Jump to content

Custom Search




Welcome to the C-MAX Hybrid Forum


Sign In  Log in with Facebook

Create Account
Welcome to the C-MAX Hybrid Forum. You must register to create topics or post in our community, but don't worry this is a simple free process that requires minimal information for you to signup. Here's some member benefits:
  • Start new topics and reply to others
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get email updates
  • Get your own profile page and make new friends
  • Send personal messages to other members
  • Create photo albums and post images. . .more!
Click here to create an account now
 
Guest Message by DevFuse

Get you C-MAX Hybrid Registered in the official Ford Authorized Registry. More here.


Photo

Battery degradation


  • Please log in to reply
4 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   LeoNicholson

LeoNicholson

    New Member

  • C-MAX Hybrid Member
  • 9 posts
  • Region:U.S. Mississippi Valley
  • LocationHattiesburg, MS
  • My C-MAX's Year:2015
  • Current Vehicle:C-Max SEL

Posted 10 October 2018 - 01:37 PM

We have a 2015 SEL hybrid (39K miles). Was wondering about what to expect for impact upon the traction battery and overall mpg over time. I understand that the car should function for quite awhile, even as the battery degrades.









Lose this advertisement by becoming a member. Click here to create a free account.


#2 OFFLINE   Plus 3 Golfer

Plus 3 Golfer

    C-Max Hybrid Member

  • C-MAX Hybrid Member
  • 1,998 posts
  • Region:Decline
  • Location"Valley of the Sun" - AZ
  • My C-MAX's Year:2013
  • Current Vehicle:2013

Posted 10 October 2018 - 03:08 PM

See this thread.  IMO, when looking at the INL voltage vs Ah HVB capacity curves (see first chart below),  I wouldn't expect much, if any, loss in the ability to use the HVB available Ah / kWh capacity in the hybrid HVB over the same range for several 100 k miles. The yellow line is data at 160k miles. Thus, FE should not be affected as the HVB loses "normal" capacity.  If you look at the curves, the bulk of the lost capacity is at the far right of the curve or where the knee of the curve is.  In the operating voltage range of the HVB about 30% to 70% SOC (about 272 V to 295 V), the voltage of the different mileage curves are virtually the same.  In addition, 272V is still rather far away from the knee of the curve.  It would take more degradation to reach the knee where I assume the control algorithms would trigger DTCs and not allow the car to start (failed HVB?).  We also do not know whether the algorithms might adjust the minimum votage upwards to accommodate degradation.

 

I also plotted my HVB data at 103k miles from a test run of 57 miles to see how it compared to the INL data (see second chart below).  My data seems in line with the INL data.

 

 

Attached File  INL HVB.JPG   32.38KB   0 downloads

Attached File  MY HVB vs INL.JPG   105.01KB   1 downloads


Edited by Plus 3 Golfer, 10 October 2018 - 05:58 PM.

  • obob and LeoNicholson like this

#3 OFFLINE   LeoNicholson

LeoNicholson

    New Member

  • C-MAX Hybrid Member
  • 9 posts
  • Region:U.S. Mississippi Valley
  • LocationHattiesburg, MS
  • My C-MAX's Year:2015
  • Current Vehicle:C-Max SEL

Posted 10 October 2018 - 10:08 PM

Many thanks.

Good to know.

I would think this would also apply to the Energi as the larger battery degrades and it operates more as the Hybrid (with 800# of additional weight).


Edited by LeoNicholson, 10 October 2018 - 10:19 PM.


#4 OFFLINE   Plus 3 Golfer

Plus 3 Golfer

    C-Max Hybrid Member

  • C-MAX Hybrid Member
  • 1,998 posts
  • Region:Decline
  • Location"Valley of the Sun" - AZ
  • My C-MAX's Year:2013
  • Current Vehicle:2013

Posted 11 October 2018 - 01:02 AM

The Energi HVB has over 5X the energy storage as the Hybrid and the INL data for Energi test vehicles shows around 2X the degradation %.  Lastly, the Energi operates over a SOC % range that is about 2X wider.  Thus, when the Energi loses capacity, the lost capacity reduces the usable energy available for EV now operation and EV range is reduced. 

 

For example, the Energi 7.6 kWh of capacity operates down to about 20% SOC in EV mode. or down to 1.5 kWh. Then, about 40% of the Hybrid 1.4 kWh or about 0.6 kWh would be reserved for Hybrid operation which leaves about 5.5 kWh for EV range: (5.5  = 7.6 - 1.5 - 0.6). The 5.5 kWh is about what most see on their Energi when new.  So, a 10.5% loss in capacity (about a 0.8 kWh loss) would reduce the 5.5 kWh for EV only to 4.7 kWh.  EV only range has dropped about 15%.  If one was getting 25 miles of range, one would now gets about 20 miles of EV. 


Edited by Plus 3 Golfer, 12 October 2018 - 04:36 PM.

  • obob likes this

#5 OFFLINE   ptjones

ptjones

    C-Max Hybrid Member

  • C-MAX Hybrid Platinum Member
  • 3,632 posts
  • Region:U.S. Southern Atlantic
  • LocationNewnan, GA
  • My C-MAX's Year:2013
  • Current Vehicle:2013 C-MAX SEL

Posted 11 October 2018 - 11:21 AM

From what I have seen with 212k mi. on my CMAX is very little if any loss of MPG's and I think the reason is that normal usage range is between 40-50% SOC so a drop in capacity of HVB would really no effect on MPG's. :)

 

Paul 








Custom Search




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Privacy Policy TERMS OF SERVICE ·