Trans Fluid Change

[MaxHeadroom]

ptjones and Plus 3 Golfer really know their C-Maxes! I used a FORScan phone app with an ELM327 Bluetooth connection to read a maximum observed transmissin fluid temperature of 179 F, about matching their temperatures.
One can conclude that transmission fluid is full enough in there based on temperature,  I'm convinced, since low fluid means your temperatures will get high.

 

I was changing the oil yesterday (Pennzoil Platinum 0w20 with a MicroGreen oil filter) at the 65,000 mile point, with a tire rotation, and curiosity got the better of me.

After I took the left front wheel off, I noticed the transmission level plug bolt just staring at me, calling my name, daring me to check the level.  

 

I then wrenched the level plug off, quite easily, very low torque, as if it was barely on there, with the car level since the entire car was on jack stands.

No evidence of the red fluid leaking out anywhere, good news.

No fluid came out of the level plug, which is OK, and the ambient temperature was about 100 F (drove it earlier; and hot summer day), close to the 40 C temperature to check the level at.

 

Was it low a bit?  I drained it out and got 3.5 quarts out, which is short of the spec (Owner's Manual) capacity of 4.8 quarts.  A youtube video showed somebody got 4.2 qts out by comparison.....  I had the level plug open to let air in as I drained it out to help some.    .....OK, some may be stuck in there, unavailable, or maybe the factory underfilled by a little.  (I wonder if the factory procedures actually top it off after driving it a few minutes to get the air out of the internal volume.???)

Actually underfilling may have very little detrimental effect, since my observed FORScan temperature was 179 F in some hot-ish driving, nothing bad there.  I'll bet there is some tolerance to over-or-under-filling the thing.  As long as some is in there hitting the planetary gearset teeth, etc., then its lubed at least.

 

Anyway, a small amount of RTV silicone sealant on the drain plug threads and I carefully allen-wrenched the small non-magnetic drain plug back in.

There are a number of after-market Mercon LV type bottles available, but I decided to stick with exactly Motorcraft Mercon LV per spec, since I might be mixing some of the old Mercon LV in there with new Mercon LV and want full chemical and seal-swell compatibility guaranteed.

 

I'll fill it tomorrow probably, and am anxious to see how much fluid it takes back.  I'll do the minute driving thing to get it all circulated and then top it off again.

[MaxHeadroom]

I just checked, and noticed the 2013 C-Max owner's manual lists the transmission fluid capacity at 5.7 quarts, and the 2015 at 4.8 quarts, a difference which would explain why I drained out 3.5 quarts but the other reports from others here were more (ranged from 4.2 qts drained to 5 or so, on earlier 2013 models).

Maybe just getting out 3.5 quarts on mine isn't too unusual for a 2015 model.

 

However, after buying exactly 4 quarts of Motorcraft Mercon LV, I just put in 4 quarts, and it didn't fill it up!!!  I thought it would, since I drained out 3.5 quarts.  It was not full before I drained, and it still isn't quite full I guess. .... Temperature was about 80 degrees F, which is within the range of 68 deg F to 104 deg F as the desired fill temperature.

I'll let everything flow around in there for a while and check it & top it off later. 

 

I figure I have more than what Ford gave me at the factory anyway!!! (no leaks, really clean all around the seams and all bolts, so I blame the factory knuckleheads for underfilling it).  As mentioned earlier, transmission fluid temperature was observed to be 179 deg F in a hot-ish long trip with the old factory fill load, so its carrying away enough heat even running a bit low, and its got more in there now.  Proving that its not really that sensitive to being a quart or more low.

 

Little note about how to get fresh fluid in there:  I don't think you have to use plastic tubing like others have used on this task.  I just literally stuck a bottle tip in the Level Plug hole and squirted it all in, squeezing and mangling a differential oil container, but it worked fine with very little spillage (like only drops spilled).  .... I took the front driver side tire off (with the entire car on jack stands for leveling the whole body), removed the Level Plug (easy), and jammed the differential fluid bottle in there, with of course Mercon LV put inside the diff bottle.  (Do remember to empty any oil out of the differential oil bottle, and only use Mercon LV)

Here is the bottle I used:

[plus 3 golfer]

I have a 2014 Service Manual (dated January 2014) which shows dry fill capacity as 5.7 quarts which is consistent with the Owners Manual.  It would be interesting to know what the 2015 Service Manual says.  Maybe the 5.7 also includes the fluid in the cooler and lines and the 4.8 only includes the transmission.

[ptjones]

I have a 2014 Service Manual (dated January 2014) which shows dry fill capacity as 5.7 quarts which is consistent with the Owners Manual.  It would be interesting to know what the 2015 Service Manual says.  Maybe the 5.7 also includes the fluid in the cooler and lines and the 4.8 only includes the transmission.

I'm guessing you are right, it would be difficult to get all the oil out. :)

 

Paul

[MaxHeadroom]

I have a 2014 Service Manual (dated January 2014) which shows dry fill capacity as 5.7 quarts which is consistent with the Owners Manual.  It would be interesting to know what the 2015 Service Manual says.  Maybe the 5.7 also includes the fluid in the cooler and lines and the 4.8 only includes the transmission.

I checked both manuals (PDF files on the web), and Ford did make a funny change from 2013 to 2015 models.  2015 says 4.8 qts, and 2013 says 5.7, which is actually consistent with how much I drained out of my 2015-model vs. others who have reported on 2013-model drains.  The 2013 drains have been about a quart higher than what I drained out.   Maybe they changed a part somewhere, a casting, something internal, which changes the fluid capacity(??).  Dunno.

I put in about 1 quart less than stated official capacity, so I guess with what old fluid was stuck in there, I'm at least very close to full.  I'll check & top off later of course.

[cmax-nynj]

How did you clean the gear oil out from the bottle?

Edited July 7, 2018 by cmax-nynj

[obob]

How did you clean the gear oil out from the bottle?

 

I was thinking maybe a mustard/ketchup dispenser might work.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/8-24OZ-Plastic-Squeeze-Bottle-Condiment-Dispenser-Ketchup-Mustard-Sauce-Vinegar/361721619175?hash=item543849e2e7%3Am%3AmdgdaMkycHjrapG0N1LPlLQ&var=631034206682

[MaxHeadroom]

I recommend to anyone who has a C-Max to at least top it off after its a year old or so.  I still suspect the factory workers under-filled mine a bit. 

Certainly check for red fluid leaks underneath every time you change the oil and have the lower ground shield thingie off.

 

Then, changing it is so easy that you can replace whatever drains out every 100,000 miles instead of going 150,000 miles with a double-flush.  The idea is to replace the extreme-pressure (EP) additives in there as they age and chemically break down, and a big gulp of fresh fluid every 100,000 miles keeps those anti-wear addtives replaced nicely.

 

cmax-nynj:  On cleaning out the gear oil container before putting in Mercon LV, I don't think you have to.  About a half teaspon remains stuck in the bottle, not much.   

 

obob:   Mustard-Ketchup bottle would work, except I noticed the gear oil bottle was very flexible and tough, allowing one to get it empty without too much trouble.

A Mustard-Ketchup bottle might be too rigid(??).  ... Anything with a good pointed tip should be OK I guess.  You can still attach a small tube on the tip that fits in the Level Plug hole if you want to.

 

So far, I think I have noticed cooler transmission fluid temperature (TFT), by about 5 degrees or so cooler, as far as I can tell.  

Therefore, 5 degrees is about the difference 4 quarts put in to replace 3.5 quarts drained.  Likely the factory never filled it up all the way, but I guess a few degrees difference doesn't mean much.

[cmax-nynj]

Thanks for the information.  I took out the left wheel but I couldn't locate the middle check/fill plug.  A picture or guidance would be helpful.

[plus 3 golfer]

Thanks for the information.  I took out the left wheel but I couldn't locate the middle check/fill plug.  A picture or guidance would be helpful.

[cmax-nynj]

Thank you.  this even shows the torque spec which seems minimal

[MaxHeadroom]

Thank you.  this even shows the torque spec which seems minimal

That picture doesn't show it as a hexagonal head bolt which it is, but its in the right position. ... Also, it has a small plastic washer which you can add a very thin layer of RTV sealant to for extra sealing when you tighten it down.  

[cmax-nynj]

Thanks, I was able to find it easily. I think I can use a large syringe and insert fluid; or use a transmission funnel with a tubing.

[ptjones]

I decided to drain Trans Fluid and only got 3.5 Qts out. Have pics of my setup to put New Trans Fluid back in. I put 4 qts back in and it was full will some TF up my tube so I started ICE to circulate TF through cooling lines to get any air out.  It did lower enough so it wasn't coming out level hole, but just barely. :)

 

Paul

 

[MaxHeadroom]

I decided to drain Trans Fluid and only got 3.5 Qts out. Have pics of my setup to put New Trans Fluid back in. I put 4 qts back in and it was full will some TF up my tube so I started ICE to circulate TF through cooling lines to get any air out.  It did lower enough so it wasn't coming out level hole, but just barely. :)

Other 2013 models have gotten about 4 quarts to drain out.  I suspect, like my own 2015 model, that the factory didn't put in enough to be full.  Its probably not that sensitive to slightly lower levels anyway, so I guess no big deal if its up to about a quart low or so....  I still have yet to top mine off a bit.  I thought I'd wait for winter tire changeover in October when I have the whole car jacked up in the air.  (I drained out 3.5 qts and put 4.0 qts back in, so I guess its OK for now.)

[jmk]

Hi all - interesting thread. I was considering opening the lines at the trans cooler, and discharging in a bucket and using trans suction pressure to draw in new fluid, similar to my non-hybrid (sorry.) 2007 Fusion. I use a couple more qts that way, but eh/whatever. Does the CVT trans have a pump - in you opinion - that is capable of this discharge/draw flush method? TIA.

[jmk]

Ford manual on trans drain/fill. Measure what you take out. Do not fill past the fill plug. Skip the fancy Mytivac fill machine in the Ford manual. Use a long 3/16 hose and push in in to the fill port. Run it upward to a funnel. Put at least what you measured coming out back in to the trans. Then put some more until is runs out the fill port hole. Remove tube, put plug back. Next oil change, do it again and you should be pretty clean.

 

And with that, I'm outta here!

 

trans-drain-refill.pdf

[heyYoLetsGo]

Just did the job today, thought these pics may help. I followed the youtube video posted on the previous page, and I needed to look at a transmission that had been pulled out to get a better idea of where the fill plug I used was located. I also needed some pvc pipe for some leverage.

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2021 by heyYoLetsGo
tried to get the pictures in the correct order

[heyYoLetsGo]

[Lacienega]

What size of tube will fit good into the fill hole?

[homestead]

jmk above says "Use a long 3/16 hose and push in in to the fill port. "

 

The video on the first page says you can use a 1/2" hose to fill.

Edited January 11, 2023 by homestead

[Lacienega]

Just did my transmission fluid change at 148k miles and also got only 3.5L out of it, but had to fill it with 4.5L until it ran out of the level hole. (car was leveled) I wonder if it was low before ...but I don't see any leakage.

[nogoodbum]

To all who have noticed less fluid coming out than going in when they change their trans fluid please note that Motorcraft Mercon LV ATF [part# XT-10-QLV] is a petro based fluid, NOT SYNTHETIC. This means that there will be fluid loss due to higher temps over the life of the fluid due to "boil out" of the fluid over the life usage of the fluid. Just like usage of standard oil in the ICE that would lose  qt. between changes, no leaks or signs of oil burning but basically oil "boil out" over the 3-5K between oil changes. Owners manual calls for a trans fluid check at every ICE oil change & assume topping off for losses. Personally my car was down a pint after 100k but it is driven almost always in a low stress situations [hwy. 50-60mph, small town, no long traffic jams unless there's a wreak, little AC usage]. If you drive a lot in high stress/temp situations, it wouldn't hurt to be sure to check that fluid level at every oil change. The only real trouble with checking it is that ICE oil should be drained while hot [as I have understood it for 40+ yrs] & the trans fluid check should be done on a cooler [not cold] transmission. It does have chance to extend oil change time by a extra 15-30 minutes. Thanks for the read.