dharrisonz Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 My 2013 C-MAX has been a good car with no issues (except for dead battery and associated recalls) until 80,000 miles when the check engine light came on and the engine started running rough at idle. The dealer I bought it from said they did something to the computer regards misfires and reset the check engine light ($191.00). Within 15 miles or so the light came back on. I took it back to the dealer and before even hooking the car up to diagnostics said it is not the same problem, and were very belligerent and almost hostile to my pleasant inquiries about what could be wrong. I took the car to another dealer (Colonial Ford in Plymouth, MA) whom I am very happy with regards how they treat me and discuss the issue with me. They have also been very good about keeping the car over night and rechecking to make sure the "fixes" they have made have fixed the issue, but the check engine light continues to comes on and the idle is rough. They have supposedly been on the phone or chat with Ford engineers every day. Over several weeks they replaced a fuel injector, replaced spark plugs, replaced a connector that they thought was corroded and seemed to make the issue occur if they wiggled it, but the issue continues. I dont know what the codes are, but there is apparently something out of tolerance and reporting an issue with one particular cylinder. Next they wanted to replace the head, which I thought made little sense because there are no traditional symptoms of a bad head (no exhaust gas leaks, no oil leaks, no coolant leaks, no funny tappet sounds or anything like that). I asked if maybe the computer or some sensor could be bad or some wires crossed, but they replaced the head (took a week to get parts and a few days to replace it), and then they said they needed to replace or adjust something with the tappets, which indicates to me that the replacement head is probably a used part, so now I have an old major part in my car, AND, of course, it did not fix the problem. Once you tear down/rebuild an engine like this it is never the same. Now they want to replace the whole computer - not sure how long that will take to get the part. Fortunately I bought extended bumper to bumper warranty when I bought the car, so there will supposedly only be a $100 charge to me if and when they ever fix the problem. Ford, and/or my extended warranty is covering a service rental, but I am paying $16 a day for no-worry insurance on the rental (this is Massachusetts, the rental insurance is expensive - car rentals in other states only charge $9 for it. Worth it for a few day rental, but this is now the 4th or 5th week and I cant afford it, but I commute 130 miles a day to work and have to have a reliable car. Although this car has 80,000 miles they are clean highway miles, the car has been serviced regularly at the dealer and is otherwise like new. Nothing like this has ever happened to me before and I am at a loss as to what to do. Even if they eventually fix the issue I have no confidence in the car - I wish that Ford would just buy me out of the car or give some special incentive to trade it in for something else. I think Colonial Ford has been straight-up with me and is trying to figure out the issue, but I am starting to wonder if maybe the extended warranty is just a license to perform work that is not needed - is that possible? Suggestions anyone? C-MaxA2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wab Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 Check with your insurance co.I've been told by a fairly reliable source ( a few yrs ago) that the "you need our insurance on the rental" was a scam. If you had a wreck in the rental your insurance co would rent the rental while it was being repaired. I'm sure someone in the rental/insurance business will dispute/verify this.Check with your insurance co. kyledamron1, ptjones and obob 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plus 3 golfer Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 .... Even if they eventually fix the issue I have no confidence in the car - I wish that Ford would just buy me out of the car or give some special incentive to trade it in for something else. I think Colonial Ford has been straight-up with me and is trying to figure out the issue, but I am starting to wonder if maybe the extended warranty is just a license to perform work that is not needed - is that possible? Suggestions anyone?It may be time to start the arbitration process. I'd get in touch with an attorney and discuss what might happen if you go to arbitration assuming Ford can't / hasn't apparently fixed the issue. I'd also assume that Ford isn't going to throw money at this that exceeds the value of the car. A quick check of NADA retail value for a 2013 SE at 80 k miles is around $12,000. So, I wouldn't expect Ford to continue to authorize repairs if the cost of such repairs exceeds the value of the car (eg, an new engine, wiring harnesses, control modules, and so forth). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevedebi Posted October 19, 2015 Report Share Posted October 19, 2015 Check with your insurance co.I've been told by a fairly reliable source ( a few yrs ago) that the "you need our insurance on the rental" was a scam. If you had a wreck in the rental your insurance co would rent the rental while it was being repaired. I'm sure someone in the rental/insurance business will dispute/verify this.Check with your insurance co.He is getting the no liability policy, which is supplemental. I generally get it as well, since it is usually 9 bucks for the peace of mind. If I get into an accident, that is 2K or so out of pocket immediately, plus even with no accidents they can complain about anything that appears to have happened to the car, like a windshield pit. I just like the peace of mind that comes with SI. I know for sure that my insurance covers rentals - but not everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obob Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) Suggestions anyone? My experience is that when my car is not working right I feel stuck in a cloud of not goodness, but when it gets corrected I feel better, especially if it is covered under the warranty. That is not a problem I have seen on this forum. The motor seems solid. It seems like a good thing they are replacing the computer. What it seems like it needs is one or two of Ford's top mechanics to get on that car, perhaps one electrical and one mechanical. But top mechanics are probably very very in demand and not a dime and dozen. This reminds me of a problem we had with a large HP printer maybe 15 years ago. It wasn't working. Our service guy was kind of programmed to swap out boards which costs money. After a couple of these swapping calls I called HP and complained. I got a top notch guy on the phone. The problem was the toner cartridge was not seated right, but it was not so unseated that it gave the usual error message, but it gave a misleading message. This may be something simple, but not easy. You definitely have Ford's attention. Replacing a head is a big deal. Edited October 20, 2015 by obob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obob Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 (edited) He is getting the no liability policy, which is supplemental. I generally get it as well, since it is usually 9 bucks for the peace of mind. If I get into an accident, that is 2K or so out of pocket immediately, plus even with no accidents they can complain about anything that appears to have happened to the car, like a windshield pit. I just like the peace of mind that comes with SI. I know for sure that my insurance covers rentals - but not everything. http://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-cards/credit-card-offers-good-rental-car-insurance/ Some credit cards include rental car insurance, primary and or secondary if you pay for the rental with that card. Edited October 20, 2015 by obob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted October 20, 2015 Report Share Posted October 20, 2015 Kind of sounds like an intake leak which would only show up when idling. Replacing the Head should have fixed that you would think. Isn't the intake manifold plastic? Maybe it has a crack in it. Just a thought. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FordService Posted October 22, 2015 Report Share Posted October 22, 2015 ...Now they want to replace the whole computer - not sure how long that will take to get the part... Hi dharrisonz, Do you have any updates regarding the computer coming in and getting replaced? Meagan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dharrisonz Posted October 23, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2015 Thanks all, for the comments and suggestions... The PCM was replaced yesterday and ran through all the computer updates today.No change - the engine still runs rough at idle when just charging the battery and the check engine light still comes on. They are trying to get a Ford engineer to come out and review everything that has been done so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted October 24, 2015 Report Share Posted October 24, 2015 If it not electrical, I would check the intake manifold again to see if there is a crack in it. They should know what cylinder is causing the problem. Check that intake tube. IMO :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dharrisonz Posted October 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 24, 2015 I asked if maybe the intake manifold had a crack or the flappers were stuck on the bad cylinder, but they said the manifold had checked out ok. I dont know if they did a thorough inspection, but wouldn't they have had to take the manifold off when they replaced the cylinder head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted October 24, 2015 Report Share Posted October 24, 2015 I asked if maybe the intake manifold had a crack or the flappers were stuck on the bad cylinder, but they said the manifold had checked out ok. I dont know if they did a thorough inspection, but wouldn't they have had to take the manifold off when they replaced the cylinder head? Yes they would have, but it might be hard to see a crack. I'm worried that they haven't figured it out by now. ;) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dharrisonz Posted October 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 26, 2015 I decided that for me personally it was not worth the stress and cost to continue with the situation and traded for a new leftover 2014 Focus. I think the dealer gave me an ok deal all things considered, but Ford corporate did nothing for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plus 3 golfer Posted October 26, 2015 Report Share Posted October 26, 2015 I decided that for me personally it was not worth the stress and cost to continue with the situation and traded for a new leftover 2014 Focus. I think the dealer gave me an ok deal all things considered, but Ford corporate did nothing for me. It's too bad you are letting Ford off the hook so easy. But I understand you want to move on. For others: don't think that the extended Ford warranty offers 100% "peace of mind". ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted October 26, 2015 Report Share Posted October 26, 2015 Sorry to hear things worked out this way, I consider FOCUS a step down from a CMAX and it would be nice to know what the problem was for the rest of us. appreciate you letting us know. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIG ROCCO Posted October 29, 2015 Report Share Posted October 29, 2015 I decided that for me personally it was not worth the stress and cost to continue with the situation and traded for a new leftover 2014 Focus. I think the dealer gave me an ok deal all things considered, but Ford corporate did nothing for me. Kind of a big move to make for a check engine light and rough idle, but as you said, I guess it wasn't worth the stress. I was wondering why you chose to replace a '13 C-Max with a Focus and not a '15 C-Max? Was it because of the problems, or because you just prefer the Focus? Our '13 C-Max with 30K miles was totaled a couple months ago. We considered other cars - nothing seemed to offer the same package of utility, fuel economy, comfort, power, and purchase price. OK, so it was going to be a C-Max...but with what options and what color exterior and interior? Well, we decided to get EXACTLY the same car (SEL, 302A, White Platinum/Medium Stone). I think we actually paid a little less than we did for '13, and we are happy as pie with the '15. Smiling Jack and C-MaxSea 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNY Posted July 30, 2019 Report Share Posted July 30, 2019 (edited) 2013 with about 80K miles.Figured I'd add to this thread, mine started rough running, less power and check engine light came on going home last Wed. made it home mostly on Battery and coasting, about 5-6 miles or so.... got home and when the ICE came on after pressing throttle, it was shaking really bad and shut off almost immediately. AAA towed it to the dealer, they scanned and found major errors in the computer, and found the computer case in the front fender all corroded (nice place to put it in a high salt/hard winter area LOL) and ordered a new computer. Ouch.. $$$ plus labor, diagnosis, etc..and not saying it will solve the problem. but it's a start. Maybe tomorrow or thurs I will know more once they get a new computer. HOPEFULLY that solves problem. it happened once before and cleared itself and been running fine. Edited July 30, 2019 by WNY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted July 30, 2019 Report Share Posted July 30, 2019 First thing I would do is add injector cleaner. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNY Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 will do! thx. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fbov Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) 2013 with about 80K miles....... the computer case in the front fender all corroded ...2013 with about 63K miles on it.Bottom of the doors has started to rust. Makes me wonder what else might be. We drive on similarly treated roads....Frank Edited July 31, 2019 by fbov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WNY Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 fbov, true.My driver side door on the bottom inside a little surface rust in the seam, shows up and I clean it off , prolly coming from inside the doors, passenger side is fine. i try and keep it as clean as possible and wash it winter when I can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jestevens Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 (edited) I've always had surface rust on inside of door panels near welds at bottom of door seam and rust at spot welds around the hinge of back door - I wash car at least once a month or when it gets very dirty and they don't seem to be getting any worse. Car now has nearly 98K mi on it, sometimes engine feels a little rough from a cold start. If it gets out of whack enough to start throwing a code I'll take it in and ask to change injectors/plugs - does this thing even use plugs, maybe coil packs? But I can't complain for nearly 100K mi on original parts. If the body really starts to rust I think maybe I will trade for a 20 Corolla Hybrid or Prius. If it lasts long enough it would be interesting to see Ford's new electric line up in MY21-22 although I doubt I can afford or want an electric F-150..maybe I'll change my mind. Edited July 31, 2019 by jestevens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 I've always had surface rust on inside of door panels near welds at bottom of door seam and rust at spot welds around the hinge of back door - I wash car at least once a month or when it gets very dirty and they don't seem to be getting any worse. Car now has nearly 98K mi on it, sometimes engine feels a little rough from a cold start. If it gets out of whack enough to start throwing a code I'll take it in and ask to change injectors/plugs - does this thing even use plugs, maybe coil packs? But I can't complain for nearly 100K mi on original parts. If the body really starts to rust I think maybe I will trade for a 20 Corolla Hybrid or Prius. If it lasts long enough it would be interesting to see Ford's new electric line up in MY21-22 although I doubt I can afford or want an electric F-150..maybe I'll change my mind.Have you tried injector cleaner? I changed my plugs at around 200k miles or about 100k ICE miles and my plugs were fine. I don't think you ever need to replace your plugs. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plus 3 golfer Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 2013 with about 80K miles.Figured I'd add to this thread, mine started rough running, less power and check engine light came on going home last Wed. made it home mostly on Battery and coasting, about 5-6 miles or so.... got home and when the ICE came on after pressing throttle, it was shaking really bad and shut off almost immediately. AAA towed it to the dealer, they scanned and found major errors in the computer, and found the computer case in the front fender all corroded (nice place to put it in a high salt/hard winter area LOL) and ordered a new computer. Ouch.. $$$ plus labor, diagnosis, etc..and not saying it will solve the problem. but it's a start. Maybe tomorrow or thurs I will know more once they get a new computer. HOPEFULLY that solves problem. it happened once before and cleared itself and been running fine. There is a large bracket type box with cover that houses the PCM "box" on the left lower side in front of the left fender liner just above frame. It's hard to see looking inside the engine bay but you can see the cables that go into it. It's accessed by removing the fender liner. It's hard to visualize how moisture / water could enter the boxes unless something is / was amiss. I believe you bought the car used. Was there ever work done on the left front? Maybe the car was run without a belly pan for awhile. I don't know whether the PCM "box" can be opened to get at the electronics. But, I solved an issue many years ago by cleaning "corrosion" from the board. Get the PCM back and take a look at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill-N Posted July 31, 2019 Report Share Posted July 31, 2019 ... does this thing even use plugs, maybe coil packs? So called CoP, aka coil on plug. Meaning, I guess, that each spark plug has its own ignition coil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.