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Guest Message by DevFuse

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CMAX Grill Cover Testing, 2-5 MPG Gain

MPG grill cover test

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244 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 08:19 PM

Here are the the facts from all the testing been doing.

 

1. FORD said in Hotline Assistance Request that The Approx. engine Operating Temp should be 202-212deg.F

 

2. The best MPG temp range is 202-230deg.F

 

3. Starting with cold ICE and outside temp from 37-70deg.F driving hwy loop of 14.1mi you gain average of 4.MPG with Grill Covers on vs off.

 

4. 3-4MPG gain city driving.  The Grill Covers heat up ICE quicker and keep it warmer than without Grill Covers. There is about a 30-40deg.F WT difference with Grill Covers on and off. Even at 70deg.F outside temp I could only get to 200deg.F occasionally and most of the time 180-190deg.F. range.

 

5. The Grill Covers really helps short trips 3-10mi because of short heat up time for ICE. Adding oil pan heater improves MPG's another 2mpg.

 

6. Because shutters open when the CMAX is stopped Grill Covers keep ICE warmer longer than without.

 

As more people get experience with Grill Covers we will add more Post.


Edited by ptjones, 21 January 2014 - 03:25 PM.








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#2 OFFLINE   zhackwyatt

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:37 PM

So to repeat something I think you have said before.  The covers are much more about the temperature than the aerodynamics of the car?



#3 OFFLINE   C-MaxJaxon

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 09:49 PM

This looks more like a fish story all the time. We're up to 5 MPG now? Next week it will be 6, and maybe 7 or 8 in a couple weeks. Where will it end? ;)



#4 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 10:04 PM

So to repeat something I think you have said before.  The covers are much more about the temperature than the aerodynamics of the car?

People are finding 2 mpg is an aerodynamic improvement, 3 mpg is a temperature improvement.

 

This looks more like a fish story all the time. We're up to 5 MPG now? Next week it will be 6, and maybe 7 or 8 in a couple weeks. Where will it end? ;)

If you look at the graph the information was there all the time.

cmax grill cover1


#5 OFFLINE   F8L

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Posted 16 January 2013 - 11:14 PM

I'm still learning about the CMAX so I'm a little foggy on the particulars but are you also monitoring inverter and electric motor temps? Is the grille block easy to remove on the side of the road in the event you forget to remove it before a long trip?

#6 OFFLINE   CNCGeek

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 04:11 AM

I'm still learning about the CMAX so I'm a little foggy on the particulars but are you also monitoring inverter and electric motor temps? Is the grille block easy to remove on the side of the road in the event you forget to remove it before a long trip?

This would be my concern as well, the inverter temps and the motor temps with the covers installed. 

 

I think the covers are secured with velcro so that would seem pretty easy to remove - but I wonder about stowing the covers in the back on a long trip if it is packed full-o-stuff.



#7 OFFLINE   F8L

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:06 AM

This would be my concern as well, the inverter temps and the motor temps with the covers installed. 
 
I think the covers are secured with velcro so that would seem pretty easy to remove - but I wonder about stowing the covers in the back on a long trip if it is packed full-o-stuff.


That sounds easy enough to remove. I asked because I made a trip from Sacramento to LA and forgot about the grille block on my car. While speeding up the grapevine at 80+mph I noticed my engine temp had climbed up to 211F! In a Prius is normally doesn't go any higher than 198F (191F is normal) and that is with full grille block. 211F is way too high. I immediately pulled over and removed the ugly foam we use as a block. Emergency removal is important. ;)

I would find out where the radiator for the inverter is. That will help determine how much grille blocking will impact temps.

Does the Torque app have the PIDs for the CMAX yet? That is how I was able to monitor all of my temps while testing. My Scangauge is too old to do this as it has not been updated since 2005.

#8 ONLINE   Plus 3 Golfer

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:46 AM

There is a dual cooler located behind the lower grill on the C-Max for the CVT and inverter.


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#9 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:06 AM

This would be my concern as well, the inverter temps and the motor temps with the covers installed. 

 

I think the covers are secured with velcro so that would seem pretty easy to remove - but I wonder about stowing the covers in the back on a long trip if it is packed full-o-stuff.

The cover have velcro on them so they will stick on the back of seat and not take any space. They are made of Polycarbonate very durable plastic. They can take some abuse, rocks.

 

There is a dual cooler located behind the lower grill on the C-Max for the CVT and inverter.

Is that separate from the radiator? It looks like it is going to the radiator. 



#10 ONLINE   Plus 3 Golfer

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 11:33 AM

The cover have velcro on them so they will stick on the back of seat and not take any space. They are made of Polycarbonate very durable plastic. They can take some abuse, rocks.

 

Is that separate from the radiator? It looks like it is going to the radiator.

 


To confirm everything I'd have to remove the bottom belly cover and look.

 

Looking at the parts diagrams, there is a separate CVT cooler which looks to be behind the lower front grill. There also are 3 electric coolant pumps, - one for the engine (shown in another diagram), one (8C419B) not sure what for yet (possibly for heater core, electric motor) and one for the inverter (8C419A). The one for the inverter appears to be connected to the CVT cooler. Note on the CVT cooler diagram there appears to be a visible coolant connection above the CVT connection. Again, this needs to be verified by pulling the lower cover off and tracing the coolant lines.

 

 

 


Edited by Plus 3 Golfer, 19 January 2013 - 08:38 AM.

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#11 OFFLINE   C-MaxJaxon

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 11:54 AM

Here is someone who is trying the foam block method. The only potential problem I see is the wind pressure at 70+ MPH (worse with a head wind) could push the blocks out the back if they aren't fit very tightly.

 

http://www.cleanmpg....ad.php?p=368345



#12 OFFLINE   PWBarrett

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 03:28 PM

Hey, Plus 3 Golfer - 

Where'd you find a shop manual for a C-Max?  On the Motorcraft site, the closest I've seen is for a Focus Electric.

 



#13 ONLINE   Plus 3 Golfer

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Posted 19 January 2013 - 05:28 PM

Hey, Plus 3 Golfer - 
Where'd you find a shop manual for a C-Max?  On the Motorcraft site, the closest I've seen is for a Focus Electric.

The manual is a parts on-line manual at ford parts.com not a shop manual.
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#14 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 20 January 2013 - 02:08 PM

The manual is a parts on-line manual at ford parts.com not a shop manual.

I checked my inverter coolant lines after a trip by putting my hand on it and it  was cold. Good Job Plus 3 Golfer.


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#15 OFFLINE   Roger Eastman

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 11:10 AM

I wonder if they have changed the active grille shutters since the start of production on the C-Max Hybrid. My SEL was built on 1- 4- 2013 and the grille shutters can completely close off the entire lower and the middle grille components.


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#16 OFFLINE   C-MaxJaxon

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 11:25 AM

The window sticker shows mine was built in late July. It looked like the middle and lower grilles on my car would be covered by the shutters.



#17 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 05:53 PM

I wonder if they have changed the active grille shutters since the start of production on the C-Max Hybrid. My SEL was built on 1- 4- 2013 and the grille shutters can completely close off the entire lower and the middle grille components.

 

The window sticker shows mine was built in late July. It looked like the middle and lower grilles on my car would be covered by the shutters.

They are closed but there not air tight. The ICE warms up about twice as fast with Grill Covers on. The idea was good but doesn't work as well as intended. I noticed all fusion's have shutters. I'm going to be testing Fusion Hybrid tomorrow with my Grill Covers.


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#18 OFFLINE   donhak

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 09:31 PM

It they were easier to get at, it would be interesting to see if just adding some door insulating tape along the edges would help the shutters to seal tighter.  I think your Grill Covers would be great for Alaska.  When the engine is running to both charge the battery and warm the engine, instantaneous mileage can be under 20 mpg.  We are due to get below zero this weekend and could definitely use them then.



#19 OFFLINE   ptjones

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:18 PM

It they were easier to get at, it would be interesting to see if just adding some door insulating tape along the edges would help the shutters to seal tighter.  I think your Grill Covers would be great for Alaska.  When the engine is running to both charge the battery and warm the engine, instantaneous mileage can be under 20 mpg.  We are due to get below zero this weekend and could definitely use them then.

I don't know where all the leakage comes from but the covers do the job. They also keep snow out of grills. Set My View to impower on left side and water temp gauge on right. The first line is 140deg.F the middle is 180-216+deg.F. 206deg. is ideal for best MPG's.



#20 OFFLINE   OreeGoing

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 06:40 PM

I tried something different for closing the grill openings.

The cure all Duct Tape!

Half width fits between the grill members and black is hardly noticeable.

 

I have been driving this way for several days and am amazed that the duct tape strips are staying put!

I have seen my mpg go up, but since it has also warmed some here I cannot say exactly how much.

I left the top slot open but covered the rest including the lower all black grill.

Checking the water temperature it still is below 1/2 on the gauge often, so maybe I can do more, but am being cautious.

 

Attached File  IMG_7007s.jpg   136.4KB   57 downloadsAttached File  IMG_7008s.jpg   127.99KB   54 downloads


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