My 2013 Ford C-Max Energi Trans Issues Solved

[rowekmr]

First I want to thank Stratosurfer and Snowstorm and all else who have answered my questions and didn't mind me jumping on their thread to get some clarification. I have owned a 2013 Fusion Energi that I gave my parents that didn't have any issues. I have bought and sold a few Energis mainly 2013-2014's and didn't have any issues with drivetrains until I got this 2013 C-Max Energi with 106k miles from auction. I bought it sight unseen after looking up the Autocheck that showed dealership visits that I thought were good maintenance but now I know at least the last one was for transmission and hence why it was probably put in auction.

 

When it arrived it drove in EV around lot and didn't notice anything until I forced ICE by putting it in EV later and pressing the accelerator pedal while in neutral and the gas engine started in high idle and sounded like marbles were loose in engine/trans. Because of that I drove it only short distances in EV and only difference I could tell was during regen braking I could hear a louder than normal whine. I then drove it in EV later mode and with gas engine in normal driving I could only detect more noises with window down at high idle in traffic (HVAC operation). In normal driving esp cruising down highway I really couldn't tell the difference especially if I had passengers/radio/cell phone talk.

 

At this point I went on Youtube and did Google search and found the most information in this forum. I took the car to Ford for recall check, oil change and request to check drive train noise trans TSB (I printed them out) and what the service writer told me was that i need transmission. They of course gave me the 7K+ estimate for new trans then I started to look at surrounding dealership prices for new trans prices which hovered in the mod 4k's with my pricing. I went to the parts guy at original Ford and he found a reman that was 3900. I then took that part # then went to other dealership and found the lowest price at 3300 with new part warranty. Mistake #1 I didn't buy that one.

 

The Ford dealership where I have an account at I met the tech who said he does side jobs and would R/R my trans and correct any issues encountered plus fresh fluids. I started looking at parts yards with car-parts.com and using the VIN# of donor. This method seemed to show that trans from 2013-2016 will fit. It wasn't until I used 2017 VIN's that I could see a change i part #'s. I tried to get a 2016 trans which many said had updates that addressed the bearing issues. I also found that in the production of 2016 trans they were divided in the build dates of 2015 with some made up to a date then the ones build after a date.

 

In the meanwhile I asked tech to split trans and check the issues. He found multiple bearing failures including main shaft. He said he did not feel it would be worth it to replace all. I listened and continued the trans search. I found my 2016 trans with 55k miles and got it for 1000 plus 300 for 3 years parts and labor warranty at $55 per hour.I drove and picked up the transmission and noticed immediately it wasn't on a skid which was an indicator of future problems. I had then load it on a skid then in the back of the pick up bed with fork lift and I notice a tab broken off. I took pic and sent it to tech that said it was just a lifting tab so I strapped it down and drove back the 5 hours (11 hours round trip) during the beginning of the COVID pandemic. Once I got it to tech house he took it off with a cherry picker did I mention the trans weighs more than 400# and isn't something I would want to move around myself. A few days later he called and said it was dropped on the side and had a crack in case, deformed test port and the pump was broken off. Long story short I wasted my time getting that trans and began looking for another. Fortunately I got a full refund and didn't have to bring the transmission back. I was VERY thankful for them for understanding. Then I began to look at 2013 trans which were more plentiful at yards but none with low miles and the ones with mid miles (more than my car) were close to and over 2K! Then I called the dealerships about the 3300 reman and now it was increased to mid to high 4k's. Maybe Ford made an adjustment to prices to adjust for demand...mines LOL!

 

I went back to looking at used trans and found a 2005 trans with 89k at LKQ for 1030 my price that they delivered to my local yard and I picked it up and later brought back the bad trans for 75 core deposit. My tech remove the subframe and raised the car from the engine/trans. He checked the exterior of trans, flushed fluid and installed it and did any software updates. He had to do an alignment and recharge the AC then test drove it to check it all out. FInal cost was 1030 for used trans and 1200 labor, fluids 40 and I needed a new battery at 135. 

 

Well I picked it up today and will try to drive/enjoy the new life in the car. I hope to show that there are options to the 7K that Ford will quote but I realize my trans is also used but it has a 6 month warranty. In hindsight I should have paid the 225 for 3 years parts/labor warranty but had issues paying almost 25% for warranty but the labor for these trans is considerable.

 

 

[plus 3 golfer]

13 hours ago, rowekmr said:

First I want to thank Stratosurfer and Snowstorm and all else who have answered my questions and didn't mind me jumping on their thread to get some clarification. I have owned a 2013 Fusion Energi that I gave my parents that didn't have any issues. I have bought and sold a few Energis mainly 2013-2014's and didn't have any issues with drivetrains until I got this 2013 C-Max Energi with 106k miles from auction. I bought it sight unseen after looking up the Autocheck that showed dealership visits that I thought were good maintenance but now I know at least the last one was for transmission and hence why it was probably put in auction.

 

When it arrived it drove in EV around lot and didn't notice anything until I forced ICE by putting it in EV later and pressing the accelerator pedal while in neutral and the gas engine started in high idle and sounded like marbles were loose in engine/trans. Because of that I drove it only short distances in EV and only difference I could tell was during regen braking I could hear a louder than normal whine. I then drove it in EV later mode and with gas engine in normal driving I could only detect more noises with window down at high idle in traffic (HVAC operation). In normal driving esp cruising down highway I really couldn't tell the difference especially if I had passengers/radio/cell phone talk.

 

At this point I went on Youtube and did Google search and found the most information in this forum. I took the car to Ford for recall check, oil change and request to check drive train noise trans TSB (I printed them out) and what the service writer told me was that i need transmission. They of course gave me the 7K+ estimate for new trans then I started to look at surrounding dealership prices for new trans prices which hovered in the mod 4k's with my pricing. I went to the parts guy at original Ford and he found a reman that was 3900. I then took that part # then went to other dealership and found the lowest price at 3300 with new part warranty. Mistake #1 I didn't buy that one.

 

The Ford dealership where I have an account at I met the tech who said he does side jobs and would R/R my trans and correct any issues encountered plus fresh fluids. I started looking at parts yards with car-parts.com and using the VIN# of donor. This method seemed to show that trans from 2013-2016 will fit. It wasn't until I used 2017 VIN's that I could see a change i part #'s. I tried to get a 2016 trans which many said had updates that addressed the bearing issues. I also found that in the production of 2016 trans they were divided in the build dates of 2015 with some made up to a date then the ones build after a date.

 

In the meanwhile I asked tech to split trans and check the issues. He found multiple bearing failures including main shaft. He said he did not feel it would be worth it to replace all. I listened and continued the trans search. I found my 2016 trans with 55k miles and got it for 1000 plus 300 for 3 years parts and labor warranty at $55 per hour.I drove and picked up the transmission and noticed immediately it wasn't on a skid which was an indicator of future problems. I had then load it on a skid then in the back of the pick up bed with fork lift and I notice a tab broken off. I took pic and sent it to tech that said it was just a lifting tab so I strapped it down and drove back the 5 hours (11 hours round trip) during the beginning of the COVID pandemic. Once I got it to tech house he took it off with a cherry picker did I mention the trans weighs more than 400# and isn't something I would want to move around myself. A few days later he called and said it was dropped on the side and had a crack in case, deformed test port and the pump was broken off. Long story short I wasted my time getting that trans and began looking for another. Fortunately I got a full refund and didn't have to bring the transmission back. I was VERY thankful for them for understanding. Then I began to look at 2013 trans which were more plentiful at yards but none with low miles and the ones with mid miles (more than my car) were close to and over 2K! Then I called the dealerships about the 3300 reman and now it was increased to mid to high 4k's. Maybe Ford made an adjustment to prices to adjust for demand...mines LOL!

 

I went back to looking at used trans and found a 2005 trans with 89k at LKQ for 1030 my price that they delivered to my local yard and I picked it up and later brought back the bad trans for 75 core deposit. My tech remove the subframe and raised the car from the engine/trans. He checked the exterior of trans, flushed fluid and installed it and did any software updates. He had to do an alignment and recharge the AC then test drove it to check it all out. FInal cost was 1030 for used trans and 1200 labor, fluids 40 and I needed a new battery at 135. 

 

Well I picked it up today and will try to drive/enjoy the new life in the car. I hope to show that there are options to the 7K that Ford will quote but I realize my trans is also used but it has a 6 month warranty. In hindsight I should have paid the 225 for 3 years parts/labor warranty but had issues paying almost 25% for warranty but the labor for these trans is considerable.

 

 

Nice write up.  

 

The fundamental issue facing owners of vehicles whose HF35 transmissions fail will be that most likely will not have the wherewithal (or want to do) what you, Snowstorm, and Stratosurfer did to reduce the dealer cost of $7k+ by up to 2/3.  Spending around $2500 makes sense especially if one can get a 3 year warranty but spending around $7500 on the C-Max with over 100k miles and likely 6+ years old is questionable.

[ncsugrad2002]

I asked this question on another forum, but I just wanted to confirm.  My particular vehicle is a 2013 Fusion Energi, but I'm assuming what I'm about to ask will carry over from the C-Max to the fusion fairly reliably.

 

I recently picked up a 2013 Fusion Energi that is over 100K, so just outside of warranty. No transmission issues at this time.  No noises, etc. so hopefully it’s fine for a long time, but I know the reality is it may need a transmission at some point and no way I’m paying full price for a new one. I love the car so far. It has every option except cooled seats. The last time I had this many toys was in a BMW but my god it took a full time job just to keep up with how fast toys broke on that thing. 
 

So, I’m curious what vehicle model year used transmissions would be compatible with this vehicle? Would a 2015 or 2016 Fusion Energi transmission work in a 2013 like it was for yours?  What about a 2015-2016 c-max energi? The 2013/2014 pull outs are hard to come by, for obvious reasons. 2015-2016 Energi transmissions are easier to find and cheaper and have lower miles, and are cheaper, so that would be a better option all around, if it is an option at all. 
 

I’ve looked up the current part number for a 2016 Energi transmission and it says it will fit a 2013 as well, so that gives me some hope it would work.  However, I don’t know for sure whether a used one would also work or if there were changes to commonize them at some point that makes the original 2015/2016’s not compatible with 2013/2014 model years. 

 

My concern is most of the listings on eBay, etc. separate 2013-2014 from 2015-2016 units.  I have a feeling that's just because they changed them for 2015 so they aren't "Technically" the same part number as what a 2013-2014 came with, but I'm just trying to be sure of that. 

I can pick up at 44K mile 2015 transmission with 6 month warranty for under $1500, so that makes me a lot better about owning this car with an obvious potential problem...

 

Thoughts/experiences?

 

Do you know if the tech HAD to do the updates he did or if he could have just connected everything up and went with it?  I may need to start getting on some of the Ford tech forums and see if I can pick one of their brains a bit.  I am capable of physically doing the swap myself if it ever comes to that, but I just want to know what to expect programming wise as to whether it will have to go to the dealership for programming before driving or what. 

Edited April 20, 2020 by ncsugrad2002