab]

I've had the dead battery issue 3 times (the latest was this morning).  In my case, even attempting to jump start did not help (it did let me shift into neutral, at least).

 

The first time, after owning the car less than a week, they just recharged the battery.

It failed again about 3 weeks later.  After a week of tests, they decided they needed to replace the battery.

I had no problems for almost 5 weeks after that -- until this morning.

 

When I asked the dealer what they would try different from the last time, they just said they'd wait to see what Ford told them to do.

 

*sigh*

 

Take a look at post #66 by bob61571 and this thread.

http://fordcmaxhybridforum.com/topic/1889-i-got-my-c-max-serviced-for-the-battery-problem-today/

 

You'll probably get a new battery when they do the TSB's.

 

Give the TSB #'s to your service writer, if you have to.

[DKG85]

We bought our CMax in October 2012 and I have had FOUR electrical malfunctions that I think are related. The first one occurred while driving -- the display started flashing yellow and basically said to stop as soon as I could do so safely. After a frustrating hour trying to decode the error symbols using the owner's manual, I finally found "electrical malfunction".  Towed to dealer, they said they tightened some connections and tested the battery, and sent it home.  The next three times were almost identical: I'd go out to the car in the morning and try to unlock it with the key clicker, and nothing happened. Opened the car manually with the key, but there were no display lights, no dome light, absolutely nothing.  On dealer's advice, had it towed (did not attempt to jump it; the third tow service said that jumping the car would clear the codes so the dealer would not be able to diagnose).  One time they replaced the 12V battery, another time they advised me not to leave my USB cable plugged in (though no device was attached), and the most recent time they installed a software update (Technical Service Bulletin 13-4-13). Other than this problem, I like the car a lot, but this is obviously a deal-breaker. 

[kbf1kbf1]

Has anyone who has experienced the dead battery issue ever gotten a permanent fix to the problem, i.e., gotten a fix and thereafter never had the dead battery problem to deal with again? If so, what is the fix?

[RedLdr1]

Has anyone who has experienced the dead battery issue ever gotten a permanent fix to the problem, i.e., gotten a fix and thereafter never had the dead battery problem to deal with again? If so, what is the fix?

 

Yes, I have...  See the very first post in this thread for the details.

[Adair]

We've been asked to combine the battery threads into 2....Zhackwyatt's poll and the Battery Dead thread. This is my first attempt at doing this...........here's hoping it works.

 

 

http://fordcmaxhybridforum.com/topic/361-battery-dead/page-20?hl=%2Bbattery+%2Bdead&do=findComment&comment=11225

 

http://fordcmaxhybridforum.com/topic/1294-for-those-who-have-had-12v-battery-problems/?hl=%2Bbattery+%2Bdead&do=findComment&comment=11661