Jus Another Gas Pod

[mtb9153]

My lifetime brake score is currently at 91% and my roofline vs. tailgate alignment is much like shown in picture, I have a1/8" or better drop from the edge of the roofline to the edge of the roof spoiler.

[ptjones]

My roofline is the same, I hadn't noticed it before.  Paul

[fbov]

Gents, I assure you the step in the roofline isn't the issue it looks like it could be. I made a point of putting a row of tufts just downstream of the step. They're steady as a rock, just like the ones upstream. The whole roof looks laminar right to the rear edge, where you expect some turbulence. I come back to the relatively placid back window as a sign that there's nothing amiss above the beltline in this car.

 

And the back window is easy to confirm; no cameras needed! I hit 60mph headed home, and the window stayed calm, with an orderly, fan-shape pattern around the centerline.

 

Where do you get dirt on the back of the car? That's where you have a turbulence problem.

 

HAve fun,

Frank

[Joel Ramirez]

IS THERE A GALLERY WITH PLACEMENT OF THE PODS? ILL BE GETTING THEM AS SOON AS I HIT THE 2K MARK.  AND PLACEMENT IS EVERYTHING  FOR THESE THINGS. 

[ptjones]

IS THERE A GALLERY WITH PLACEMENT OF THE PODS? ILL BE GETTING THEM AS SOON AS I HIT THE 2K MARK.  AND PLACEMENT IS EVERYTHING  FOR THESE THINGS. 

No Galley, but instructions say to place 7-10 inches from rear edge. The only place practical is about a inch from rear deck  of hatch. That works out to be about 15" from back of vehicle. Hope to do some aerodynamic testing soon to figure out best placement of GasPods. Get the Magnetic ones.

 

Paul   

[salsaguy]

JUStin, so glad to hear you decided to try out the gas pods and test for yourself. if we can trust anyone data and testing methods it's yours for sure.

 

glad to see they are helping you out and working as advertised.

did you end up getting the magnetic ones, i hope.

 

on a decent note....

dude, what the heck happened though??? you in an accident?? i guess a LOT of changes happened while I have been away. :(

 

where can i read the post/story/thread about the incident as i am so behind in the posts now i won't be able to ever find it or catch up?

 

i hope you are ok.you mentioned ER! i spent enough time in the hospital last year to last me my life so i know how that goes...no fun for sure.

i also know all about getting your car totaled/damaged in an accident. happened to me last year in my old 2004.5 Passat.

 

I'm sad to hear if your mpg king/supreme being cmax car was totaled/damaged. Will they fix it?

wonder if you will get a 2014 to replace. I'm sure you've had some great times in your Cmax in the short time with it.

 

hope your/their insurance takes good care of you.

let me know if you need anything.

hope to meet you one day soon.

 

send me a separate email if you don't want to mess up this thread with your personal talk.

God bless

[Jus-A-CMax]

salsaguy-PM me mate...I cleared out a whole bunch of my PMs.

[catsailor]

 

Here is a copy of my note to Susanne about my 2000 mile experiment with Gas Pods, I never intended to do extreme testing or add tell tales and video them to confirm streamlines. I mounted these Sept. 28 th and completed 2011 miles Nov. 9 th and averaged 47 MPG combined. Loaded, Highway, city, congested traffic, etc. Did not change how I drive and the weather here is only getting cooler. Take the test program and make you own conclusions but for me I want to run these for one whole year. To be frank I am afraid to remove them now :) My picture of my gauge is also included so you can see the amount of hours and fuel consumed.

 

"Susanne,

                You can confirm on my Fuelly account “Road Warrior” my 2000 mile Gas Pods test. I am very happy and these will REMAIN on my C Max forever. It’s extremely difficult to hold any conditions constant on my Hybrid since shit changes with vehicle loading, terrain, wind and outside temperature as well ancillary power used such as night lighting, heating or air-conditioning. My FEEL for the car which I have owned since Sept 2012 and my mileage FE feel tells me that these WORK. Based on isolated highway readings off my gas gauges I think +2-4 mpg and all around +1-2 MPG. You can look at my Fuelly Logs and confirm and advise me if you think differently. Please feel free to continue to monitor what I am doing. Many thanks for your fine product.

 

Pictured is a snap shot of +2000 miles off my car gauges with gas pods, this will differ from Fuelly since I top off with every tank and I can guarantee what the actual fuel pumped is based on fuel temps and vapor pressures at each pump J THANKS Catsailor"

Edited November 10, 2013 by catsailor

[Adair]

Ok, you guys have convinced me!! I signed up for the test crew and ordered my black gas pods!! It's not even winter yet and my FE is slowly tanking! Down from a high of 49mpg on my same daily route to 44.9 right now. I know, I know.....that's still great, and within the new ratings, but now that I've seen what's possible, I'm willing to take a gamble on these thingies, based on the success of mtb, Jus, and now catsailor! Besides, it's 44* here now and it's gonna get much, much colder as the days go on.

 

Thank you all for sharing your information! I'll do the same.

[fbov]

In the spirit of info sharing... I finally finished enough runs to end the tire pressure test (still need to document it) and was getting antsy for better highway mileage before the snow flies, so...

 

I didn't use GasPods, I bought AirTabs, a competing vortex generator product that traces its design to the original Wheeler patents, but was developed to improve tractor-trailer performance. As such, they are larger in cross-sectional area, and I suspect, create a far more powerful vortex, and in pairs. Most impressive was the range of third party wind tunnel testing (vs. simulations), including automotive applications. As we'll see, application is critical.

 

Having done a tuft test to analyze the car's air flow patterns and issues, my plan was to attach these to the sides, from thebeltline down. Tuft testing showed excellent ariflow off the roof and around the side glass at the rear, but lots of turbulence coming off the sides of the car. I figured one VG behind the taillight above the crease, and another below, with additional VGs trailing down behind the wheel well. Then I thought the better of placing them in separated flow (vortex generators only work well in laminar flow) and resigned myself to having extras.

 

Then I tried dry fitting them... FAIL. The bodywork is subtly curved, while AirTabs are rigid plastic with a flat base, perfect for applying to the side of a trailer. Their function is dependent on a flush lead edge, and there was no way to bend them around the contours. (I'll be working on that this Winter.) As delivered, the roof and rear hatch were the only places I might fruitfully mount them!

 

So, I mounted them where I knew I didn't need them, because it was the only place they fit. I then defined an "aero-drag stress test" - a short round trip on the interstate. 10 miles on the NYS Thruway, exit, re-enter and repeat. I did 2 runs, installing AirTabs on the front edge of the rear hatch in between. Data is taken from the internal mileage display, reset at a specifc mile marker, each way. I included a 7 mile warm-up run and plenty of time to come up to speed. I did double-click the cruise when cresting hills, but at these speeds, it had little affect.

Control

47F @ 17:00, Eco Cruise set at 70 (and reading 70)

Westbound: 37.9 MPG

Eastbound: 37.5 MPG

 

Test

48F @ 18:00, Eco Cruise set at 70 (and reading 69)

Westbound: 36.5 MPG

Eastbound: 36.9 MPG

 

Not a very good test, but one that should not have shown poorer performance unless the test parts were a real step backwards. I expected a toss-up - no difference within noise - not a clear failure. I consider a 1MPG reduction with test parts to be a failure.

 

Conversely, this is a perfect place for confirmation bias to rear its ugly head. Could my knowledge of the car's air flow cause me to do something subliminally different for the test runs? If anything, I consciously erred in favor of the test by leaving Eco Cruise set a little lower and running at a little warmer temperature (warm evening with rising temps).

 

Regardless, Porter is back to stock configuration, and I'm thinking in terms of sanding mandrels and heat guns for shaping VG's for the sides...

 

And wondering if smaller devices might have beneficial effects... application is everything when dealing with aero-magic.

 

HAve fun,

Frank

[Jus-A-CMax]

I agree - confirmation bias was on top of my :airquote:  be wary which is why I did my tests before I got the gas pods and even when it was not on my mind so that I know I was driving the max for it. Then I apply the same driving style to the ones with gas pods. Also, interestingly - as you observed, I took it off and got better (to work) than my pre-gas pods but not as near as I got with the gas pods....but still ended the same as the pre-gas pods averages. It doesn't matter, I am going to repeat this test once Maxine comes home since I have baselines to compare and see if the accident has hurt her in other ways...I am not done yet.

 

I did read your tuft test with great interest, and while I accept the airflow from the top appears clean all the down mid rear window, then the turbulence takes over as you can clearly see the tufts next to the number plate go outward.

 

So what the hell are the Gas Pods doing to make it glide much better then when its on the top rear shelf as logically just based on the tuft, we should not disturb it? Perhaps does it do something to the air beyond the tuft measured area, analogically, be like seeing only the front of the tornado but not knowing the inner bands and inside are doing? Also could it be better to have the side placement of Gas Pods be a much better improvement? Or do them both? ptjones - you have the car, pods and time to do some tuft test on this, as well as a very understanding wife who would be willing to be chase car? Brother Mike?

 

I would luv to see some real wind tunnel on our car....Ford probably has this.

[fbov]

You've described my in-head discussions to a T. My mind likes to visualize, so I've been trying to see the airflows above the surface as well as on it. There's enough out there on VG's that their basic function is not hard to understand. It's the interaction with other solids in the air flow; VGs on wings that serve to increase lift and/or prevent stalls...

 

That's one reason I tried AirTabs; I can see how a panel edge can be extended aerodynamically by an array of vortices comming off the edge. My thought process was to add them down the side, from taillight down. The vortices would form parallel to the ground and create a barrier to air wrapping around the side, not unlike a boattail. We'll see if a little sanding and heat re-forming can give me parts to test... in the Spring.

 

BTW, my subjective impression of my AirTab test was also negative; I didn't "feel the glide."

 

Finally, there was one test I didn't get to this weekend. I've got a pair of vacuum gauges and 40' of tubing, but didn't have the time to shake out the system and take useful data. When air is flowing over the car, it causes local pressure changes. As we alter the air flow on the car, we ought to see measurable changes in local air pressure, if your gauge is sensitive enough...

 

Did I mention Sunday was my wife's birthday?

 

Have fun,

Frank

[Jus-A-CMax]

Well Happy Belated Birthday to your better half, Frank :)  Let us know if she reads this forum, I'll be more than happy to start a Birthday thread ;)

[ptjones]

Trying to figure out way of getting a high speed Camera or at least a high resolution one and Zoom maybe. I'm pretty sure the underside of the car is a high pressure area from the evidence of it keeps on blowing off my left wheel cover. Work in progress.

 

Paul

[fbov]

Thanks for the offer Jus, but Marj is best described as "tolerant" regarding my science project, because when she isn't, I remind her who named it a "science project."

 

Paul you and Matt have me wondering if my pizza pans are going to stay on! (They're wheel covers for snow tires.) I replied on the aero mod thread.