raadsel

Talk about the C-Max starts about 14:24:

I don't believe the trailer has the C-Max. Katherine Heigl is driving a different car, it is Rosario Dawson's character that drives the C-Max. This trailer seems to have a few quick shots of the C-Max:

It was scary for me, at the time, as I was afraid I was going to have an expensive repair. Fortunately, it still hasn't recurred. I'm hoping, like Plus 3 Golfer referred to, it was just a module that didn't start up correctly which caused the power steering "not to turn on." I'll be keeping a watch on it and hopefully it was just a one off.

A couple of days ago I had been running errands. My last stop, very close to home, when I turned the car back on I got a Power Steering Failure message and it was extremely hard to turn the wheel. I drove home and made it okay. Once parked, I decided to try and restart my car and I didn't get the message, and the wheels turned easily -- my power steering was working okay. I decided to head to my Ford dealer and see if they might know anything or have any suggestions. I got the Service Adviser to check for any codes, and there weren't any. I did quite a bit more driving Thursday, did some driving yesterday, and have had no further issues -- everything has been working fine. I'm just curious if anyone else has had this happen, or if you have any suggestions.

It's slower than a Yugo (for those that remember that horrid car)!

I'm curious where you saw that Ford will bring 20 Hybrid vehicles to the US market soon? The most recent thing I've seen is "13 electrified vehicles" in the next five years, but that number is a combination of pure electric, plug-in hybrid, and hybrid vehicles -- and that includes two police cruisers.

While this video still is mostly basic information, they do explain a little about how pursuit mode will work, as well as showing the cars interior:

When I saw the car at a recent auto show, I heard someone speculate that perhaps what Hyundai/Kia did is replace the 12V battery with a capacitor. His thinking is that it has the 12V reset button because, since the capacitor can't hold the charge for a long period, the button allows the car to be started if the car sits too long, after the capacitor has lost sufficient charge. While I don't believe this is the case, it is an interesting idea; to my knowledge Hyundai/Kia still have not stated how they eliminated the 12V battery.

I suspect you'll see the base Ioniq at under $20K, with rebates, in 6-8 months. Hyundai provides pretty aggressive rebates on their hybrids; for example, the Sonata Hybrid currently has a $2500 cash rebate, and my recollection is that it had a $5000 rebate last summer (at least in my area). Of course, much will depend on how well the Ioniqs sell. Interestingly, I was at the Houston Auto Show yesterday (normally it would be in January, moved because of the Super Bowl). The first car you saw, when walking in, was the C-Max Energi.

Any recommendations for the rear windshield wiper?

On the 2013, the remote start was not included as part of the 303A package -- it only added the Park Assist and Front sensors. The remote start was a separate option, just like the panoramic roof. You can find the brochure for the 2013 C-Max here.

Forgive me for posting another video but this is a former Prius owner who, after his first month and tank, got 64.5 mpg in his Niro LX over 600 miles of driving -- he says the tank wasn't quite completely full when he got it. The main point, though, is that he seems to debunk the claim that the Niro won't go into EV mode above 40 mph -- he talks about having it in EV mode at 70 mph, he shows on camera being in EV on a level freeway at 60 mph, and he states he can easily get it in EV mode at freeway speeds by just letting off the throttle. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2qSjLybL3g

Not sure what to think of this -- and I'm putting this here because the Ioniq shares the powertrain and chassis with the Niro, just is a more traditional hatchback -- though still about the same cargo capacity. In any case, saw this review on the Hyundai Ioniq and the reviewer got 87.1 mpg on his test drive in the mid-level Ioniq with the Technology package (Smart Cruise, Autonomous braking, etc). Granted, he only did about 10 miles on his review but still pretty impressive:

The tests I've seen indicate that manufacturers expect the batteries to last over 10 years and at least 300,000 miles. In Ford's case, I've not seen the actual testing but they do indicate they should last "the life of the car," that the car should "die" from other causes before the battery needs replacing. Hyundai, with their LiPo battery tests, got results that show they should last over 300,000 miles. As others have stated, even in high mileage vehicles such as taxis, the real life results appear to be confirming the manufacturers tests.

What I get from that is that there will be two all-electric vehicles built at the plant. It also sounds like they are considering building a hybrid there, making me think this is a car still on the drawing board and will have a different powertrain than the current 2.0L gas engine hybrid used in the Fusion/C-Max/MKZ. My impression is that any hybrids based on the current hybrid powertrain will be build in Mexico, and a new hybrid with a different powertrain will be built in Michigan. I'm also getting the impression there will be a 2018 C-Max this fall/winter. Chances are, it will just be the current 2017 C-Max, just built after September, or so. They can then try and produce enough C-Max cars to last until the 2019 model year, before ending production next April, with the idea that the Model E (C-Max replacement?) will be released as a 2019 model, in the first quarter (or so) of 2019.

I recently switched to an iPhone after years on Android and find that I rather like Apple Maps. I do think Google is still better at routing but Apple's interface seems to be much easier for me to "read" with a quick glance. I have used Waze but got tired of some of the weird routes it uses when traffic is congested, such as telling me I need to turn left, with no light, from a barely paved 2 lane road onto a rush hour busy, 50 mph, 7-lane major artery. Since Google is now using most of the user reports made on Waze, it seems to have many of the pros of Waze without the weird routes.

The official capacity is 13.5, but it has been stated here, by those that have ran the tank down to empty, that it is closer to 14 gallons or just over.

No, Apple requires you to use their own Maps app. Unfortunately, I don't think Apple will allow you to use another mapping app on CarPlay anytime soon. Android Auto, naturally, does use Google Maps and is allegedly going to add an option for Waze "soon," though "soon" has been over a year now. Of course, Google owns Waze, so I'm not sure what the hold up is. I also recall Here Maps is working on being compatible with Android Auto.

While it is several months old, I think it is still correct. I suspect that "Ford" thinks the Model E, despite likely being more like a Focus, will be a suitable C-Max replacement. Then they can bring back the Escape Hybrid as a true crossover hybrid. In terms of timing, since the 2017 C-Max is just hitting dealers, I think the C-Max will continue to be a "current" model for another year, with Ford planning for the remaining C-Max stock to last until the 2019 Escape and Model E's are released. Perhaps they'll even make the last of the C-Max cars produced 2018 models, even though they'll be identical (just produced a few months later) to the 2017 model.

My issue with what you are claiming about the Niro is that you discount just how good of fuel economy people might be able to get. I understand you (or a friend), driving a car new to you that has less than 20 miles, does not get as good of mileage as you can get in your C-Max in a relatively short drive. Though, just for perspective, I saw this the other day -- a car reviewer for Fox News in Dallas averaged over 56 mpg driving a Niro Touring (43 mpg combined) for a week. This wasn't a hyper-miler, in fact, the car reported he drove the car normally, not economically. As for TFLcar, if you've watched their reviews before you'd know that they are in Colorado and do their 0-60 tests at over a mile in altitude -- this causes their 0-60 times to be one to two seconds slower than other reported times, which are typically done at sea level. There is no reason to believe that the Niro does not have a sub-10 second 0-60 time, which is still about 1.5 seconds slower than the C-Max Hybrid. But, up to about 30 mph the acceleration (if neither is in Eco mode) is about 3.3 seconds for both vehicles. In Eco mode, both will feel slower (particularly if you are used to a 2013 C-Max, which does not have an Eco mode) because of the way throttle response is delayed in Eco mode. As for the 600 mile club, that means very little actually. To get 600 miles from a tank of gas in a C-Max only requires a 42.8 mpg average. Additionally, it is one thing to get a single tank at over 50 mph, it is another thing to do it consistently. I've explained my issues with fuel economy; a combination of several short trips and relatively high speed limits on the streets around me. Some of my short trips mpg seem a bit crazy -- I've had trips where I was under 20 mpg, with a trip only a couple of miles in the cold, with a cold engine; and I've seen trips over 100 mpg -- same type of trip as the low fuel economy, just with a charged battery and warm engine. Looking at my fuelly, there are at least a couple of times I could have hit the 600 mile club, just that I filled the tank too soon(gassed up with a quarter tank or more left). As to what constitutes "better," that is in the eyes of the buyer. As I've stated, I'm not sure I want a Niro but, based on my short drive, it isn't out of the picture; by contrast, the 2017 C-Max is definitely one of the finalists. For me, an advantage of the Niro is the Smart Cruise Control -- also, I can see the advantage of having Autonomous braking; the Niro having those is plus for the Niro over the C-Max. The better power of the C-Max, while still being fuel efficient, and the better tires are pluses for the C-Max over the Niro. As you've pointed out, the C-Max also has the auto wipers and power liftgate -- though to be honest, the liftgate is not a big deal for me. While it can be nice in a few situations, there are other situations when it has annoyed me how slow it can be or when I've accidentally closed the liftgate by moving my foot while in the middle of loading. The Niro has advantages with the space for a spare tire under the trunk, the telescoping sun visors, and the power folding side mirrors.

I can't see Ford renaming the C-Max as an Edge; the Edge is a larger vehicle. If they were simply going to rename the C-Max, it would likely be the Escape, since it is the closest in size to (though still a bit larger) the C-Max. Additionally, styling-wise, the Escape has a similar body style to the C-Max. I suspect that what you heard/saw is that Ford is looking at making an Edge Hybrid that will "replace" the C-Max on the production line at the Michigan Assembly Plant -- but it will be based on the current Edge body.

Whether the graph is 100% accurate or not, it shows something I was trying to say earlier -- the Niro's engine is designed to provide torque across a wider range of RPMs to match better with the geared transmission they are using. The similar engine in a Kia Rio would have 138 HP; they tuned the engine so that -- even with being Atkinsonized -- it would help with the torque (as well as giving better fuel economy and thermal efficiency). I can't recall where I saw the 3.3 0-30 time for the Niro -- though the above link (automative-catalog.com) shows 3.1 second 0-30. For the C-Max, I seem to recall the number coming from Car & Driver. Again, unless you put the Kia into Sport mode, the C-Max will feel faster because of the way Kia retards the throttle response.

You mean with you driving your 2013 C-Max, that you know exactly how to drive, is broken in, and you've made modifications to got better gas mileage than a brand new Kia Niro that you had never driven before. Not to mention you aren't accounting for things like exactly the same route, SoC, etc. I'd also suggest that, with how bound and determined you appear to be to prove the C-Max can replecate the Niro's numbers, that you (unconsciously) did not drive the Niro as effeciently as you did the C-Max. The fact remains, the Fuelly average for the C-max after several years remains fairly close to the 40mpg EPA numbers. To this point, it appears we are seeing something similar with the Fuelly numbers for the Niro, they are close to the Niro's EPA numbers; though we will have to see how the Niro does as it is broken in and we get more data points. If we really want to compare, I'd say we need to compare your C-Max numbers with the numbers Wayne Gerdes got out of the Niro. The fact is that, just as you said most people wouldn't be able to equal the numbers Wayne got from the Niro, we've seen that no one on this board (that I can recall) can get the same numbers you do from the C-Max. I'd love to see a test between you and Wayne, with you in the C-Max -- that would be a fascinating test.

There seems to be a fair amount of misinformation here about the Niro. First, from 0-30, the Niro and the C-Max accelerate at about the same speed, both at about 3.3 seconds to 30 mph. Second, the Niro was designed with the idea they were using a geared transmission -- torque is available at lower speeds and across a wider range than on the C-Max. This is much of the reason why the 1.6L engine only produces 104 hp -- they sacrificed the horsepower to give more torque at lower rpms and to improve efficiency, particularly when combined with the electric motor. I know on the Sonata/Optima hybrids, and I'm guessing this carries over to the Ioniq/Niro, the car always uses the electric motor to start moving the car from a complete stop. It will do it on its own, as long as possible (based on throttle and battery SoC), adding the gas engine in when "needed." I recall seeing the time it takes for to bring the gas engine "online" but can't find it now, I recall it being less than 1 second. This is also where Sport mode comes into play. Eco mode, on the Niro, beyond retarding gas pedal response also lowers the shift points on the transmission -- it shifts at the earliest possible point, which is good for fuel efficiency but, as pointed out, keeps the engine at lower RPMs (lower on the HP curve). While Sport mode does put the transmission in a type of "manual mode," it will still automatically shift if you don't -- but mostly it allows the engine to run at higher RPMs, where it is at max horsepower. The acceleration difference between the Niro and the C-Max is primarily above 30 mph, this is where having the relatively "weak" (in terms of HP) 1.6L engine, vs. the 2L engine on the C-Max, hurts the Niro. As a comparison, the Sonata Hybrid (and I assume the new Optima Hybrid) with a similar 2L engine but which still has less horsepower from electric, was shown to be slightly faster than the C-Max, despite its conventional automatic transmission (though it does have an aerodynamic advantage). The Eco mode of the Niro will make the Niro feel slower, though I would suggest when driving for fuel economy (as most of us do), there is little actual difference. It also tells me that those that put the Niro into Sport mode and still found it slower than a Niro at hard acceleration have had their bias for the C-Max color their perception of the speed the Niro accelerated at (not feeling the torque). I finally was able to test drive a Niro (the LX trim, 49 mpg combined rating), though unfortunately it was a rather short drive (only about 3 miles) in the rain. Coming out of the dealership, you pull directly onto an access road with a 50 mph speed limit -- and traffic was steady. Having read some of the comments in this thread, I worried a lot pulling out and was surprised when I had no issues. The Niro accelerated well for me. I went from the dealership to a freeway onramp, less than a quarter of a mile -- and there was no acceleration lane to enter the freeway due to road construction. I had no issue getting up to speed and merging into the 65 mph traffic on the freeway. I only drove about a mile (likely a bit less) on the freeway, just to the next exit. I then to surface streets back to the dealership. The engine ran for a couple of minutes before I left the dealership (the salesman had started it before I got in the car). I reset the trip computer before leaving the dealer lot and, at the end of my drive, it read just about 47.6 mpg -- not bad considering the very wet conditions. I find I like both the C-Max and the Niro, at least so far (I need a much longer test drive of the Niro) but they are different cars. Personally I'm glad both exist and I hate the Ford is getting rid of the C-Max; hopefully they'll add an Escape hybrid, or a tall Model E hatchback. I'll be curious how I'll feel about the Niro after a longer test drive in better weather. I think which people will find "best" depends on which feels more comfortable to them, what options they feel they need, and whether their priority is fuel economy or power. While I know some here think the C-Max is as fuel efficient as the Niro, the Niro has better (and 20% better for the lower trims) EPA ratings, as well as the C-Max having a poor fuel economy reputation from the whole 47/47/47 debacle and the poor hybrid optimization of the original 2013.

That is the Eco Mode which the car defaults to when started, similar to the Eco Mode on the newer C-Max. If you put the Niro into sport mode, you should be able to feel the torque. There is now a third Niro on Fuelly, an EX model (49 mpg combined EPA rating), and that person is getting 52.3 mpg in CT. The two other Touring models (43 mpg combined rating) are currently at 43.2 and 47.7 mpg respectively.