EV Mode driving- Post your numbers

[wamba2000]

In several threads members have posted their results as part of comments.  Thought it would be interesting to post the following for the community to be able to compare.  Please list:

 

UPDATED: Dave, here is the template you used, good suggestion:

 

1. Model -Hybrid SEL

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 1352

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 639.8

4. Percentage drive EV to total - 47.3%

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 38

6. Lifetime mpg - 40.9

7. Lifetime brake score - 96%

8. Lifetime numbers - Dealer did "memory reset" to get rid of Check Engine light (which didn't help in any way) and my lifetime Regen number went to 0.00.  They had no explanation as to why. Number shown is since the re-set.

Edited March 23, 2013 by wamba2000

[Jus-A-CMax]

Sounds like you want LIFETIME and not individual trips, right? 

[DaveofDurham]

wamba2000 -

 

Thank you for posting these questions.  In addition to looking at EV miles as a percentage of total miles, I think it would be interesting (as first suggested by Plus 3 Golfer) to look at percent EV vs mpg AND percent EV vs gal/mi (or liters/km).  I was thinking about doing this too and posted some questions related to this in the thread titled "EV mode driving maximizing".

 

In that thread, I noted that one of the screens that comes up on the left when I turn off my car shows lifetime EV miles and lifetime regen miles.  Then I asked (and was hoping for feedback on) whether lifetime EV miles is the total lifetime EV miles (i.e., already includes lifetime regen miles) OR whether you need to add lifetime EV miles plus lifetime regen miles to get total lifetime EV miles (i.e., add #3 and #4 in your post to get the total lifetime EV miles).

 

I think lifetime EV miles already is the total (already includes regen miles) and so there is double counting if you add #3 and #4.

 

 Page 105 of the owner's manual which says:  

• Distance - The distance travelled on battery power only (EV distance)
and regen distance are displayed. Regen distance is the estimated
range gained from energy recaptured through regenerative braking.

 

When energy is taken from the hybrid battery to move the car in EV mode, there is no way for the car to know if that energy went into the battery via regen braking or when the ICE was running.   Regen miles (as described on pg 105 of the owner's manual) must be estimated indirectly based on the amount of energy that goes into the hybrid battery from regen braking.  Regen miles is shown as a separate figure to show the benefit we are getting from good (regen) braking. 

 

When the car is propelled in EV mode (energy is coming out of the battery to move the car) it would be easy for the computer to track the miles and it likely includes partial credit for when the car is propelled by EV and ICE working in tandem.

 

As of a few days ago over 4525 miles, we had 1847 EV miles [40.8%] and 288 regen miles [6.4%] - so I think our total percentage EV miles is 40.8%, not 47.2%  [40.8 + 6.4 = 47.2].

[wamba2000]

Justin- Yes, it would be lifetime that would be reported.

 

Dave, you other thread actually was what prompted my post. Sorry I did not recognize that the Regen miles were already included in the EV total.  I will change the original post to reference the right amounts.

 

Thanks

[DaveofDurham]

Dave, you other thread actually was what prompted my post. Sorry I did not recognize that the Regen miles were already included in the EV total.  I will change the original post to reference the right amounts.

 

Thanks

 

To have more data to play with, I would still about for lifetime regen miles.   I would also ask for lifetime mpg [so we can see how %EV miles and fuel economy (mpg or gal/mile) are related] and lifetime brake score too.

[valkraider]

 

 

1. Model - Energi SEL

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 5230.4

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 3509.9

4. Percentage drive EV to total - 67.1%

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 901.2

6. Lifetime mpg - 68.2

7. Lifetime brake score - 95%

8. All full lifetime figures - no resets (I took possession at 22miles on odo)

 

We have several road trips and ski season eating in to our EV percentage. :)

Edited March 24, 2013 by valkraider

[DaveofDurham]

My data are:

 

1. Model -Hybrid SEL

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 4653

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 1902

4. Percentage drive EV to total - 40.9%

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 299

6. Lifetime mpg - 40.2

7. Lifetime brake score - 93%

8. All full lifetime figures - no resets

[DaveofDurham]

wamba2000 and valkraider -

 

Can you update your submissions to include all the data elements I put in mine?

[plus 3 golfer]

1. Model -Hybrid SEL

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 2807

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 1109

4. Percentage drive EV to total - 39.5%

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 166

6. Lifetime mpg - 41.4

7. Lifetime brake score - 95%

8. All full lifetime figures - No, reset at 310 miles, Odometer currently reads 3117

[DaveofDurham]

wamba 2000 - Thanks for the data update.  I have a spreadsheet going.  Hope we will get data from a bunch more people.

[Rob]

You might not want Energi numbers:

 

1. Model - Energi

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 1268.7

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 1046

4. Percentage drive EV to total - 82.4%

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 287

6. Lifetime mpg - 130.6. (73.5 MPGe. 250 kw)

7. Lifetime brake score - 94%

8. Lifetime numbers - Reset after I took possession at 109 miles on the odometer.

 

16 mile round trip commute and no roadtrips yet. Perfect for the Energi, I think I'll get back the extra cost for the bigger battery.

Edited March 23, 2013 by Rob

[wamba2000]

Rob, Energi owners need to report, this is a great resource for those considering a purchase, to get real world numbers from owners.

 

The numbers are what they are, but provide a clear picture by type of vehicle.

 

Thanks for psoting

[DaveofDurham]

Rob -

 

Thanks for your submittal.  Energi data are fine - I plan to separate the Energi data and the Hybrid data.

 

Are there some additional items we should ask about for the Energi? 

 

What does "73.5 MPGe. 250 kw" mean on your lifetime mpg line?   [i looked at the manual and think the 250kw means you have used 250kwh of electric energy that went into your plug-in battery by plugging it in (charging) and the MPGe divides miles by the sum of your gallons of gas used plus "equivalent" gallons of gas calculated from your kwh usage via the plug-in battery.  Is this correct?  Do you know if the kwh figure comes from what you charge into your plug-in battery or what you take out of your plug-in battery?  Do you know how the equation for converting kwh to equivalent gallons of gas?]

 

 

Does the ENERGI tell you how many of your EV miles are from the plug-in battery and how many are from the regular hybrid battery?

 

Does the ENERGI get more regen than the HYBRID? Does regen braking on the ENERGI feed the plug-in battery or the regular hybrid battery or both?

Edited March 23, 2013 by DaveofDurham

[DaveofDurham]

wamba2000 -

 

Good morning.

 

We only have data on a few vehicles so far, but one thing I have noticed based on comparing two ENERGIs and two HYBRIDS is that the ENERGI appears to get more REGEN miles and a higher percentage of REGEN miles compared to EV miles and REGEN miles compared to total miles.  I don't understand this - that's why I asked Rob some more questions on this thread and valkraider some more questions in a private message.

 

As a last resort I may read some of the ENERGI specific info in the owner's manual.

Edited March 23, 2013 by DaveofDurham

[Rob]

Rob -

 

Thanks for your submittal.  Energi data are fine - I plan to separate the Energi data and the Hybrid data.

 

Are there some additional items we should ask about for the Energi? 

 

What does "73.5 MPGe. 250 kw" mean on your lifetime mpg line?   [i looked at the manual and think the 250kw means you have used 250kwh of electric energy that went into your plug-in battery by plugging it in (charging) and the MPGe divides miles by the sum of your gallons of gas used plus "equivalent" gallons of gas calculated from your kwh usage via the plug-in battery.  Is this correct?  Do you know if the kwh figure comes from what you charge into your plug-in battery or what you take out of your plug-in battery?  Do you know how the equation for converting kwh to equivalent gallons of gas?]

 

 

 

You are correct. The kw is the amount of energy the battery uses for propulsion. It doesn't count energy used by accessories or climate control. Between that and the fact that charging cannot be a perfectly efficient process the amount of kwh that come out of the wall will be higher. I'm guessing 10 to 15 %.

 

33.7 kwh is equal to one gallon of gas.

 

 

 

Does the ENERGI tell you how many of your EV miles are from the plug-in battery and how many are from the regular hybrid battery?

 

 

No. It doesn't distinguish the type of EV miles.

 

 

 

Does the ENERGI get more regen than the HYBRID? Does regen braking on the ENERGI feed the plug-in battery or the regular hybrid battery or both?

 

 

I don't know why the regen miles would be higher in an Energi. Seems like that is just an estimation anyway. Perhaps the algorithm to calculate that could be different (and maybe wrong). More numbers may shed some light on that.

 

It's easier to think of it as 2 batteries, but of course it is really just one. Fortunately regen returns energy to the battery when we are in hybrid or full EV mode. In fact, if we go down a significant enough hill we can recapture enough energy to switch us back from hybrid mode to a mode that shows us the all electric range of the battery. I believe Valkraider has gone down a mountain and charged his "big battery" from empty to over 50% full.

 

[Rob]

Now that I think of the regen miles, there has got to be more situations where the hybrid's battery is near capacity. In that case the car is unable to capture any regen energy because there is nowhere for that energy to go. So the hybrid would lose that opportunity.

[DaveofDurham]

valkraider -

 

Thanks for the data update.  Is 68.2 your MPG or mpgE?  Whichever it is, could you provide your other figure and your kwh?  [sorry to keep asking for more stuff, I'm still learning (with help from you and Rob) what to ask about the ENERGI.]

 

The info in your reply to my personal message was very helpful. 

 

I really thought the ENERGI had two separate hybrid batteries because that's what I was told at the dealership.  You explained in your reply to my PM: "The Energi only has one battery, all the stats come from the one single battery. The system merely creates a "virtual partition" (my description - not Fords) which just changes vehicle behavior based on settings and whatnot."

And in regard to why the ENERGI might rack up a lot more REGEN miles than the HYBRID: "The Energi has the same regen as the hybrid. Just with the bigger battery we have more potential storage.  I have a lot of regen because we live in the mountains, I have a lot of downhills. :)    Look at my thread about what you can do with a mountain and a battery."

 

I did look at your "what you can do" post when it went up.  I will look at it again. 

 

One thing I have been wondering about w REGEN and REGEN MILES is that I know this is going up when I lightly apply the brakes and see the spinning regen symbol above the battery level icon, but does this also go up when I am coasting down a hill?  I know energy is going into my battery when I am coasting, but the spinning regen symbol does not appear.  I need to drive to Asheville NC and see what happens when I come back down the big hill (cross the Eastern continental divide) on I-40 on the way home.

[asb]

1. Model -Hybrid SE

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 3299.8

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 1042.4

4. Percentage drive EV to total 

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 189.6

6. Lifetime mpg - 40.9

7. Lifetime brake score - 93%

[chuckles]

Here are my numbers for the first 2500 miles.  I can confirm that 4.5 to 5 % gallon error leads to the about the same MPG error where the indicated mileage is always higher than actual.  Wife has an 09 FEH and its indicated vs actual is off about the same.  There is no long trip in these numbers.  Big jump in mileage for that last fill may partially be due to the warmer weather in the Sandhills area of NC.  Turned colder after that last fillup and the indicated MPG is creeping down.

 

                                                                                                               INDICATED                     ACTUAL

DATE        ODOMETER   EV MILES      % EV               MILES    GALLONS        MPG      GALLONS        MPG         ENG MPG   GAL ERROR   MPG ERROR

28-Jan    765.2      281.6       56.24%   500.7     12.13       41.2      12.58      39.80       17.42     -3.58%      3.51%

7-Feb    1226.8      256.3       55.52%   461.6    10.79       42.7       11.27      40.96       18.22     -4.26%      4.25%

19-Feb  1630.0      221.3       54.89%   403.2      9.60       41.9       10.14      39.76       17.94     -5.33%      5.37%

4-Mar    1996.2      203.0       55.43%   366.2      8.68       41.9        9.40       38.96       17.36     -7.66%      7.55%

21-Mar  2533.6      326.7       60.79%   537.4     11.93      45.0       12.32      43.62       17.10     -3.17%      3.16%

                             1288.9      56.80%  2269.1    53.13     42.54       55.71     40.73        17.59     -4.63%     4.44%

Edited March 24, 2013 by chuckles

[JAZ]

If Charge Assist is selected in the Inform Display you will see an arrow above the battery icon when the system is charging and an arrow below the battery icon when the batteries are discharging.

[valkraider]

I really thought the ENERGI had two separate hybrid batteries because that's what I was told at the dealership.

Well, they told you wrong - not uncommon for dealers. :)

 

But if you want to get technical it's actually many small batteries wired together for both the hybrid and the Energi (in our case I believe it is a complex arrangement of both series & parallel) - all managed by a special battery management system.

 

All those small individual batteries are mounted together into a single large fairly armored box.

 

The computer controls it so that a charge level above a certain point and the car acts like the Energi with a "big battery" and a charge level below a certain point and the car acts like the hybrid with the "small battery".

Edited March 25, 2013 by valkraider

[Adair]

Model:                   SEL

Lifetime miles:       4180.05

Lifetime EV Miles:  2185.9

Lifetime Regen:     226.1

Lifetime Brake Score: 96%

Lifetime MPG:        36.2

First fill up:            12.7.12

Most recent:          3.25.13

[DaveofDurham]

1. Model -Hybrid SE

2. Lifetime Total Miles Driven - 3299.8

3. Lifetime EV miles driven - 1042.4

4. Percentage drive EV to total 

5. Lifetime Regen miles - 189.6

6. Lifetime mpg - 40.9

7. Lifetime brake score - 93%

 

asb   -

 

Thanks for posting your data.  You are the first SE to report.

[DaveofDurham]

Here are my numbers for the first 2500 miles.  I can confirm that 4.5 to 5 % gallon error leads to the about the same MPG error where the indicated mileage is always higher than actual.  Wife has an 09 FEH and its indicated vs actual is off about the same.  There is no long trip in these numbers.  Big jump in mileage for that last fill may partially be due to the warmer weather in the Sandhills area of NC.  Turned colder after that last fillup and the indicated MPG is creeping down.

 

                                                                                                               INDICATED                     ACTUAL

DATE        ODOMETER   EV MILES      % EV               MILES    GALLONS        MPG      GALLONS        MPG         ENG MPG   GAL ERROR   MPG ERROR

28-Jan    765.2      281.6       56.24%   500.7     12.13       41.2      12.58      39.80       17.42     -3.58%      3.51%

7-Feb    1226.8      256.3       55.52%   461.6    10.79       42.7       11.27      40.96       18.22     -4.26%      4.25%

19-Feb  1630.0      221.3       54.89%   403.2      9.60       41.9       10.14      39.76       17.94     -5.33%      5.37%

4-Mar    1996.2      203.0       55.43%   366.2      8.68       41.9        9.40       38.96       17.36     -7.66%      7.55%

21-Mar  2533.6      326.7       60.79%   537.4     11.93      45.0       12.32      43.62       17.10     -3.17%      3.16%

                             1288.9      56.80%  2269.1    53.13     42.54       55.71     40.73        17.59     -4.63%     4.44%

 

chuckles -

 

Thanks for posting your data.  Are you driving an SE or SEL?  How many regen miles do you have?

 

We drove our C-Max to Carthage and Southern Pines in February.

 

Are you saying that your actual miles are less than what your odometer shows?  I thought posters on other threads were saying that the odometer was reading low compared to what their GPS was showing.

Edited March 27, 2013 by DaveofDurham

[DaveofDurham]

Model:                   SEL

Lifetime miles:       4180.05

Lifetime EV Miles:  2185.9

Lifetime Regen:     226.1

Lifetime Brake Score: 96%

Lifetime MPG:        36.2

First fill up:            12.7.12

Most recent:          3.25.13

 

Adair -

 

Thanks for posting your data.