AgentCMAX Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 Just like every other car component (and everything else in life), the batteries used in hybrid powertrains degrade and eventually wear out. But a buyer paying a premium for a hybrid wants the best possible information about just how long those components will last. To try and predict how these batteries will fare, Ford developed the Key Life Test, which is actually a batch of tests designed to put 150,000 miles and a decade’s worth of wear and tear on its lithium-ion batteries in just 10 months. Read more: How to Stress-Test Hybrid Batteries - Popular Mechanics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinto Posted December 21, 2012 Report Share Posted December 21, 2012 That is impressive. Only 10-15% degradation after that much use. Comforting information - Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ldm Posted December 25, 2012 Report Share Posted December 25, 2012 I was happy to learn that the C Max has the Li-ion battery and that's one of the reason we have a C Max on order now. This article makes me happier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNCGeek Posted December 26, 2012 Report Share Posted December 26, 2012 It is a good thing Ford chose to test the batteries in Phoenix which is probably the worst environment for both people and batteries alike. I have to wonder what the secret sauce is that will keep something like this from happening. Is it simply their arrangement for cooling the battery, or possibly because it is a hybrid and since most people would run the A/C anyway in those conditions, they limit the discharge on the pack until conditions are better for it's long term survival. The only thing that the car has to use the battery for is backing up so maybe a strategy to help keep the pack in shape would be to back into parking spots in the hottest summer months so the car can be driven forward when the car heats up again. According to an article I found, a test by the Phoenix Fire Department found this:"When temperatures outside reach 100 degrees, the temperature inside a car can reach 138 degrees in five minutes and 150 in 15, even with a window partially open. Having the windows down even 1 inch causes only a slight temperature drop." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelld Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 (edited) It is a good thing Ford chose to test the batteries in Phoenix which is probably the worst environment for both people and batteries alike. I have to wonder what the secret sauce is that will keep something like this from happening. Is it simply their arrangement for cooling the battery, or possibly because it is a hybrid and since most people would run the A/C anyway in those conditions, they limit the discharge on the pack until conditions are better for it's long term survival. The only thing that the car has to use the battery for is backing up so maybe a strategy to help keep the pack in shape would be to back into parking spots in the hottest summer months so the car can be driven forward when the car heats up again. According to an article I found, a test by the Phoenix Fire Department found this:"When temperatures outside reach 100 degrees, the temperature inside a car can reach 138 degrees in five minutes and 150 in 15, even with a window partially open. Having the windows down even 1 inch causes only a slight temperature drop." Concern for battery endurance in extreme heat is the only reason I didn't buy the C-Max Energi. Summer of 2011 we had 47 days of heat exceeding 100 degrees. http://dallas.about.com/od/neighborhoods/qt/Dfw-Weather-Tuesday-40-Straight-Days-Of-100-Degrees-Or-Higher-And-Counting.htm Edited December 27, 2012 by darrelld Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valkraider Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 The battery is vented to the vehicle interior. Unless you bake yourselves, the battery will be reasonably comfortable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelld Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 The battery is vented to the vehicle interior. Unless you bake yourselves, the battery will be reasonably comfortable. What happens when you plug in at the local Whole Foods and the outside temp is 110 degrees. I have seen my dash temp read 120+ in July-August. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valkraider Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 Turn on the A/C. You ride around with a 110 degree interior? But then again, that's why I left the south.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelld Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 (edited) Turn on the A/C. You ride around with a 110 degree interior? But then again, that's why I left the south.... I have the A/C on when I am in the car and that would not be an issue. What I could see as an issue is what Leaf owners experienced in Arizona. The owner would park and charge in the 100+ degree heat causing the battery chemisty to fatigue sooner than in cooler conditions. http://gas2.org/2012/09/25/nissan-responds-to-leaf-owners-battery-woes/ I followed this story closely when deciding to go C-Max or C-Max Energi. Edited December 27, 2012 by darrelld Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valkraider Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 The Leaf doesn't have active battery cooling, and is only cooled by ambient outside air. The C-Max Energi has active cooling (air) and is cooled by the air inside the cabin. If you are comfortable in the cabin, the battery should be as well. The problem with the Leaf is the same problem air cooled VWs and Harley Davidson's have in extreme heat. Passive radiant temperature management doesn't work near the extremes. The Energi battery temp is actively controlled, although only with air - so it is better than the passive but not as good as say the Volt which has active temp control using liquid systems. Liquid works better than air but add complexity and weight. Air works OK but will have its limitations too. Passive like the Leaf will not work in extreme cold or heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelld Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 The Leaf doesn't have active battery cooling, and is only cooled by ambient outside air. The C-Max Energi has active cooling (air) and is cooled by the air inside the cabin. If you are comfortable in the cabin, the battery should be as well. The problem with the Leaf is the same problem air cooled VWs and Harley Davidson's have in extreme heat. Passive radiant temperature management doesn't work near the extremes. The Energi battery temp is actively controlled, although only with air - so it is better than the passive but not as good as say the Volt which has active temp control using liquid systems. Liquid works better than air but add complexity and weight. Air works OK but will have its limitations too. Passive like the Leaf will not work in extreme cold or heat. If I understand the behavior you describe. You plug in your C-Max Energi after you have parked and left the vehicle it will use the passenger climate control to air cool the batteries while charging? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valkraider Posted December 27, 2012 Report Share Posted December 27, 2012 That is the theory. It's winter time though so we won't know for sure for a few more months. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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