Energi but not use the plug / Pointless?

[stevedebi]

I don't have an Energi but I spend $175 a month for electricity and $20 a month for gas. I didn't think it was worthwhile.

I spend between 200 and 400 a month for electricity, and around 30 per month for gas - I generally fill up once per month or maybe every 6 weeks.

 

Both gas and electric are expensive in LA.

[Smiling Jack]

I've lurked on this thread for a long time and read most of the responses.  Some of the answers that occurred to me have been discussed, but several have not.

 

Thought I would sum up.

 

Here's smiling Jack's list of the top 10 advantages of the C-max Energi vs. the Hybrid that can be realized even if you don't plug in:

(several of which have been discussed in posts above)

 

10.  The rear load floor is between waist and thigh high - the perfect height to load and unload heavy objects without straining you back.  Think of a case of beer, for example.

         (No kidding - I REALLY enjoy this!)

 

9.  When the Energi rear seats are folded down there is a rise where they meet the rear load floor.  This means that you can put a slide-able package there and not need to worry that it will slide back when you "floor it."

 

8.  The Energi has a larger gas tank.

 

7.  The Energi can deliver more power to the wheels.  IIRC it is about 30 HP.  This, combined with the Energi's lower final drive ratio can make the Energi quicker in acceleration (particularly at street speeds) in spite of its greater weight.

 

6.  The heavier battery in the rear results in more even front-to-rear weight distribution.  This should promote better handling.

 

5.  (As has been discussed above)  You might qualify for an HOV sticker.

 

4. (Also as ha been discussed) The Energi could be cheaper to buy.  As was the case when I bought my 2013 new, the current sticker prrice of a Energi is higher than the (similarly equipped) Hybrid SEL by almost exactly the amount of the Federal tax credit; so if you qualify for the whole amount of that credit and you also qualify for a state tax benefit or rebate, the Energi would be cheaper in the end.

 

3. (Also as has been discussed)  It is indeed possible to re-charge the whole battery without plugging in, either while under ICE power or while regen braking.  Depending upon the nature of your trips, this could result in significant boosts in EV range and/or overall mpg.

 

2.  The charging port on the front fender is like a Badge of Honor.  The green-wise public definitely notice it and admire you for it.  In some circles its a status symbol.  I even got a  "thumbs up" form a Tesla driver.

 

1.  (to be continued)

[C-MaxSea]

Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee EEE;  If we didn't  :wub2: :love_shower: :wub2: our Non plug-in CMH so much, we'd drive an ENERGIII !
 

Good points SJ, but ...................

Edited June 5, 2016 by C-MaxSea

[stevedebi]

I've lurked on this thread for a long time and read most of the responses.  Some of the answers that occurred to me have been discussed, but several have not.

 

Thought I would sum up.

 

Here's smiling Jack's list of the top 10 advantages of the C-max Energi vs. the Hybrid that can be realized even if you don't plug in:

(several of which have been discussed in posts above)

 

10.  The rear load floor is between waist and thigh high - the perfect height to load and unload heavy objects without straining you back.  Think of a case of beer, for example.

         (No kidding - I REALLY enjoy this!)

 

9.  When the Energi rear seats are folded down there is a rise where they meet the rear load floor.  This means that you can put a slide-able package there and not need to worry that it will slide back when you "floor it."

 

8.  The Energi has a larger gas tank.

 

7.  The Energi can deliver more power to the wheels.  IIRC it is about 30 HP.  This, combined with the Energi's lower final drive ratio can make the Energi quicker in acceleration (particularly at street speeds) in spite of its greater weight.

 

6.  The heavier battery in the rear results in more even front-to-rear weight distribution.  This should promote better handling.

 

5.  (As has been discussed above)  You might qualify for an HOV sticker.

 

4. (Also as ha been discussed) The Energi could be cheaper to buy.  As was the case when I bought my 2013 new, the current sticker prrice of a Energi is higher than the (similarly equipped) Hybrid SEL by almost exactly the amount of the Federal tax credit; so if you qualify for the whole amount of that credit and you also qualify for a state tax benefit or rebate, the Energi would be cheaper in the end.

 

3. (Also as has been discussed)  It is indeed possible to re-charge the whole battery without plugging in, either while under ICE power or while regen braking.  Depending upon the nature of your trips, this could result in significant boosts in EV range and/or overall mpg.

 

2.  The charging port on the front fender is like a Badge of Honor.  The green-wise public definitely notice it and admire you for it.  In some circles its a status symbol.  I even got a  "thumbs up" form a Tesla driver.

 

1.  (to be continued)

Just a note on HOV here in CA. The stickers have run out. You can register for the waiting list - if the legislature approves more stickers, they will issue them.

 

They ran out in December of 2015.

[obob]

bIn theory.

 

I kind of skimmed the thread and know there is mention of hill regen capacity but thought I would add some more on that.

 

I considered buying a house in Hawaii.  It was up a long long way up and steep.  To get to anything there was only one road down to the main road. There are situations like this in other areas.  So the idea would be to leave enough room in the battery to not waste the daily or multiple daily elevation drops, or just use gas to truly respond to the question of the thread.  In Hawaii and other places, this could work the other way too.  Like living at sea level and then making the trip to one of those telescopes on top of a mountain on a daily basis if you worked up there.  Just fill up the battery at home, or use the gas engine and charge it back up on the way down.  That's like 13800 feet.  

 

Note: I am not sure the C-Max battery could take so much charging, but perhaps a Tesla could.

 

Also need to consider the effect of humidity and salt on a hybrid in some areas of Hawaii.

Edited July 1, 2016 by obob

[jackalopetx]

I've lurked on this thread for a long time and read most of the responses.  Some of the answers that occurred to me have been discussed, but several have not.

 

Thought I would sum up.

 

Here's smiling Jack's list of the top 10 advantages of the C-max Energi vs. the Hybrid that can be realized even if you don't plug in:

(several of which have been discussed in posts above)

 

10.  The rear load floor is between waist and thigh high - the perfect height to load and unload heavy objects without straining you back.  Think of a case of beer, for example.

         (No kidding - I REALLY enjoy this!)

 

9.  When the Energi rear seats are folded down there is a rise where they meet the rear load floor.  This means that you can put a slide-able package there and not need to worry that it will slide back when you "floor it."

 

8.  The Energi has a larger gas tank.

 

7.  The Energi can deliver more power to the wheels.  IIRC it is about 30 HP.  This, combined with the Energi's lower final drive ratio can make the Energi quicker in acceleration (particularly at street speeds) in spite of its greater weight.

 

6.  The heavier battery in the rear results in more even front-to-rear weight distribution.  This should promote better handling.

 

5.  (As has been discussed above)  You might qualify for an HOV sticker.

 

4. (Also as ha been discussed) The Energi could be cheaper to buy.  As was the case when I bought my 2013 new, the current sticker prrice of a Energi is higher than the (similarly equipped) Hybrid SEL by almost exactly the amount of the Federal tax credit; so if you qualify for the whole amount of that credit and you also qualify for a state tax benefit or rebate, the Energi would be cheaper in the end.

 

3. (Also as has been discussed)  It is indeed possible to re-charge the whole battery without plugging in, either while under ICE power or while regen braking.  Depending upon the nature of your trips, this could result in significant boosts in EV range and/or overall mpg.

 

2.  The charging port on the front fender is like a Badge of Honor.  The green-wise public definitely notice it and admire you for it.  In some circles its a status symbol.  I even got a  "thumbs up" form a Tesla driver.

 

1.  (to be continued)

 

The hybrid and Energi both have a 115hp electric motor right? So why only 30hp to the wheels from electric? Can the battery not handle that much amperage?

[Smiling Jack]

The hybrid and Energi both have a 115hp electric motor right? So why only 30hp to the wheels from electric? Can the battery not handle that much amperage?

 

Exactly !

 

Both the Hybrid and the Energi are limited by the amount of current that can be delivered to the electric motor, but the Energi can deliver more current.

[ptjones]

Exactly !

 

Both the Hybrid and the Energi are limited by the amount of current that can be delivered to the electric motor, but the Energi can deliver more current.

I wonder about that, I know if my HVB is charged 55-60% SOC in the morning when it's cold my CMAX has surprising acceleration to 35mph when ICE turns on. :) I think it is a little more than 2 BARS power draw.  I suspect the HVB heats up pretty quickly do to it's smaller capacity, which limits current draw. ;) 

 

Paul 

[Smiling Jack]

I wonder about that, I know if my HVB is charged 55-60% SOC in the morning when it's cold my CMAX has surprising acceleration to 35mph when ICE turns on. :) I think it is a little more than 2 BARS power draw.  I suspect the HVB heats up pretty quickly do to it's smaller capacity, which limits current draw. ;)

 

Paul 

 

Paul,

 

Yes, and ithe acceleration is perhaps even more "surprising" in the Energi.

 

It has been well discussed on the Energi forum, and I believe pretty well accepted that the larger battery pack in the Energi can simply deliver more current, but still not enough to max out the motor.

 

Jack

Edited July 2, 2016 by Smiling Jack