rkk
-
Posts
26 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Gallery
Posts posted by rkk
-
-
Its a great idea but I have issues with that "hump" in the back and it's NOT going to allow us to fit all our snow gear and snowboard and skis when we go to Mammoth. As my pictures prove, we load it to the roof. However, if I had an Energi to drive my 40-50 miles to and from work, I can probably kill all records for the range on 1 tank.... ;)
The lost space in the back along with the no longer flat floor when you fold the seats down can be a deal breaker for some. Ironically for me I need to take my snow blower in to be fixed. I probably should have done that first. Oh well, maybe it will fit.
-
For those who aren't aware, Ford has some pretty good rebates on the Energi right now and 0 percent interest for 60 months. The dealers are also eager to move them. If you can take advantage of the $4007 Federal Tax credit it might be worth looking at trading in your CMAX Hybrid for the Energi ( or just getting another one). Several of us over at cleanmpg.com have done just that. In my case after all was said and done, including the tax rebate for under $4900 more including all taxes and fees I traded in my base SE CMAX hybrid with over 27,000 miles on it for a base Energi SEL with 75 miles on it. With the 0 percent interest my effective monthly payment(after accounting for the tax rebate) is the same as I was paying for the hybrid. Now the Energi has nearly 500 miles and I have used less than 3 gallons of gas.
I fell in love with driving electric driving my wifes Leaf but I needed more range. This gives me the best of both worlds. If you haven't driven one it would be worth a test drive.
-
The EPA, and Toyota would beg to differ.
The way I see it the problem doesn't really lie with Ford. It's more of a problem with the EPA and their methods and with the general car-buying public.
The EPA thinks that they can provide an apples to apples metric for fuel mileage that covers all propulsion technologies. But this episode shows that they are behind the curve with cars that don't follow the "engine always-on" model. I think the EPA mileage rules will always be a day late when it comes to newer technology.
Car purchasers are also to blame for not understanding the meaning of the EPA mileage rating. It is intended as a way to compare multiple vehicles against each other, not as an absolute expectation of fuel efficiency.
-
I could be wrong, but with the right driver I believe the C-Max can get better gas mileage than a Prius.
If you look at the comparison test that cleanmpg.com did they have a number of steady state speed tests. They get to a certain speed and turn on the cruise control taking the driver out of it. The Prius V did better at every speed. However that was before the update for the C-MAX.
By the way, when you look at all the reviews done on the Fusion and the Fuelly.com numbers, it isn't much better than the C-MAX. I am not an engineer but I don't think aerodynamics can account for a 7 mpg difference on the EPA highway test. Ford says they are not changing it. I wonder if the EPA is testing that one too.
-
You're pretty much out of your mind if you think that Ford didn't perform the tests on this car, or have tons of data from real-life driving.
Exactly. Ford knew exactly what they were doing, and what this car would get for most people. They saw a rule they could take advantage of and they did. They apparently thought they could get away with blaming the EPA rules and the drivers.
-
I have the SEL 300A package - MFT screen, without Navigation. And I had the update done.
I have it installed now. I emailed the dealer service manager along with a customer service rep from Ford all the info including the letter from Ford and the sync history showing them the update wasn't done. The service manager emailed be back to bring it and they would try again. It's working fine now.
-
The same thing happened to me. Hopefully next week I will be taking it back to get it taken care of.
-
Service manager from the dealer just called. He has been in touch with Ford and was told there have been many cases of the upgrade reporting to the system that it has been installed, but nothing was actually applied to the car. I have another appointment on July 10 for the install the upgrade to the MFT. Without my asking he said there would be a car waiting for me to drive while they have mine. My only question is this: Don't they even look at their work before signing off on it? The tech should have seen that nothing was changed.
This happened to me as well except now the dealer is telling me there isn't an update available for my C-MAX. They are telling me it is for C-MAX's with navigation only even though I have the letter from Ford saying I should get the update. I have contacted Ford and so far all they tell me is their system shows the recall was done. Has anyone here that doesn't have navigation had the update done?
-
Yes, they did another one. Look at his first post. It's dated yesterday. The thread you are talking about is this one
http://www.cleanmpg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45723&page=14
-
Actually this was just posted yesterday. Some of the information is from an older thread. One of his points would be whatever you are getting in the C-MAX, you would be getting better in either Prius despite Ford's advertising. For me the C-MAX has been consistently about 7-8 mpg's less than my Civic Hybrid was in similar conditions even though the Civic is a lower rated car. In my case I have nearly 11,000 miles on mine and have yet to see a 47 mpg tank but it is much colder here. Maybe this summer.
-
There may be many reasons to pick a C-MAX over a Prius, but mileage isn't one of them. Not even against a Prius V.
-
Being able to go up to 62 mph in EV mode is just a gimmic if you are driving any distance on the freeway (but probably very helpful on the EPA test). Where does that battery power come from? The gas engine.The result when using ev mode once the battery has to be recharged so much power is pulled off the engine to recharge the battery that the mileage drops significantly until it is charged up again. The best highway mileage I have seen by far is at 65 mph with a nearly full battery indicator. No need for regen so the ICE can just power the wheels. The best thing Ford could do is to give us the EV now or later button similar to the energi. It could be a software button. If they can't do that they should rebalance how much engine power is pulled off for regen at higher speeds.
-
Racine, WI Porcaro Ford. Overall they have been excellent to deal with.
-
My Passat TDI is EPA rated at 30 mpg city and I usually get 38, thats an 8 mpg difference in EPA number? Why no big media outcry over the EPAs unfair testing process with diesels? An error in calculation is an error regardless of what direction it takes on the number line.
Under promise and over deliver - always a good thing
Over promise and under deliver - always bad.
-
I see things are getting testy. Personally I don't think name calling and discounting anyone's opinion is helpful. Anyway I now have just over 5,000 miles on my C-MAX. My best tank so far has been 44 mpg but overall I am just under 42 and I am working hard to get that. I live in Wisconsin so it is colder but not as bad as usual. In the summer I am sure I will do better and who knows I might even get close to 47. Having said that for the most part I agree with skwcrj, but it depends on where and how you drive. Before you start calling me names let me tell you why.
First, my own personal experience. I come from a 2006 Civic hybrid. It is rated at 45 mpg highway and 42 combined. Most of my driving is freeway. Driving 70+ mph in that car upper 40's mpgs without trying was normal, 50+ if I tried. The last two days I had the C-MAX at the dealer so I went back to the civic. As a test I used cruise control as much as I could and got 51 mpg on the civic. The day before in the CMAX doing the same thing I got 43. The freeway portion was worse, I was just under 40 mpg with the CMAX but the city portion brought it back up. I have also run tests with the cruise control on so taking the driver completely out of it and at 65 or above I wasn't near 47 mpg. Yes, on perfectly flat roads in warmer temps you might do better but the CMAX is too tall and too heavy to get great mileage at high speeds. Hills don't help either. It is heavy going up and there is a lot of regen going down.
Also when I was test driving other cars with every one except the CMAX I did better than EPA. In the CMAX I drove 4 different ones and the best I did was 40 mpg. I bought it anyway because I liked it best and I was hoping I would do better with time and I have but 47 mpg so far on a tank hasn't happened. Yes I have had 50+ mpg 20+ mile drives( no freeway) and 70+ mpg short drives but it is the whole tank that matters. By the way. My indicated Mpg has almost always been higher than actual(most of the people on Fuelly say the same thing) so if you are going by what the car is indicating you are probably 1-2 mpgs less than that. I did a lot of research before and after buying the CMAX and I only found one that achieved above 47 and on the screen shot showing that if you look at the time traveled it was clear there was little if any freeway driving. Just like many of the pictures posted here. Every other one fell well short. That wouldn't be a problem except those same drivers usually did nearly as well in the much lower rated Camry Hybrid and many of them did better in the Prius V that Ford keeps saying they are better than. Say what you will about Fuelly.com but out of 36 CMAXs only 2 are doing 47 mpg or better and the average is less than 40 mpg. All the Prius hybrids and Civic Hybrid average at or above EPA.
Again, I like my CMAX but I think they stretched too far in calling this a 47 mpg city AND 47 highway mpg car. Will some people hit it, sure. When the average person can, then it is a 47 mpg car. Having said ALL that I think Ford with some software tweaks can make it better. Make the regen less agressive when the gas engine is running so it can be more efficient and perhaps use the battery more at 65+ mpg to assist the gas engine and take some of the load off it.
-
I tried some tests today. The conditions weren't the greatest with 10-15 mph winds out of the south and temps at 55 degrees. The test I did involved going 10.3 miles north and 10.3 miles south on the freeeway at a steady speed with Eco Cruise on. I started and stopped measuring the mileage at the same point each way to balance the wind and elevation differences between the two points and then averaging the mileage. Based on these tests and differences between actual and indicated mileage I had measured before at an average of 2.9% here is what I found. The 70 is a little off because I had to slow a couple times on the north trip. So, for what it's worth...
55 mph 51.6 mpg indicated 50.1 actual 9.4 ev miles
60 mph 46.0 mpg indicated 44.67 actual 6.7 ev miles
65 mph 43.15 mpg indicated 41.9 actual
70 mph 40.75 mpg indicated 39.57 actualOh, and I had my best tank yet today at 44 mpg over 480.5 miles. Considering the temps not too bad but I have been trying hard and compared to my Civic Hybrid still disappointing.
-
Anyone interested in improving their real world MPG, should review this article
You are right. While some of the techniques are easier in a hybrid they can work well for any vehicle.
-
I posted this in another thread but this might help some people achieve better mileage if you are new to hybrids.
-
For those who want to get the best possible mileage, maybe even hypermiling here is the place to go.
-
"I only have 500 miles on my SEL and am averaging now about 40 mpg.
A couple of comments regarding getting good mileage.
- As I understand it the advertised 47 mpg is a administered and simulated driving test done by a government agency. It appears that Ford has perfected the algorithm to maximize results using this test."
Actually the test is designed by the EPA but the actual testing is done by Ford(or someone Ford has hired). The EPA double checks about 15% of the ratings sent in by the manufacturers. I agree that Ford has found a way to get the best possible results from the test even if real world results don't match up very well. At some point either the test will be changed, or Ford will be forced to restate the mileage on the sticker similar to what Hyundai has.
- As I understand it the advertised 47 mpg is a administered and simulated driving test done by a government agency. It appears that Ford has perfected the algorithm to maximize results using this test."
-
Exactly right.
-
I drive quite a bit on the freeway with a good chunk of it at 65 mph and no matter how carefull I am whether using Eco Cruise or not I can't get to 47 mpg. I am in sales so I can drive quite a bit as well and I know what you mean about the first drive.My commute to work is 30 miles each way. I wouldn't describe myself as a hypermiler but I to take care to drive as efficienlty as possible, gliding as much as possible, coasting to stops etc. I have had 60+ mpg city drives but they can't make up for my highway drives. My comment on the Prius V was based on the reviews of both that I read and the results on Fuelly.com although granted there are very few C-Max's there so far. When I was test driving I didn't drive the V but I did the regular Prius and on a 30 mile mostly highway drive I got an indicated 53 mpg. In my Civic Hybrid which is rated at 45 mpg on the highway if I try 50 mpg is easy. I guess what I am saying is that for the average driver driving normally this isn't a 47 mpg car if there is a significant amount of highway driving and I also think it is harder to achieve the EPA rating on the C-MAX than it is on many other vehicles.
Again, I am not saying it is a bad car. In fact I think it is a very good one. I just think Ford stretched too far in claiming 47 mpg for both city and highway.
-
I don't think it is a matter of comparing the C-MAX to smaller cars, it is a matter of comparing the C-MAX to what Ford claims for this car. They advertise heavily that it gets better mileage to the Prius V when in real life the opposite appears to be the case. They advertise 47 mpg highway and so far it's not even close based on my own results, every review I have read and the cars listed on fuelly.com and the epa mileage site. Yes, over 47 in the city isn't a problem and I agree it is a great car, but it is a great 40-42 mpg car not 47 mpg like they advertise. By the way, I don't know if you are just using the computer for the mileage but checked against actual gas used vs miles driven the computer is usually 1-2 mpg too high.
Oh, and I have seen some fairly wide variances in indicated mileage when driving the driving the same route. I thought it was due to temperature but yesterday it was fairly cold and it was showing above 50 mpg in a stretch that normally shows about 40. No idea why, the battery level was about the same as always.
-
Is anyone else getting lower fuel mileage at say 62 than at 70?
What is happening is that when I am going 62, the car is switching between EV and gas. When it switches over to gas, the instantaneous MPG goes down to about 20. Whereas when I am going 70, the gas is getting 40 MPG. The amount of EV driving can't compensate for the low fuel mileage at 62.
Also, I have about 5k miles on my C-Max and am getting about 38MPG total. Tiny bit disappointed, but I am in sales and this is awesome compared to what I was getting with my last car.
I have seen the exact same thing.. It was a warmer day and while driving 67 mph I had gotten the indicated mileage(the computer is high by 1-2mpg) for the trip to just over 48 mpg. At this speed I had a stretch showing around 60 mpg. Then the speed limit dropped so I slowed down to 57 and my mileage dropped along with my speed to 45 mpg for the trip. It would have kept going down but I got off the freeway.Just like you it would kick into EV mode and when the battery was depleted the engine would kick on and the mileage would drop to 20 mpg or so. I think with a software change they can better balance when the gas or electric or both motors work to improve the highway mileage. Otherwise this isn't a 47 mpg highway car. I have 3000 miles on mine now and have been averaging 41.7 calculated. I have been working hard to get that. I come from a Civic Hybrid that was in the mid-upper 40's mpg without trying even though it is only rated at 42 combined so for me so far the C-MAX mileage is very dissappointing. Other than that though I like it better than the Civic.
You might find this interesting.
Upgrade to an Energi
in General Discussion
Posted
I disagree on the MPG's on trips. The extra weight doesn't hurt it that much at highway speeds. Remember it is actually higher rated by the EPA now than the regular hybrid on the highway. Depending on how long the trip is the initial 21 or so miles on battery will make up for a lot if not more than all of any actual reduction in highway mileage. Can't get around the space issue though.