ptjones Posted January 23, 2014 Report Share Posted January 23, 2014 My MPG's have gone up about 2MPG with the addition of NAPA oil pan heater. I plugin at home and at work and I'm averaging 51-52mpg with temps around low 30's. With speeds in the 40-55mph. I currently also have Grill Covers,GasPods and wheel covers on MADMAX. Those with block heaters really got it made by adding Oil Pan Heater, because you can maybe get to the magic 128*F WT and be able to go into EV mode quickly and save more gas. :) Paul salsaguy and drdiesel1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted January 24, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Filled up last night and got 49.6mpg, 618mi and 12.46gal. Oil Pan Heater has made a real difference with the cold temps we been having. :happy feet: Paul salsaguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catsailor Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 could you link us to where you bought it and any installation pics or details please. thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted January 25, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 It's a KAT's Heaters NAPA #24150 and there is a pic in my galley taken from the front of the car with cover lowered. Need to make sure oil pan is clean with alcohol or acetone and make sure you install it like I did. You need to bend it around oil pan. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmax-nynj Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 How much electricity does it consume to achieve 2MPG? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted January 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 How much electricity does it consume to achieve 2MPG?150 watts Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdbob Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 150 watts Paul For how long? 1 second, 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day? I'm sure cmax-nynj was expecting the answer in kWh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted January 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 For how long? 1 second, 1 minute, 1 hour, 1 day? I'm sure cmax-nynj was expecting the answer in kWh.Sorry, sometimes 2hrs, all nite and 2-6hrs at work. Not much more than a light bulb. LOL Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmax-nynj Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 The reason I was asking is because electricity is more than $.20/kw where I am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted January 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 The reason I was asking is because electricity is more than $.20/kw where I am. Also you would be able to use your heater sooner. It's better for your ICE to have harm oil than cold. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdbob Posted January 26, 2014 Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 Sorry, sometimes 2hrs, all nite and 2-6hrs at work. Not much more than a light bulb. LOL Paul I wonder if those heaters have thermostats built in? Do they take the same amount of power continuously or do they start to cycle on and off once they reach a certain temperature. Might be interesting to plug it into a Kill-A-Watt meter and see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted January 26, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2014 I wonder if those heaters have thermostats built in? Do they take the same amount of power continuously or do they start to cycle on and off once they reach a certain temperature. Might be interesting to plug it into a Kill-A-Watt meter and see.They are on all the time that they are plugged in, no thermostat, don't need one. My WT is about 25*F Warmer than what my garage temp is. WT sensor is at the top of ICE and oil pan is at the bottom. I'm guessing the oil pan is 50-60*F warmer. The ideal situation would be to have block heater to and I might do that in the future. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted June 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2014 I installed Wolverine Model #9 oil pan heater and it is a nice fit, just the right size. I tried to install the Ford ICE Block Heater, but couldn't because exhaust manifold is in the way of doing It. I will have to read up on how much trouble it is to remove it before I decide to go farther. I expect 3-4mpg improvement on short trips by using both heaters. :) Paul C-MaxSea 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbov Posted September 19, 2014 Report Share Posted September 19, 2014 It's getting cold, so time to get serious about this. I've looked at the oil pan heaters, including Paul's pics, and with apologies to Paul, it's a sub-optimal solution compared with anything that heats coolant. I finally found what I wanted by searchingr "circulation heaters." Here's a couple manufacturer options:http://www.fivestarmanufacturing.com/kat_shttp://phillipsandtemro.com/catalog/index.asp The first link (Kat's) has a nice summary of automotive drivetrain heaters. Scroll down to radiator hose to see what I'm considering.On the second link, look in the 2014 catalog, starting on page 77, for a different product line that does the same thing. Not surprisingly, Prius owners have already been here, albeit perhaps for different reasons. The third post has some heat-rise data indicating a quick rise, about 12F/hour, for a small unit, albeit on a 45F day. May be different at -10F... all the units have overtemp thermostats, so it's possible he maxed out at a 33F rise, but being coolant, that's the temp of the entire engine, not just the oil. So... what do you all think? HAve fun,Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plus 3 golfer Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 Agree. IMO, a "circulating" coolant heater is the way to go for a better solution / performance. But it will likely require understanding the C-Max cooling system so as not to restrict flow, hoses with proper bends, a pump / heater that will last and so forth. There's an outfit (FrostHeater) that provides kits for VWs. If I lived in a very cold climate, I'd probably make a custom system for my C-Max. Here's snippets of the HEV coolant components. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted September 22, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 Plus 3 Golfer Thanks for the input. I'm not sure where to put it so there would be circulation into the block. I like the block heater because it doesn't restrict the flow of coolant, but it is going to be a pain to install. Oil pan heater is a no brainier to install, anyone can do it. IMO :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbov Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 (edited) ...it will likely require understanding the C-Max cooling system so as not to restrict flow, hoses with proper bends, a pump / heater that will last and so forth. ...The big ones have a circulation pump, but I'm considering one of the passive hose heaters, which are also lower power (600W). For them, I'm just seeing a heating element in the water flow (the units are directional from what I gather), and will assume the vendor has designed it for reliable use in this application, thus the overtemp thermostat. The one caveat in the installation instruction is to place it where the radiator hose is tilted upward, and after any bends that might harbor an air pocket. Both are just good practice, but bear repeating. Thanks for checking it out! Have fun,Frank Edited September 22, 2014 by fbov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plus 3 golfer Posted September 22, 2014 Report Share Posted September 22, 2014 It looks from the diagram that a passive / circulation pump heater should go where hose 22 is located. I'm assuming that the coolant pump 19 is lower than the connection of hose 22 to the engine. With cold coolant (IIRC, the thermostat starts to open at 180 F) the thermostat should be closed and circulation should go starting from top of engine - 11, 13, 16, 18, 20, 19, 22, 11. I think a heater with a circulation pump could also be installed at hose 20. If there is room and easy access to hose 22 or 20, it shouldn't be difficult to install a coolant heater. But maybe the oil pan heater is better in that it's easy to install and IMO there will be no warranty issues as one is not altering the cooling system. ptjones 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted September 23, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) I forgot about the warranty issue, block heater is a FORD part. I wonder if there would be any circulation with the thermostat closed. :) Paul Edited September 23, 2014 by ptjones Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbov Posted September 23, 2014 Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 Thanks for the discussion! In fact, warranty is the major issue. $40 in parts with potential warranty issues vs. $1K+, as I recall, to retrofit the OEM and retain unquestionable warranty coverage. Hose 22 is the one you'd want, all right, assuming enough room to fit the heater head and cord... As to circulation... I don't see a need for more than passive circulation in a 2L engine. By placing the heater low in the cooling system, with no air pockets between it and the water jacket, you're guaranteed a high bouyancy gradient in the water. The thermostat's not involved as there's no bulk flow in the hose. It's' more of a hot water flowing up the upper half of the hose into the jacket, and cold water returning on the bottom half. No need for high flow rates, and no heating of the radiator, just the engine water jacket. (I once lost an alternator pulley on the road, taking out the water pump, and made it home ~180 miles at highway speeds on thermal gradient circulation alone.) Plus, with 600W immersed, you'll transfer a lot of energy quickly, unlike a low-power pan heater. Thermostatic protection prevents local boiling... and we're already handicapping the cooling system with grill blocks. There might be a reduction in cooling system capacity due to the flow intrusion, but I'm confident in the car's excess capacity relative to my driving needs. I suspect unblocking grills would add back more than this takes away. I also suspect that warranty issues are as much a matter of your relationship with the dealer's service management as any thing else. To my mind, you'd need to have an engine temperature-related failure for warranty to come into play, but not everyone looks at things rationally. I may be in good shape on this front, as the dealer's been great to date, to the point of doing an oil change on the alignment rack due to concerns of damaging my side skirts with a conventional lift... still have to look into that one! HAve fun,Frank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted September 23, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2014 You are dating the Service Manager? LOL I believe ICE block heater can be installed by loosening the exhaust manifolded and pulling away from block and worst case remove cat. bolts, exhaust nuts and remove exhaust manifold. Maybe half an hour job. Sure would be nice in all CMAX's came with block heaters. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted October 3, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 3, 2014 Used the Wolverine Model 9 125watt oil pan heater(2hrs before starting) and 5mpg over not using it for short 2.4mi. trip to work I see a 13-14*F rise in WT temp over ambient temp . :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecraigsmit Posted November 7, 2014 Report Share Posted November 7, 2014 Anyone ever think of using this instead of a block heater?http://www.tempco.com/Surface%20Heaters/HeatingTape_hub.htmJust wrap it around hose #22. Ptjones' issues lead me to believe that it's not worth the effort to install block heater myself. I like the idea of the adhesive faced, reflective foil backed version. Get the 25w/ft FTP-0001 version and wrap it as tight (just over-lapping) or loose (non-overlapping) as needed to get the desired heating. I haven't measured hose #22 but if it is like 18" in length and 2" in diameter you could conceivably get 1357W into your coolant using the 1/6" wide stuff. 2*pi*1"*18"*6wraps/"*2W/". Thoughts? Not that I recommend that, just nice to know what the max would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted November 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2014 Anyone ever think of using this instead of a block heater?http://www.tempco.com/Surface%20Heaters/HeatingTape_hub.htmJust wrap it around hose #22. Ptjones' issues lead me to believe that it's not worth the effort to install block heater myself. I like the idea of the adhesive faced, reflective foil backed version. Get the 25w/ft FTP-0001 version and wrap it as tight (just over-lapping) or loose (non-overlapping) as needed to get the desired heating. I haven't measured hose #22 but if it is like 18" in length and 2" in diameter you could conceivably get 1357W into your coolant using the 1/6" wide stuff. 2*pi*1"*18"*6wraps/"*2W/". Thoughts? Not that I recommend that, just nice to know what the max would be.Interesting idea, I wonder how hot the tape can get and rubber isn't a great conductor of heat. I still believe installing second Pan Heater on back side of block would be the easiest and most beneficial solution. I will post a picture soon. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecraigsmit Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Agree that rubber is a bad thermal conductor but when over-wrapped with the reflective foil the heat would more readily go in than out. Could put a probe in there at first to see how how hot the rubber is getting. I've requested a quote from them. Will post when I have more info. If anyone is under there, would they please measure hose #22 diameter and rough length. Thanks ptjones 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.