Dead 12 Volt: Water in Electrical Connectors

[salman]

Just heard from the service manager that Ford engineers told him to check 4 electrical connectors for water intrusion.The connectors are in the front end of the car.

 

My car has three of the four specified connectors (4th is for fog lamps, which I do not have). All the connectors had water in them, which would cause a short. The service dept put my car through a high pressure car wash last week after they performed the TSBs for battery issues. That might have shot water into the connectors, caused a short, and drained the battery.

 

I do not yet know the identity of the 3 connectors but will ask for that detail. My understanding is that they are under the hood and/or behind the dash, located where water could drain down or splash up from the road.

 

Ford's engineers told him to check these connectors, so that means there have been similar problems on other cars. So far no one on this forum has posted information about water intrusion in electrical connectors.

 

The connectors appear to be a defective design. The engineers told the service manager to check the connectors but did not give him instructions for what to do if they were wet. The service manager is pressing the engineers for an answer. If it is a defective design it might be a while until new connectors are produced.

 

 

Ford will replace my battery, too, when the connection problem is solved.

 

 

 

[salman]

More information:

 

Upon hearing that my battery was dead after all the battery related TSBs were performed, Ford engineers told the mechanic working on my car to check the following electrical connectors for water intrusion: C134, C144, C140, C1812, and C1651. One of those is for fog lights. C1812 is for the coolant water pump. I am not sure yet what the others are for. These connectors are all on the main engine wiring harness.

 

Water was found in connectors C144 and C1651.

 

Ford does not have replacement connectors available, so the engineers are recommending replacement of the entire wiring harness. A week to get the part, 1 or 2 days to install.

 

According to the engineers, they do not know whether the connectors have a design defect or were damaged during initial assembly.

A key point to remember is that the engineers directed the mechanic to check these connectors because water has been found in them on other cars. The engineers said, "We have seen water intrusion at these connectors that can cause intermittent battery drain concerns."

 

The TSBs about the display screen and DC converter (i.e, charger) clearly do not fully resolve the 12 volt battery problems.

[salman]

Update:

 

The part arrived earlier than expected (Friday) and the repair was finished this morning. Just got the car.

 

Some new information:

 

The repair receipt identifies 3 connectors that had water in them: C140, C144, and C165.

 

The connectors on the new harness have been updated/upgraded since the build date of my car, so fingers are crossed that the changes will seal out water.

 

The service techs installed the new harness per Ford's specs and they changed my 12 volt battery in case the last one was degraded by being fully discharged.

Some advice, FWIW:

 

If you have a dead battery episode, then I would recommend asking your service manager to ask Ford engineers about the electrical connectors listed in these posts. I would have them check the connections no matter whether the TSBs have already been performed.

 

Only time will tell if this solves the dead 112 volt problem. I will post if I have another 12 volt failure.

Edited May 13, 2013 by salman

[plus 3 golfer]

I looked up the connectors in the workshop manual.  A few observations:

 

1) The three connectors appear to be located very close to each other in the left front of the car. It would be nice to examine exactly how water could reach these connectors.

 

2) C144 is a 12 wire connector.  Pins 9-12 carry switched positive and ground from the Body Control Module to the fog lamps (not standard on the SE). The headlamp switch provides the signal to the BCM to operate the fog lamp relay. 1-8 are for the park assist sensors (not standard on SE and SEL).

 

3) C140 is a 4 wire connector. Pins 1-2 are positive (hot all the time) and ground to the coolant pump. Pins 3-4 are positive and ground to the brake vacuum pump.

 

4) C1651 is a 3 pin connector for the active grill shutters - positive (hot in start and run), ground, and control.

 

So, if the moisture is causing a path to ground and subsequent drain of the 12 V battery, I would believe that a circuit would need to be hot all the time and / or the drain is causing a module to remain active when it should be asleep.  Second, the battery issue appears to be more prevalent on the SE model.  Of all the possible explanations of what is causing a dead battery, moisture may be the most plausible one.  The DC/DC converter fix simply provides a higher initial charge level on shutdown and the display fix apparently shuts the display down quicker.  Both could mask the moisture issue by increasing the time until a dead battery.

 

So, the next question is why do the failures appear more prevalent in the SE model.  Could it be the location of the connectors relative to the LH fog lamp assembly .  Is it possible that the LH fog lamp assembly blocks water from reaching the connectors.  If the new connectors have a "better" water seal, it would be beneficial to find out when the production change occurred.  The reason is that those who have "old" connectors will evidently be subject to a dead battery for the life of the car.  If Ford does not issue a recall, then connector repairs after the warranty expires will likely not be covered by Ford.  

 

Anyways just some info and food for thought. 

[salman]

Plus 3

 

That is very helpful research on the connectors. I tried to track and identify the connectors on Ford's online parts lists but could not get very far.

 

My car is an SE with parking sensor. No fog lamps.

 

Your reasoning about an always live wire being the necessary location for power drain that would deplete the battery when the car is off is sharp. Of the three connectors with water intrusion on my car, that points to C140 as the likely suspect for causing a power drain.

 

I think there could be multiple explanations for why there seem to be more dead battery cases on SE models:

 

1) Perhaps there are more SE models on the road? There are dead battery cases reported on this board for SEL & Energi models, but all of this is self reporting rather than scientific sampling. Maybe total numbers of SE, SEL, and Energi models sold are available somewhere on the web, but even if we had them we would still be guesstimating with self reported cases on this forum.

 

2) There could be more than one cause. The electrical connectors might explain some cases, but not others. It is also possible that the electrical connectors may not be the cause of my case - time will tell.

 

3) As you speculate, the connectors might be located slightly differently on different models, or perhaps they are shielded by other equipment on some models.

 

4) The Ford engineers wrote to my service department that they were not sure whether the connectors were a bad design or were damaged during assembly. Perhaps there is some difference in assembly practices for the different models that makes the SE connectors more prone to damage?

 

This is all guesswork to suss out the possible permutations.

 

Logically, water in a connector with an always live wire could cause a battery to drain, so this problem seems a good suspect - it could well be the cause of the dead battery disorder. My fingers are crossed. I like the car apart from all the trouble with the battery, which is a pretty serious demerit.

[ArizonaEnergi]

It would be very useful if someone could post pictures or a diagram of where the three connectors (C140, C144, and C165) are located so we DIY types could do some self-examination.

 

Excellent write-up by Plus 3 Golfer above, BTW.

Edited May 14, 2013 by ArizonaEnergi

[zhackwyatt]

Plus 3

 

That is very helpful research on the connectors. I tried to track and identify the connectors on Ford's online parts lists but could not get very far.

 

My car is an SE with parking sensor. No fog lamps.

 

Your reasoning about an always live wire being the necessary location for power drain that would deplete the battery when the car is off is sharp. Of the three connectors with water intrusion on my car, that points to C140 as the likely suspect for causing a power drain.

 

I think there could be multiple explanations for why there seem to be more dead battery cases on SE models:

 

1) Perhaps there are more SE models on the road? There are dead battery cases reported on this board for SEL & Energi models, but all of this is self reporting rather than scientific sampling. Maybe total numbers of SE, SEL, and Energi models sold are available somewhere on the web, but even if we had them we would still be guesstimating with self reported cases on this forum.

 

2) There could be more than one cause. The electrical connectors might explain some cases, but not others. It is also possible that the electrical connectors may not be the cause of my case - time will tell.

 

3) As you speculate, the connectors might be located slightly differently on different models, or perhaps they are shielded by other equipment on some models.

 

4) The Ford engineers wrote to my service department that they were not sure whether the connectors were a bad design or were damaged during assembly. Perhaps there is some difference in assembly practices for the different models that makes the SE connectors more prone to damage?

 

This is all guesswork to suss out the possible permutations.

 

Logically, water in a connector with an always live wire could cause a battery to drain, so this problem seems a good suspect - it could well be the cause of the dead battery disorder. My fingers are crossed. I like the car apart from all the trouble with the battery, which is a pretty serious demerit.

Well we definitely know there is a problem w/ the display in the SE. (Non MFT).  The water in connectors could explain some of the remaining problems with the others.  It's very likely the display covered the largest percentage of dead batteries, but there are several reasons why the others are happening.

[plus 3 golfer]

It would be very useful if someone could post pictures or a diagram of where the three connectors (C140, C144, and C165) are located so we DIY types could do some self-examination.

 

Excellent write-up by Plus 3 Golfer above, BTW.

When I look at the workshop manual for removal of the grille shutters, there are three connectors shown which appear to be accessed from below and which would require the belly cover to be removed.  I cannot see the connectors when I look down from the top.  The pic shows the grill cover connector to be the middle of  three connectors (which I assume are the ones we are talking about).  I don't believe they will be hard to find once the cover is removed.

 

If one looks at the belly cover, there are "slots" in the cover for air outflow.  There are also vertical rubber / plastic "flaps" that extend downward that are mounted near each front tire as if to shield the underside / "slots" from getting sprayed by water from the tires and possibly into the slot openings.  So, it makes me wonder if that's how water enters that area or is it from the front grille openings.  I could certainly see how a car wash with undercarriage washing could saturate the area above the belly cover.

Edited May 15, 2013 by Plus 3 Golfer

[salman]

Plus3

 

Again, very helpful. It is great that you have the repair manual and are sharing information from it.

 

The slots in the belly shield are likely for drainage as well as air. Water splashes up from the road, sprays through the grill, and can drip in from around the edge of hood and get past the drainage channels on the body under the hood edges. For this reason the connectors are supposed to be water tight

 

In my most recent dead 12 volt episode, the dealer put my through a car wash. We had no rain before that for a couple of months. My first dead battery episode was in December and may have followed a rain storm.

 

Going forward it would be  good for people experiencing dead battery episodes to note whether it rained recently or if they recently washed their car, etc. Perhaps a new line the dead battery poll would be useful?

[salsaguy]

more 12v issues seen on the SE compared to the SEL and Energi can easily be determined as there are surely more SEs purchased since it is much less expensive than SELs or Energis. With hybrid owners looking to save $ on gas Im sure saving on on their cars out the door cost is also high priority. Also, not everyone wants leather, nav or backup camera, which the SEL and E have. Also Energi has very little cargo space so that will turn off many many buyers (like me), meaning lower sales sales of the E.

Hope they fix it on the assy line for all new built cars and fast.

Edited May 16, 2013 by salsaguy

[Adair]

We've been asked to combine the battery threads into 2....Zhackwyatt's poll and the Battery Dead thread. This is my 6th attempt at doing this...........here's hoping it works.

 

 

http://fordcmaxhybri...dead#entry11225

 

http://fordcmaxhybri...dead#entry11661