djc Posted March 10, 2016 Report Share Posted March 10, 2016 New Car and Driver review of Toyota Two Eco sheds a bit more light on how Eco differs from new Prius models. The Eco is EPA rated at 58mpg city - 4 mpg more than non-Eco models.http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2016-toyota-prius-two-eco-test-reviewThe Prius Two Eco model costs $500 more than the standard level "Two". The Eco saves 65 lbs by using Li-ion battery and has an inflater kit instead of spare tire. Wheels are 15". This model also "gets special Dunlop Enasave 01 A/S low-rolling-resistance tires, inflated to slightly higher pressures, and a solar-reflecting windshield to reduce the air conditioner’s workload. " According to an owner post elsewhere, recommended pressures for the Two Eco are 39 front 36 rear, whereas the non-Eco models are 36psi all around. The door-jamb sticker says the optional 17" wheels on other 2016 Prius models with lower profile (45) tires get 32/33 psi:http://priuschat.com/threads/tire-pressure-from-dealer-50-lbs.162375/The review reports the Dunlops are noisy. A web search reveals the Dunlops are also used on the Mitsubishi i MiEV and appear to be available only in 14" and 15" size. Tirerack says larger tire diameters mean higher rolling resistance. http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=175Car and Driver also says:"Overall, the new lighter and more compact Prius powertrain is more like the Ford hybrid transaxle arrangement, which is based on Toyota patents. " Also Toyota reportedly cut drive-train electronics losses by 20% (in the Fords, the electronics has its own liquid cooling system, a symptom of the large conversion losses - it s not clear to me if Toyota needs a separate cooling system). Elsewhere on these forums there has been discussion of shifting to N and coasting rather than using regen to avoid those losses.SO: special 15" Dunlops on the Eco, running 3 psi higher in the front only, No spare tire. Hard to believe that can produce 4mpg more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottwood2 Posted March 10, 2016 Report Share Posted March 10, 2016 Thx for posting that. Interesting. There has been a lot of talk about this car in general. I have seen few times now that they are stating that the Prius can now drive up to 25 MPH on electric only and can do so for up to a mile. Funny I just drove to my voting location and back the other day on all electric. It is not that far, less than a mile round trip but I was going more than 25 MPH doing so. Not the first time I have done this. My record is about a mile on all electric on main roads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted March 10, 2016 Report Share Posted March 10, 2016 With fully charged HVB should be able to go 2mi. with battery cold and not going above 34mph or ICE will turn on. :) Being use to the CMAX, the Prius has no EV power to accelerate, I think I can accelerate to 60mph in EV mode. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raadsel Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 Thx for posting that. Interesting. There has been a lot of talk about this car in general. I have seen few times now that they are stating that the Prius can now drive up to 25 MPH on electric only and can do so for up to a mile. Funny I just drove to my voting location and back the other day on all electric. It is not that far, less than a mile round trip but I was going more than 25 MPH doing so. Not the first time I have done this. My record is about a mile on all electric on main roads. I think the real trick would be staying below 25 mpg for a mile. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesmith Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 Thx for posting that. Interesting. There has been a lot of talk about this car in general. I have seen few times now that they are stating that the Prius can now drive up to 25 MPH on electric only and can do so for up to a mile. Funny I just drove to my voting location and back the other day on all electric. It is not that far, less than a mile round trip but I was going more than 25 MPH doing so. Not the first time I have done this. My record is about a mile on all electric on main roads. That's kinda weird. I haven't followed the Prius C, eco or newer models much but my 2004 Prius can do 35MPH on electric only. IIRC, it would have a couple mile range if the battery was fully charged. The newer models have only had higher limits as far as I recall... I know from personal experience that I've definitely done more than a mile at 30mph with no ICE in the Prius more than a few times... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 That's kinda weird. I haven't followed the Prius C, eco or newer models much but my 2004 Prius can do 35MPH on electric only. IIRC, it would have a couple mile range if the battery was fully charged. The newer models have only had higher limits as far as I recall... I know from personal experience that I've definitely done more than a mile at 30mph with no ICE in the Prius more than a few times...I have driven my Daughter's 2011 Prius and I found it was very difficult to accelerate from a stop to 25mph and above that it would go to ICE. The bottom line is the Prius uses a different strategy of the ICE running most of the time and the CMAX in my case the ICE is down to a low of only 28% of the time. The important thing here is the ICE at best 30% efficient and the Electric Motor is 70% efficient so the more time EVing the better your MPG's. :) Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesmith Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 I have driven my Daughter's 2011 Prius and I found it was very difficult to accelerate from a stop to 25mph and above that it would go to ICE. The bottom line is the Prius uses a different strategy of the ICE running most of the time and the CMAX in my case the ICE is down to a low of only 28% of the time. The important thing here is the ICE at best 30% efficient and the Electric Motor is 70% efficient so the more time EVing the better your MPG's. :) Paul My C-Max is an Energi so I'm not quite sure how it's "hybrid" mode compares to the C-Max hybrid model, but from what I've seen, I would definitely agree that my Prius is much more likely to run the ICE. The Prius definitely requires a gentle touch and prefers to have well over half the battery to allow such things. Actually the biggest thing I've noticed is that the C-Max seems as though it allows the engine to turn off before it's fully up to temperature whereas the Prius seems to almost require the water and/or cat temps to be kept up near operating temperature. With my Energi I'll fully agree that running on EV is more efficient. It just gets a bit muddier in hybrid mode since that power to run on EV has to come from gas unless you're doing something like pushing your car via foot power up hills instead of using the ICE... So you're using the inefficiency of gas and electric... The sweet spot seems to be along the lines of keeping the ICE in it's most efficient rpm(not sure what that is with the C-Max) so that it's generating the most power(whether that's direct to the wheels to move forward or to charge the battery) per gallon of gas. Levi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevedebi Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 My C-Max is an Energi so I'm not quite sure how it's "hybrid" mode compares to the C-Max hybrid model, but from what I've seen, I would definitely agree that my Prius is much more likely to run the ICE. The Prius definitely requires a gentle touch and prefers to have well over half the battery to allow such things. Actually the biggest thing I've noticed is that the C-Max seems as though it allows the engine to turn off before it's fully up to temperature whereas the Prius seems to almost require the water and/or cat temps to be kept up near operating temperature. With my Energi I'll fully agree that running on EV is more efficient. It just gets a bit muddier in hybrid mode since that power to run on EV has to come from gas unless you're doing something like pushing your car via foot power up hills instead of using the ICE... So you're using the inefficiency of gas and electric... The sweet spot seems to be along the lines of keeping the ICE in it's most efficient rpm(not sure what that is with the C-Max) so that it's generating the most power(whether that's direct to the wheels to move forward or to charge the battery) per gallon of gas. LeviJust for information, another Energi owner here. The hybrid runs like the Energi in EV Later mode. Or if you run out of EV Only battery, it will then be exactly like the Hybrid. If you want to try it, just don't charge the car for a couple of days. However, there is one important difference. When the hybrid HVB gets full, it will run the engine without gas going downhill. The Energi will do this also, but first it will just put the energy back into the HVB. It will eventually get to the "full HVB", but it takes a lot longer. The only other major differences are that the Energi has a dual heater system, where it provides electric heat when the ICE is not warmed up, and the Energi has a different final gear ratio for the transmission - a little higher geared than the hybrid C-Max. Sorry it intrude into the hybrid discussion, but maybe folks over here will like the information as well. ptjones 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesmith Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 Just for information, another Energi owner here. The hybrid runs like the Energi in EV Later mode. Or if you run out of EV Only battery, it will then be exactly like the Hybrid. If you want to try it, just don't charge the car for a couple of days. However, there is one important difference. When the hybrid HVB gets full, it will run the engine without gas going downhill. The Energi will do this also, but first it will just put the energy back into the HVB. It will eventually get to the "full HVB", but it takes a lot longer. The only other major differences are that the Energi has a dual heater system, where it provides electric heat when the ICE is not warmed up, and the Energi has a different final gear ratio for the transmission - a little higher geared than the hybrid C-Max. Sorry it intrude into the hybrid discussion, but maybe folks over here will like the information as well. Oh, I'm familiar with hybrid mode. I generally use it for around 7 miles per day after the plug in portion runs out. I don't think I've ever taken a trip and made it back home still in EV mode. (Work is 13 miles away, no real place to recharge other than home and there are hills) I just didn't know if it had different operating parameters than the C-Max Hybrid when in that mode. It sounds like it should be about the same with some minor differences given the final drive ratio and possible electric heater use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevedebi Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 Oh, I'm familiar with hybrid mode. I generally use it for around 7 miles per day after the plug in portion runs out. I don't think I've ever taken a trip and made it back home still in EV mode. (Work is 13 miles away, no real place to recharge other than home and there are hills) I just didn't know if it had different operating parameters than the C-Max Hybrid when in that mode. It sounds like it should be about the same with some minor differences given the final drive ratio and possible electric heater use.That electric heater drains a lot of energy. I know a lot of folks who forgo heat and just use an extra coat and the seat heaters. Me, I use it when I need to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livesmith Posted March 11, 2016 Report Share Posted March 11, 2016 That electric heater drains a lot of energy. I know a lot of folks who forgo heat and just use an extra coat and the seat heaters. Me, I use it when I need to.yeah, that's pretty much what I do. I tend to just be cold down to around 20F, more likely to use the heater below that. And I'll use it once the car is warmed up if the ICE needs to run anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptjones Posted March 14, 2016 Report Share Posted March 14, 2016 Well I drove the New 2016 Prius 4 at the Atlanta Auto Show and does seem to be a little better driving experience as compared to my Daughter's 2011 Prius, still anemic by CMAX standards. Heads up display was interesting with MPH and power being used. The seats are better but rear head room has gone down. Still not crazy about the outside look. It has aluminum wheel with plastic covers that stick out about 3/8" that have very little openings to make them more aerodynamic. I still hate the little shiftier. They had the Prius in Sport Mode so I know I didn't help their MPG's. :lol2: Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmax-nynj Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 (edited) Paying $500 more to gain 4MPG / lose tire grip / lose a valuable spare tire while gas is below $2/gal is ____________-. Edited March 15, 2016 by cmax-nynj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnowStorm Posted March 15, 2016 Report Share Posted March 15, 2016 Being a good Priusite! C-MaxSea 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.