Ford C Max hybrid worth a try for the environmentally conscious » Features » The Stanly News and Press (Albemarle, NC)

[C-MaxSea]

Mostly about the Energy, nothing new, some typical factual errors, but reasonably well written and even handed (geez, even upbeat).

 

http://thesnaponline.com/features/x31534145/Ford-C-Max-hybrid-worth-a-try-for-the-environmentally-conscious

Edited August 31, 2013 by C-MaxSea

[C-MaxSea]

bump

[Laurel]

Nice little upbeat article--thanks for posting it.

[rfgrefe]

It' really get me, "for the environmentally conscious". If you are about the world environment, you would NOT buy any car that has battery.

These battery do more harm to the world environment than  gas or diesel vehicle. 

I have the c-max because of  cost, great car.

 

However "for the environmentally conscious" they would drive be driving a "clean diesel" vehicle.

These clean diesel vehicle gets better fuel mileage, and is good for the environment.  Problem is that the politicians are in the pocket of big oil, therefore lying to us, and preventing Clean diesel become the norm. 

 

Last point, We have plenty of oil, and OIL is renewable! !   NASA prove this in 2005.

[jdbob]

Wow, I haven't seen derp like that in a long time. Here's an interesting report:

 

http://assets.climatecentral.org/pdfs/ClimateFriendlyCarsReport_Final.pdf

[Testdriver]

Wow, I haven't seen derp like that in a long time. Here's an interesting report:

 

http://assets.climatecentral.org/pdfs/ClimateFriendlyCarsReport_Final.pdf

Skimming through that study, it appears that it only takes into account tailpipe and powerplant emissions. Some other studies that take into account the entire product lifecycle claim that electric vehicles do more damage to the environment than conventional vehicles. That kind of analysis is pretty tricky, so a healthy dose of skepticism is warranted, regardless of what side the authors are taking.

 

The fact of the matter is that ALL cars require a ton of resources and energy. There are no green cars, and arguing whether a TDI, Focus, Leaf, Prius or C-Max is the most environmentally friendly is kinda just splitting hairs.

[jdbob]

Skimming through that study, it appears that it only takes into account tailpipe and powerplant emissions.

 

Then maybe you should read the report instead of skimming. It covers embedded carbon due to manufacturing in various parts. In fact, it mentions those in the executive summary near the beginning:

 

"But that is just part of the story. Another critical factor is the carbon emissions generated when a car is manufactured. Emissions from producing the battery and other electrical components create a 10,000 to 40,000-pound carbon debt for electric cars that can only be overcome after tens, or even hundreds of thousands of miles of driving and recharging from clean energy sources."

[Hybrid2000]

The "green" value of battery power is not in the raw materials, but in the extremely high rate of reuse and recycling that (motive) batteries achieve at the end of their working life.  Consider the reduced fuel consumption AND the reuse of the battery components in determining the overall impact of hybrid technology.

[ScubaDadMiami]

We can all only take an educated guess, and try to do the right thing.  I hope that this car will save money and the environment.  I'll give my best efforts to drive efficiently.  I feel like we are doing our part by driving the C-MAX.

[Corndart]

Interesting article jdbob. 

 

The "green" value of battery power is not in the raw materials, but in the extremely high rate of reuse and recycling that (motive) batteries achieve at the end of their working life.  Consider the reduced fuel consumption AND the reuse of the battery components in determining the overall impact of hybrid technology.

What "recycling of batteries" are you talking about? This study factors in the cost of manufacturing and the energy use over 50k and 100k intervals, combined with the footprint of the power grid feeding pure electric, plug-in hybrid, and hybrid vehicles, to come up with carbon emissions. If the environmental impact of owning and operating a vehicle are important to you, then Co2 should be very important. 

[Hybrid2000]

Recycling and reusing components of the battery systems significantly changes the total impact of the battery technology on the environmental footprint of the vehicle. The nickel-metal-hydrid battery used in our 2001 Prius, worked flawlessly for over a decade, and that car is still on the road (now 13 years) with a second owner. Much has been written about how the battery makes hybrids a poor cousin to the state-of-the-art diesel power train, but rarely do they consider the battery "cost" beyond its initial use in the car.

 

The total environmental impact of the vehicle includes the manufacturing, operation, maintenance and end of life reuse/recycling phases of the product. When considering the CO2 footprint, evaluating only the operating phase emissions will skew the data. Considering the manufacturing phase without also considering the end-of-life phase also skews the data. 

 

Not everyone lives in areas powered by coal generators, so these burdens are not equal for all BEV users, especially those where hydro-electric generation is the norm.

[Corndart]

All of the calculations made for the manufacturing and operating phase were divulged, so you can easily calculate out the CO2 impact over however many years you believe the vehicle will be in service. 100,000 miles is certainly far less than a lot of people will keep this vehicle, and no doubt (knock on wood) they will be in service for far longer.

 

What you're suggesting is that through recycling, there is a positive offset to the environment, by returning material back into the supply chain, but this is broadly applicable to all vehicles. There is only one major component that differentiates a hybrid in that regard, which is the battery. From a quick search, it doesn't look like there is much value in a Li-ion battery either from a recyclers perspective, so I have no idea what "end of life reuse / recycling phases of the product" you imagine would be calculable / unique to our vehicle, beyond what was already factored into this paper.

 

http://www.waste-management-world.com/articles/print/volume-12/issue-4/features/the-lithium-battery-recycling-challenge.html

Edited November 1, 2013 by Corndart