Is FORD Tracking our Driving Data?

[aschofer]

Read an interesting piece today called "Drive into the Future" in the Wall Street Journal and wondered if FORD is tracking our driving.

 

An excerpt from the article "Drive into the Future"

Privacy vs. Convenience

In the coming years, auto makers like Ford, Audi AG NSU.XE +0.34% and others see even more potential in big data. They envision taking information from customers' typical driving patterns, schedules and movements on the road to recommend routes the drivers might feel more comfortable with, either because they prefer city streets to freeways or don't respond well to bumper-to-bumper traffic.

[valkraider]

Yes.

 

Especially if you have an Energi.

 

Everything is tracked anymore, this very website is heavily tracked. The linked article at WSJ contains many trackers. Cities track your license plates as you move through intersections. Banks track debit cards and credit cards. Google searches and XBox games are tracked. Phone calls are monitored and your cell phone is tracked. Internet providers monitor your connection. Your TV habits are tracked by your cable or dish supplier. Stores track your buying history.

 

And all these databases are sold and traded and correlated and combined.

 

Welcome to 2013.

 

Your best bet for no tracking is never use electronics, only drive old cars and change plates regularly or walk/bicycle everywhere, and only use cash, wear a hoodie or hat to help with facial recognition but change it often to help with pattern recognition. And for heck sake stay off the phone.

[C-MaxJaxon]

The article is available online. [A thank you goes to the power of Google phrase searching]

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323951904578287783822442890.html

[aschofer]

valkraider, following your argument, I guess you are comfortable with the fact that FORD is tracking you. I for one would like to be asked for my permission. It's analogous to having an electronic bracelet strapped to your leg. I seem to recall that vendors usually ask for your permission to provide your private data to other companies. Don't recall being asked the same thing from FORD unless it was buried in the fine print on all of those forms you sign when you purchase a vehicle.

[valkraider]

I never said I was OK with it, I am merely showing it is a trade off.

 

If you want the toys, the consequences come with them.

 

For the enhanced MyFordMobile, SyncMyRide and other services you agree when you sign up. As far as the forms when you buy the car, it's possible: caveat emptor!

 

As far as "asking for your permission" I am not sure that's even required. Black boxes have been on vehicles for a decade or more, and soon will be required by law. They have already started showing up in court cases. The black boxes track more and more info each model advancement.

 

Additionally, any car with mapping software has GPS logs which track your movements and those are showing up in court cases as well.

 

Personally I don't enjoy the tracking/logging but I enjoy the cars and phones and data more. I choose to give up some of my movements data in exchange for some fun services. If you don't like it, drive a 1974 Nova and change your plates after you pass through an intersection... ;)

 

There are so many places people just click or tap "OK" without reading that I bet we all have agreed to some crazy things...

[wamba2000]

aschofer, it is really difficult to be "off the grid" with all the electronic transactions and devices that we use.  Data is king, that is why Google has made $$ by search capabilities and manipulating that data.

 

None of us likes the fact of being tracked or our data being used to spy on us or sell us stuff. 

 

As valkraider said, the ability to track is buried in the small print when you agree to the use of services/devices.  The only alternative is to not use the electronics. Sad but true.

[PWBarrett]

Part of me hopes the are tracking C-Max driving patterns - maybe they'll come up with better ways of dealing with real-world driving scenarios, like +70 MPH.

[aschofer]

So you don't mind if FORD sells your driving record/history to:

a. your automobile insurance company and they decide to increase your insurance rates becuase you speed, park in bad areas, frequent the local drinking establishment or drive more annually than reported?

b. companies who resell your personal travel habits to anyone interested in tracking you on a daily, weekly, monthly basis?

c. people who might want to know when you are not at home?

[DaveofDurham]

Today's Raleigh News & Observer reprinted a recent Washington Post article on this subject.  The Post article, "Web-connected cars bring privacy concerns", is at

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/web-connected-cars-bring-privacy-concerns/2013/03/05/d935d990-80ea-11e2-a350-49866afab584_story.html?wp_login_redirect=0

 

 

Also by the same Washington Post writer, "Google is nearing a deal in which it would pay $7 million to resolve investigations with more than 30 state attorneys general over its controversial Street View program, in which it captured data from private WiFi signals while taking street-level images throughout the world, said a person familiar with the looming agreement."  Full article at.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/google-nearing-7-million-settlement/2013/03/08/8e212c9e-8832-11e2-9d71-f0feafdd1394_story.html

[aschofer]

DaveofDurham: Thanks for the link to the Raleigh News & Observer article. I like the fact that someone is taking notice and trying to protect our privacy, from the article "In the United States, proposed new federal highway safety rules would require all new cars by 2014 to come equipped with “black boxes” to save vehicle information from the final seconds before and after crashes. The plan has prompted several privacy groups to lobby for an explicit declaration that data produced by a vehicle is owned by the motorist, with authorities having access only under certain conditions."

 

As we all know, if we stay silent, we won't like the result.

[aschofer]

DaveofDurham: Here's another great quote from that article in the Raleigh News & Observer article "“People are being duped into giving away a whole lot of information that maybe somebody ought to ask us about first,” said Dorothy J. Glancy, a Santa Clara University law professor who studies privacy and transportation. “It seems to me you ought to get a choice.”

[valkraider]

Who said they don't mind?

 

What people have said is that it is now a reality of technology.

 

People make a choice: is the technology worth the risk?

 

However, I am pretty sure that if Ford (why do people all caps FORD, it's not an acronym - it's a guys name...) were to start selling our data to those other interests and it hits the press that Ford will instantly lose sales.

 

Also - it can be disconnected if you really care. It is a subscription service.

[PWBarrett]

If you've got the hybrid rather than the Energi, there's no mechanism for Ford or anyone to do real-time tracking of the car.  GPS is receive-only.  I suppose the car could buffer up a lot of location data, and send it if/when you ever did a (user-initiated) health-report.

Really, if that sort of thing worries you, I'd be much more concerned about using Google Navigation or that sort of thing - they really do track in real-time - where do you think their traffic congestion data and estimated trip times come from?

[zhackwyatt]

If you've got the hybrid rather than the Energi, there's no mechanism for Ford or anyone to do real-time tracking of the car. GPS is receive-only. I suppose the car could buffer up a lot of location data, and send it if/when you ever did a (user-initiated) health-report.

Really, if that sort of thing worries you, I'd be much more concerned about using Google Navigation or that sort of thing - they really do track in real-time - where do you think their traffic congestion data and estimated trip times come from?

The car can connect to a Wi-Fi access point. I haven't figured out why yet. But you must do so manually, it doesn't automatically connect to them.

 

I doubt that is being used for tracking because no one will ever connect it.

 

Those with State Farm insurance are able to use sync similar to the progressive snapshot discount. http://www.statefarm.com/insurance/auto_insurance/drive-safe-save/sync.asp It says you need an active Sync subscription, so I'm assuming they are talking about sync services. Sync services requires a phone call from your phone, so every time you use sync services it must be passing some data back and forth??

Edited March 13, 2013 by zhackwyatt

[roninsd]

If it works like it does with OnStar, you give SF permission to access your mileage (odometer) to check how far you've gone in the period since the last check.  You give permission by signing up for this discount program.  You can either send the mileage manually, at their website, or give them permission to access the info vi OnStar (and Sync?).

[JAZ]

Additionally:

State Farm says the program, dubbed Drive Safe and Save, allows for a more

accurate calculation of risk, by way of a small device added to a vehicle's

diagnostic port that tracks real-time driver behavior. Factors such as speed,

mileage, lane changes, location, time of day and braking urgency are measured.

Edited March 13, 2013 by JAZ

[zhackwyatt]

If it works like it does with OnStar, you give SF permission to access your mileage (odometer) to check how far you've gone in the period since the last check.  You give permission by signing up for this discount program.  You can either send the mileage manually, at their website, or give them permission to access the info vi OnStar (and Sync?).

Right, but my question and discussion was how exactly State Farm got this info from the car because the car does not have a 3G modem in it like OnStar cars do.

 

 

Additionally:

State Farm says the program, dubbed Drive Safe and Save, allows for a more

accurate calculation of risk, by way of a small device added to a vehicle's

diagnostic port that tracks real-time driver behavior. Factors such as speed,

mileage, lane changes, location, time of day and braking urgency are measured.

I'm not sure where you got that quote, but from what I can tell, that's if you choose the InDrive module to plug-in.  Using Sync, it simply looks at number of miles driven.

[JAZ]

Right, but my question and discussion was how exactly State Farm got this info from the car because the car does not have a 3G modem in it like OnStar cars do.

 

 

I'm not sure where you got that quote, but from what I can tell, that's if you choose the InDrive module to plug-in.  Using Sync, it simply looks at number of miles driven.

You're correct:  I was referring to the optional plug-in device.  I can't find detailed info on what SYNC provides other than miles driven.

[rtshinn]

If they are using my Nav system to track me, they'll never find me.

It's consistently off by 1/10 mile, as much as 1/2 mile.

[aschofer]

Excerpts below from an article titled "Black Boxes are in 96% of new cars" from USA Today on 6th January 2013,

 

If you happen to read every word of your new car owner's manual, then you already know that your car may be monitoring your driving habits.

 

If you're like most people on the planet, though, it will come as a surprise that a box the size of a deck of cards — called an event data recorder — is on board, tracking your seat belt use, speed, steering, braking and at least a dozen other bits of data. When your air bag deploys, the EDR's memory records a few seconds before, during and after a crash, much like an airliner's "black box."

 

This a handy tool for analyzing the cause and effect of crashes. It can be used to improve safety technology. But its presence is not entirely benign. The data have many other potential uses — for insurance companies, lawyers and police, for instance — and it's up for grabs.

 

The EDR is the only part of your car that you don't necessarily own. Just 13 states have laws on the issue, and fewer — Oregon and North Dakota, for example — offer strong privacy protection. The devices, part of a car's electronic system, are almost impossible to remove.

 

Last month, the federal government proposed that all new passenger vehicles be equipped with the devices. But 96% of new cars already have them, as do at least 150 million older vehicles. American makers, led by GM and Ford, have been putting them in cars since the mid-1990s.

 

What the federal government ought to do is ensure that car buyers get prominent disclosure before they buy and that privacy protections are in place. But the trend is in the opposite direction.

In 2006, when the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration first proposed regulating black boxes, it rejected calls for pre-purchase disclosure and opted for requiring a few obscure paragraphs in the owner's manual. It gave car makers six years to comply.