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am a bit disappointed


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26 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Britishrocco

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Posted 18 March 2017 - 06:54 PM

Hi all, I had my 2013 c-max since late January, and I am a bit disappointed. Seems like am not able to get more than low 30 mpg, I know it's cold outside here in Canada, and that I am on winter tire, but I was hoping for at least mid 30mpg in winter and low 40 in summer, not sure I'll be able to reach the 40's this summer. I am super slow on the throttle, and my brake score are always between 97-99%, also am not driving at speed more than 60mph on highway.

 

Like today, I was coming home, engine was hot, I was in EV+ mode since I was close to home, battery 3/4 full. Why the hell is the engine running, should I be in EV mode??, is it that it was 17 degree Fahrenheit outside??. I was doing like 20mph and even if I left the throttle the engine kept running...

 

thanks









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#2 OFFLINE   JohnnOhio

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Posted 18 March 2017 - 08:01 PM

Hi there

 

  I have 2013 SEL. I live in Central Ohio and my milage is in the upper thirties in the winter months also.

 I have found that 50 degrees is the magic number. Ounce the outside temp is 50 or above the milage jumps way up.

The attached photo is best I have been able to get. (33 miles on the freeway at 70 mph).

 

I see you where wondering why your engine was running even with 3/4 battery. My guess is the heater was on at the time. The engine has to run to warm up the coolant for the heater. I doesn't run all of the time but the colder it is the faster the radiator  is cooled down.

 

Hang in there

 

 

 

 

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#3 OFFLINE   obob

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 02:24 PM

Hi all, I had my 2013 c-max since late January, and I am a bit disappointed. Seems like am not able to get more than low 30 mpg, I know it's cold outside here in Canada, and that I am on winter tire, but I was hoping for at least mid 30mpg in winter and low 40 in summer, not sure I'll be able to reach the 40's this summer. I am super slow on the throttle, and my brake score are always between 97-99%, also am not driving at speed more than 60mph on highway.

 

Like today, I was coming home, engine was hot, I was in EV+ mode since I was close to home, battery 3/4 full. Why the hell is the engine running, should I be in EV mode??, is it that it was 17 degree Fahrenheit outside??. I was doing like 20mph and even if I left the throttle the engine kept running...

 

thanks

 

The car gets lower mileage in the very cold for the engine is not efficient unless it is warm.  There are message threads about covering up the grill to keep the engine warmer.  Also, the more the heater is used, the more the engine needs to run just to heat up the water for the heater.  It will try to utilize that work to recharge the battery, but once that is charged, like if the heater is set to a high temp in the very cold, the engine runs only to heat the water and so the car is more like a non-hybrid.  Also I find it important to go really soft on the acceleration in the cold when first starting out for when cold, the engine injects a very rich mixture (heavy on the gas) so the car does not stall when acceleration is needed.


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#4 OFFLINE   SnowStorm

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 03:08 PM

As much as possible, use Recirc(ulation).  It takes much less engine heat to heat, say, 60F air from inside the car than to heat 17F air from outside.  It can make a big difference in how much the engine has to run.  Switching to the OEM Michelin tires in summer will also help a lot.


Edited by SnowStorm, 19 March 2017 - 03:10 PM.

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#5 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 19 March 2017 - 03:15 PM

You need to go to the "How to improve winter MPG's" Thread to get all the info. :) http://fordcmaxhybri...e-winter-mpgs/  You should be able to get into the 40's mpg if you don't use you heater and follow the tips.  Snow tires you could be losing 2-3 mpg.

 

Paul


Edited by ptjones, 19 March 2017 - 03:18 PM.

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#6 OFFLINE   Britishrocco

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 01:23 PM

Thanks for the reply, fallowing JohnnOhio reply I shut the heater to off, before it was set to low, and I can see a difference. when you tell your mpg do you use the one on the instrument panel or your own calculation? cause my instrument panel says 36.2mpg, but if I use my fuelly app, am down to 32mpg...

 

for sure next winter, I will have a engine block heater and cover the grill. are you guys run the grill cover even in summer?

 

am sure on the long run I'll be able to get more mpg out of my C-max :)


Edited by Britishrocco, 20 March 2017 - 01:48 PM.


#7 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 09:14 AM

Thanks for the reply, fallowing JohnnOhio reply I shut the heater to off, before it was set to low, and I can see a difference. when you tell your mpg do you use the one on the instrument panel or your own calculation? cause my instrument panel says 36.2mpg, but if I use my fuelly app, am down to 32mpg...

 

for sure next winter, I will have a engine block heater and cover the grill. are you guys run the grill cover even in summer?

 

am sure on the long run I'll be able to get more mpg out of my C-max :)

I use mine all year around and only take lower one off when I know i'm going to be doing a lot of climbing. :)  I use Fuelly numbers and I think 4mpg is an excessive difference, usually 2mpg is the most. Are you running the ICE ahead of time before getting in the car? If so the computer doesn't count that amount. :sad:

 

Paul



#8 OFFLINE   Britishrocco

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 02:55 PM

I use mine all year around and only take lower one off when I know i'm going to be doing a lot of climbing. :)  I use Fuelly numbers and I think 4mpg is an excessive difference, usually 2mpg is the most. Are you running the ICE ahead of time before getting in the car? If so the computer doesn't count that amount. :sad:

 

Paul

No am not using the ice before I get in the car usually it's start and go. Sure my fuelly isn't accurate, since I've only had two fill-ups since I got the car. it's getting warmer up here and I can really see a difference, in two or three weeks I'll remove those winter rubber and put brand new LRR tire and am sure that too will make a difference. I'll try to block my middle grille too and leave it blocked for the summer as well. Not shooting for 60mpg but hope to get high 40's this summer.



#9 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 03:14 PM

No am not using the ice before I get in the car usually it's start and go. Sure my fuelly isn't accurate, since I've only had two fill-ups since I got the car. it's getting warmer up here and I can really see a difference, in two or three weeks I'll remove those winter rubber and put brand new LRR tire and am sure that too will make a difference. I'll try to block my middle grille too and leave it blocked for the summer as well. Not shooting for 60mpg but hope to get high 40's this summer.

You shouldn't have  any problems if you use 2 Bar accelerating method and EV to 15mph. 50psi on the tires if their Michelins. :)

 

Paul 


Edited by ptjones, 21 March 2017 - 03:14 PM.


#10 OFFLINE   joshg678

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Posted 22 March 2017 - 08:09 PM

I drive 13 miles each way to my work and the lowest I got was 39 mpg with the grill covers. I think it was 9f degrees that morning and I had the heat blasting at 74F
I always use recirculate.

Really wish the Hybrid had electric heater like the Energi that would be used in tandem with engine for heat. I think that would be effective. And or a heat pump setup.

#11 OFFLINE   nsteblay

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Posted 22 March 2017 - 09:54 PM

I live in Minnesota and have a 2013 SEL.  I have about 100K on the car.  My lifetime average is 42 MPG but my average for the last 3 years is almost 44 MPG.  In the dead of winter I get low to mid thirties.  Once it warms up I get mid to upper 40's.  Not unusual to have days where I'm over 50.  

 

You can customize the left gauge so that you can see engine temperature.  Do that in conjunction with Empower.  You can then see why the engine is running.

 

I just bought my second CMax, a 2016 SE.  I tried out the competing hybrids but none had the combination of power, comfort and MPG that I get in the CMax.  It has been the perfect commute car for me.  I've saved 1000's on gas with no compromises in performance.  

 

I use an OBD II adapter (Automatic) that records all my trips.  I'll pull my records from last year and correlate with average temperature.  I can produce a regression to show the correlation between temperature and mileage.  I did this once before a year or two ago and posted it.

 

The other big factor is average MPH for a trip.  If your trips are predominantly high speed freeway your MPG average will be lower.  


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#12 OFFLINE   stolenmoment

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Posted 23 March 2017 - 06:53 AM

Josh, the "electric" heater in the Energi isn't of any real use except for a go-time when plugged in to 220v; it cuts the electric range in half.  I just don't use it.  If I really need the heat, I'll burn some gas, but even today (10F) the seat heater was enough.  My commute is short enough that if I run the motor at all, it's on for more than half the trip before the software will turn it back off...



#13 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 23 March 2017 - 09:23 AM

cmax grill cover1
Here is my graph again showing MPG's vs temp with and without Grill Covers. :)
 
Paul


#14 OFFLINE   fbov

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Posted 23 March 2017 - 10:17 PM

Here's some data regarding temperature dependence of mileage.
 
Tank average over a couple years form Fuelly. Note that Jan-Mar 2014 was all highway driving, averaging about 30 MPG. In 2015, I took a lower speed route. I wasn't as warm (heat ran the engine, so I was a bit chilly), but the car got 35 MPG. Note that 50 MPG wasn't hard to get once things warmed up. 
Porter Fuelly Track.jpg
 
Here's some long term data on a standard commuting route. It compares snow tires (Xice 3) vs. OEM summer tires (no difference ) and shows a very wide range of temperature. 
MPG v Temp rural thru winter 150229.jpg
 
You'll have no worries come June... that's when I got my 700 mile tank. Just block grills, use the OEM tires, and at 45-50 psi. 
 
Have fun,
Frank

Edited by fbov, 23 March 2017 - 10:24 PM.

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#15 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 24 March 2017 - 08:38 AM

How much do you think the Grill Covers are helping? :)

 

Paul



#16 OFFLINE   Britishrocco

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Posted 24 March 2017 - 01:21 PM

Thanks all for your inputs, put some homemade grille cover yesterday, sure it's gone help, also just find out that the max already have a block heater :D.

 

nsteblay: I also found that the C-max offer best of both world, don't get me wrong, I love my max, am just a bit disappointed of my mpg right now, but am still learning how to drive it, once I figure it out, I'll get the max mpg out of it.



#17 OFFLINE   nsteblay

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Posted 24 March 2017 - 06:01 PM

It will come around when it gets warm.  Your overall yearly average will be decent.



#18 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 07:07 PM

Thanks all for your inputs, put some homemade grille cover yesterday, sure it's gone help, also just find out that the max already have a block heater :D.

 

nsteblay: I also found that the C-max offer best of both world, don't get me wrong, I love my max, am just a bit disappointed of my mpg right now, but am still learning how to drive it, once I figure it out, I'll get the max mpg out of it.

Are you using the 2BAR acceleration Rule and EV upto 15mph? :)

 

Paul



#19 OFFLINE   C-MaxSea

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 03:30 PM

I live in Minnesota and have a 2013 SEL.  I have about 100K on the car.  My lifetime average is 42 MPG but my average for the last 3 years is almost 44 MPG.  In the dead of winter I get low to mid thirties.  Once it warms up I get mid to upper 40's.  Not unusual to have days where I'm over 50.  
 
You can customize the left gauge so that you can see engine temperature.  Do that in conjunction with Empower.  You can then see why the engine is running.
 
I just bought my second CMax, a 2016 SE.  I tried out the competing hybrids but none had the combination of power, comfort and MPG that I get in the CMax.  It has been the perfect commute car for me.  I've saved 1000's on gas with no compromises in performance.  
 

I use an OBD II adapter (Automatic) that records all my trips.  I'll pull my records from last year and correlate with average temperature.  I can produce a regression to show the correlation between temperature and mileage.  I did this once before a year or two ago and posted it.
 
The other big factor is average MPH for a trip.  If your trips are predominantly high speed freeway your MPG average will be lower.

 

Great testament to the prowess of the C-Max 'design' & 'build' - still nothing 'better' all around.

 

Ironically, we get better gas mileage on the 'freeway' than the city.  Simple reason is that our city driving is mostly 5 mile 'cold start' trips - and our 'freeway' runs mostly 50 miles round trip with 'warm' ICE in 60 MPH speed zones.   ;)


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#20 OFFLINE   fbov

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Posted 26 March 2017 - 07:16 PM

How much do you think the Grill Covers are helping? :)

 

Paul

Well, the baseline period is the first couple months, before any car mods, or the PCM upgrade. My take was that a subtle change in driver operation was the biggest source of better mileage.

- Baseline is done with a 2-bar limit as long as HVB is charging. 

- The other data uses a lower burn for longer time, so the HVB charges deeper and lasts longer while running ICE closer to optimum. 

 

You still can't fool Mother Nature!

 

Frank








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