SPL Tech

Because the three components ICE, MG1, and MG2 are physically connected, changing the speed of one affects the speed of one or both the other two components.  Neglecting the internal gear ratios inside the transmission the speed relationship is:  Speed _MG1 + Speed _MG2 = Speed _ICE    MG2 rotates proportionately with the wheels.  So, if vehicle speed is held constant and MG1 speeds up to slow down ICE, the overall gear ratio will be numerically lower (ICE rpm / vehicle rpm).  This is the negative split mode we see from time to time (see quote below) where the HVB has a high SOC and the PCM: 1) stops the charging of the HVB, 2) in essence, runs MG1 as a motor using electric power, and 3) runs MG2 as a generator or motor to regulate vehicle speed.   So, MG1 speeds up, ICE rpm decreases and MG2 rpm is held virtually constant to maintain vehicle speed.

 

I don't know of any case where MG1 would be used solely as a motor to propel the car.  I've never heard of MG1 being used when the brakes are applied (but I'm not familiar with what other manufacturers might do).  My guess is that using MG1 and MG2 simultaneously for regenerative braking might provide too much electrical power for either the inverter or HVB to handle.  There may be a current limit that would be exceeded.  But, maybe not. Also, at some braking load if MG1 and MG2 were used for regenerative braking, the C-Max may become unstable and friction brakes may need applied to at least the rear wheels in addition to the front wheel regenerative braking.  I've also read research papers on regenerative braking and don't recall any that discuss both being used for regenerative braking.

So is MG1's only purpose to start the ICE and modify the RPM of the ICE and MG2? Does changing the RPM of the ICE also change the overall gear ratio, or is the gear ratio fixed for all RMPs?

They do offer the Escape in a hybrid. I wouldn’t buy it though. A quick look on True Delta shows the Escape model is not reliable and has been consistently troublesome since the beginning of it's enactment. Every year model shows people reporting an above average number of problems.

Yes.  Read this as it explains what happens in a planetary gear set when an element of the gear set is not spinning and when one or two elements are providing input like ICE and the traction motor at the same time. As an example, when ICE is running, ICE rpm can be directed to propel the car by holding the the generator stationary or can be split between propelling the car and running the generator to charge the HVB.  Also when needed, the traction motor can supply additional torque / rpm to the drive wheels and ICE rpm can be backed down or perhaps held constant in which case generator rpm would be increased. Thus, the overall gear ratio (ICE rpm/transmission output rpm) is variable.  

When the rotation speed of MG1 is modified to control the RPM of the ICE or MG2, does it also change the final gear ratio, or only the rotational speed of the motors? Does both MG1 and MG2 have the ability to propel the vehicle and charge the battery? In the Prius video it shows that MG2 propels the car and MG1 starts the ICE and acts as a regen, but I recall reading that both motors in the CMAX can act as either function, and when you are hard on your brakes both MG1 and MG2 max out the charge capacity.

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Any idea how the varable gear ratio is created? I dident see any gears in there that look varable such as in the video I posted above.

Its all the way in the back, level with the floor. Open the rear hatch and look in the bottom, left corner. It's close enough to almost touch the rear hatch. To open it you might need to fold up the compartment in the back that folds up to access the rear storage. Also, it's kind of hidden by the net, so you might want to take the net off.

A little bit off in the number.  Mythbusters obtained a 20% gain in FE at a distance of 50 feet and a 11% gain at 100 feet  at 55 mph behind a semi-truck.   But I agree with the safety concerns of drafting - at 100 feet back, it takes about 1 1/4 seconds to close the 100 feet at 55 mph (80 feet/second).

 

This has been discussed in other threads and IIRC most believe that the two second rule is a safe driving distance behind another vehicle. So, two seconds at 55 mph is 160 feet which would be very little if any FE improvement from drafting.  Now having said that, driving the freeways around Phoenix, it's virtually impossible to maintain a two second rule.  At 70 mph in rush hour, I'd say the traffic is generally less than 100 feet apart.   At 100 feet cars will be filling the 100 foot gap.

Cool, thanks for the correction. That's a semi though, and most vehicles on the highway are not semis. How effectave is drafing a car? I suspect not very effective at all unless you are right behind them.

Especially in City Driving being very aware what is going on in front of you(driving style) can save you time by catching green lights instead of stopping for red ones. Drafting on the FWY doesn't necessarily mean you are losing time, but you are gaining MPG's. It comes down to how much effort (Driving Style) you want to put into it, most people don't want to bother with it. IMO  For me it's FUN. :)

Paul 

 

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DO not draft on the freeway.... For one, Mythbusters proved it's completely ineffective unless you are right on them, less than 6' back. And for two it's dangerous, very dangerous. Even if it increased your fuel economy by 20%, the very mundane amount of fuel you saved would NEVER catch up to the amount of money you would need to spend on repair bills after causing an accident. You would need to draft for 1,000,000+ miles just to break even, and then if you totaled the vehicle, hurt someone or got sued, foreget it, you could draft all day everyday for life and never even come close to breaking even.

Do not suggest to someone they do something unsafe and illegal for marginal fuel gains. Most drivers cant drive for crap as it is, we dont need to make that worse.

Our local VW dealership advertises a "free" lifetime/unlimited miles warranty.  The tiny print disclaimer to see dealer for details so I did and the owner must have all service done at his dealership.   What a deal!  LOL

Those "lifetime" warranties are shams. There are whole books written about that topic. They have so many exclusions and limitations that it's pretty much impossible to get anything covered for free unless you are really lucky and the car breaks down the day after you buy it. It’s just another marketing trick to try to lure you into buying a car from them. Sort of how some dealers offer $5000 for your car above KBB, but then charge $8000 over MSPR on the new car. LOL

Yeah, I got A5 from eBay for about $35, IIRC.  It was an official, sealed copy (from the Lincoln Navigation system -- same maps).  Works great and has for six months.

 

I have an A4 I'd be willing to give you (not really all that out of date depending on the area).  A6 has not been released yet and I would expect it will hit eBay at about the same prices (when I got A5 it had JUST been released and my dealership wanted $150 even though my A4 came with the car after A5 had come out).

 

Note that you have to be absolutely positive you have the Nav hardware -- I am no expert, but the screen shot you have shown doesn't convince me you do (and it would be odd for a used vehicle to have the maps removed: no real point since you can't use them elsewhere).  I have been told that only a dealership could tell you whether the hardware is installed or not (because we tested a car that appeared to just need the nav card only to be told that the hardware wasn't installed and could not be added after the fact).

Sweet, thanks for the offer! I have the Sony system, and as I asked in a different thread, apparently ALL Sony systems have nav. Also, it says "navigation" on the top right in the green, as well on the HUD. On the other hand, my SE which does not have nav but does have MFT, does not say navigation in the top right of the screen. Instead it says "information." Also, I have been able to access the navigation on the unit and I pressed "show map" just as you would on any Ford nav unit. It loaded the screen, it just dident show anything on the map since I dont have any maps. So owning an SE and an SEL, I can tell you that the SEL unit has nav as it has a ton of extra nav specific screens I can access that do not exist on my SE MFT unit, and again it has the Sony system.

Is Ford releasing an update to integrate Pandora in the headunit? Where did you come up with the Pandora thing?

How do I know if it takes the A4/5/6 series or the B4/5/6 series? The manual says I have to check my map version on MFT, but since I have no SD card I have no map version.

I asked the stealership, and just as I suspected they just blew me off and said to pay $200 for new maps. I wouldent expect any less of an answer from them.

I got a used SEL and it has the Sony system with nav, but no SD card. The MFT shows that Navigation North America is installed, but the maps are missing as there is no SD card. Is there a way to download a replacement for free? The vehicle came with the maps, so I already own the license and rights to use the maps.

What is this screen indicating?:

On the settings menu it allows me to install an app. What apps is MFT talking about? I checked the Ford website and dident see any applications for the MFT.

I have said it once and I will say it again, get an ammeter! They are cheap and they are the ONLY thing that is going to effectavely determine exactly WHEN the draw is occuring. No more guessing, know exactly when the problem is occuring.

 Combine that with an extra $0.40 per gallon to cover timing belt replacement and your 45 mpg "tanks" ( :lol:) to about 24 mpg! 

That's not true. The timing belt only runs $600 to replace and you dont need to do it until 120,000 miles. If he is buying brand new it's unlikely he will even keep it to 120k. Also, if you run your CMAX to 120k and never have to replace anything, then you did better than most. Chances are by 120k you will have to replace something.

The service on the VW is a ton though. I got rid of my TDI for a CMAX. The stealership wanted $1200 for the 40k service. Of course I did it myself for under $400, but still it was a lot. Oil changes run about $70 if you do it yourself as the car needs a very special type of oil that is expensive. Then you have diesel fuel filter changes every 20k and DSG transmission flushes every 40k. Even if you do all the maintenence yourself it adds up quickly.

You do, however, need to replace the DPF around 100k or so as it gets clogged, and that is not cheap. Probably $2000 at the stealer or maybe $400 if you do it yourself.

There is no low washer fluid because Ford chose not to add it. Those sensors are not free and if Ford added every feature that exists, the car would cost more than you want to pay for it. They had to pick and choose. Some made the list, others did not.

In many states it is illegal to be in N during the operation of a vehicle. It can only be used for towing.

I dont understand how the grills help so much. I drove in 35 degree weather this weekend and found the engine warms up enough to turn off after only a few minutes of driving. After that the vehicle drives like a normal hybrid (e.g. ICE shuts off when you press on the brake, it doesent idle).

I'll throw in my numbers from a 600 mile weekend trip. About 36 MPG driving between 75 and 85 MPH depending on the speed limit using eco cruise. It was pretty windy for about 150 miles and calm for the rest of the trip. Stock Energy Saver AS tires with 42 PSI. One rider (me) and no cargo.

As with all CMAXes, my window buttons are dual stage. I press all the way down and the window goes down automatically. I press half-way down and I have manual control. But when I roll the windows up, the second stage does not seem to function. I cannot get the windows to roll up automatically. I can feel the second "click" on the button, so the buttons are dual stage for both down and up, but it seems the second stage has been disabled. Any ideas?

 

All in all, sulfuric acid is extremely nasty stuff and it will completely destroy anything other than a few types of plastic. It's really not something you want leaking around in your car. There is an old Navy submarine that sunk because of leaking batteries. The acid caused a hull breach, and I think the entire crew died if I recall right. The submarine was even in port too!

Sorry, SE and SEL. I get the letters mixed up sometimes. Anyway, I did not buy the car new. I just got it. It's a 2013 with 29k miles. It was used as a rental before I bought it. I checked ETM voltage, and it said 12.6v with the car in standby and 14.5-6 in ready. That's about what my SE runs at, and I would not consider 14.6 to be an overcharge.

To the last poster: the vehicle is equipped with a Motercraft "maintenance free" battery and it is quite likely it does not normally require water. But the battery is not sealed, and there are ports to open to put water in if needed. Also "maintenance free" is a marketing term really as no battery is completely maintenance free. At the minimal you should check the terminals for corrosion buildup once every while. I noticed a very small amount on my battery.

I say the lack of a non-sealed battery is ridiculous because look at the problem I am having—I had a pool of sulfuric acid in my trunk. I am glad I caught it in time before it ate through the screws that hold the battery in place, and then started leaking down onto the suspension and chassis.

Batteries contain sulfuric acid, which is extremely corrosive and poisoness. charging batteries produces hydrogen which is also toxic and extremely explosive. Does that sound like the type of stuff you want inside the cabin with you? Ford is trying to tame these problems by using external venting and a battery box to isolate any leaking fluid. But the problem is if one of those things fail, you have a big problem which could harm someone. Going with a truly sealed battery would completely eliminate all of those risks for a fairly modest increase in price (FYI MSRP on the replacement battery for the CMAX is actually more than MSRP on an AGM sealed battery...)

I dont know of a single automotive battery manufacturer that would ever say it is okay to put a battery inside a vehicle, unless it was a sealed AGM battery.

Anyway, all I can do is let it sit and see if the problem comes up again. If it doesent, I guess the rental guys did something retarded. probably overcharged it.

We just picked up our second CMAX, a SEL, The first is an SL. Anyway, I opened the back to notice a pool of acid in the battery container that the LV battery sits in. I pulled the battery and thoroughly rinsed  the acid out with water and baking soda, and I did the same to the battery. But the big question is how did the acid get there in the first place? I placed the battery on a piece of paper after I dried it off and found it was not leaking. I held it upside down and also found it was not leaking. There was nothing apparently wrong with the battery other than that it had a red eye even though I just drove the vehicle an hour prior.

Anyway, our SL LV battery looks perfectly fine. Zero leaks whatsoever. I am thinking that the acid came out of the exhaust port. There are only two things I can think of. 1: the battery was overfilled at the factory. 2: the charge voltage is too high which is causing the acid to boil and leak out of the port hole. This can happen above 15v on some batteries.

I also noticed that the exhaust port on my SEL is different than the one on the SE. On the SE there is a tube that exits the battery box and runs about 5" below the box. Same with the tube on the HV battery. But on my SLI there is no such tube. There is a rubber extension that sticks out of the battery box for about 1" and that is all.
 

Also, the LV battery is not sealed FYI. It's just a normal lead acid battery with a directed exhaust port, but it is not sealed. There are caps on top you can open to fill the battery with. I cant believe Ford went with a non-sealed battery inside the vehicle. That is ridiculous and unsafe. They should have gone with AGM tech with internal hydrogen filters like Optima does.

I drove 1200 miles today using eco cruise the entire time and I noticed it doesent appear to actually do anything. The manual says it allows the car to slow down while going up hill to save gas. Well in one occasion I noticed the car went all the way up to one bar short of the yellow zone on Engage while trying to hold 70 MPH going up hill. The most I noticed it would slow down is 4 MPH, about 71 down to 67, but it was still filling most of the bars on Engage trying to hold the car at speed.