2014/ 2015 c-max questions

[fordfan82]

Does it have a better turning radius than a mini van? My wife had a rental mini van and she had a tough time getting into parking spaces with it.

[plus 3 golfer]

I rented a Dodge Grand Caravan last summer.  Specs say 19.6' turning radius (39.2' turning diameter) and CR says turning circle is 42 feet.  Other than being larger than the C-Max, I don't recall any turning / parking issues with the Caravan that I didn't expect.  Obviously because the Caravan is larger than the C-Max, the Caravan will be more problematic than the C-Max when fitting it in a tight space.  

 

I believe because of the size of the C-Max, I expect it to have a smaller turning circle than it actually does.  But once you get use to its larger turning circle, the C-Max does fits nicely in smaller parking spaces usually found in parking garages and is much easier to park in a tight 90* space than the minivan.  

 

I also forgot to mention that in backing out of  90* parking spaces, many times I do multipoint turns as again the turning circle (41') is rather large whereas my Rogue makes it without multipoint turns.

[Smiling Jack]

I..............................

..............

 

I also forgot to mention that in backing out of  90* parking spaces, many times I do multipoint turns as again the turning circle (41') is rather large whereas my Rogue makes it without multipoint turns.

 

Plus 3,

 

I would very much like to read your personal views on comparison between the Rougue to the C-max - other than mpg.  That is, the comparative general suitability of the two cars; space, comfort, handling, ride, pickup, braking,  etc.

Edited June 26, 2014 by Smiling Jack

[plus 3 golfer]

My Rogue is a 2008 AWD SL (virtually every option available is on it) that I bought used in 2011 for its higher ground clearance for travel on unpaved forest roads and desert roads in AZ  to primarily get to off-road hiking destinations. So, the longest trip in it has been maybe 300 miles round trip.  I've put 12k miles on it in about 3 years of ownership. 

 

The immediate difference I notice between the Rogue and C-Max when driving is noise level (although the Rogue is rated as a quiet car by CR).  One can hear the CVT hum and significant road noise (quieter tires would probably help) at higher rpm and speeds in the Rogue.  So, I would not want to use the Rogue for long trips.  The two are very close on comfort for me with higher seating positions. The Rogue has rattles and squeaks when driving over rougher roads whereas I have none in the C-Max.  I don't notice much difference in acceleration, braking, or normal handling.  Both are acceptable but not world class.  

 

The Rogue wins on space (obviously) although I was able to just squeeze a new unboxed LG front load washer in my C-Max (1/2" headroom clearance).  With the rear seats down and the roof rack on the Rogue, I've fit a 42x60" glass table top and 4 metal chairs inside the Rogue with the metal decorative base (48x33x29) on the roof.  Although I haven't ridden in the rear of either car, people (golfers) say the Rogue is very comfortable. Also, I think the C-Max would have a hard time fitting 4 golf bags in its hatch area (not nearly as wide as the Rogue) without removing the longer clubs from the bags.

 

I have loaded down both vehicles at least once. We went geode gathering with the Rogue and had 4 people plus maybe 500 pounds of geodes and equipment on the 125 mile trip home.  The Rogue handled and performed well at 75 mph.  On a trip home from Home Depot with the C-Max loaded with about 500 pounds of stuff plus 2 people, the C-Max seemed a little less sure than the Rogue with more body roll on quick direction changes.

 

In summary, disregarding the noise level (and poorer FE of the Rogue), I prefer "driving" the Rogue.  But noise level (and FE) are key considerations for me, so I would buy the C-Max over the Rogue as my main vehicle. Of course, this comparison is for a 2008 Rogue.  The 2014MY is the second generation Rogue and is likely different than 2008MY.

 

 

[Smiling Jack]

My Rogue is a 2008 AWD SL (virtually every option available is on it) that I bought used in 2011 for its higher ground clearance for travel on unpaved forest roads and desert roads in AZ  to primarily get to off-road hiking destinations. So, the longest trip in it has been maybe 300 miles round trip.  I've put 12k miles on it in about 3 years of ownership. 

 

The immediate difference I notice between the Rogue and C-Max when driving is noise level (although the Rogue is rated as a quiet car by CR).  One can hear the CVT hum and significant road noise (quieter tires would probably help) at higher rpm and speeds in the Rogue.  So, I would not want to use the Rogue for long trips.  The two are very close on comfort for me with higher seating positions. The Rogue has rattles and squeaks when driving over rougher roads whereas I have none in the C-Max.  I don't notice much difference in acceleration, braking, or normal handling.  Both are acceptable but not world class.  

 

The Rogue wins on space (obviously) although I was able to just squeeze a new unboxed LG front load washer in my C-Max (1/2" headroom clearance).  With the rear seats down and the roof rack on the Rogue, I've fit a 42x60" glass table top and 4 metal chairs inside the Rogue with the metal decorative base (48x33x29) on the roof.  Although I haven't ridden in the rear of either car, people (golfers) say the Rogue is very comfortable. Also, I think the C-Max would have a hard time fitting 4 golf bags in its hatch area (not nearly as wide as the Rogue) without removing the longer clubs from the bags.

 

I have loaded down both vehicles at least once. We went geode gathering with the Rogue and had 4 people plus maybe 500 pounds of geodes and equipment on the 125 mile trip home.  The Rogue handled and performed well at 75 mph.  On a trip home from Home Depot with the C-Max loaded with about 500 pounds of stuff plus 2 people, the C-Max seemed a little less sure than the Rogue with more body roll on quick direction changes.

 

In summary, disregarding the noise level (and poorer FE of the Rogue), I prefer "driving" the Rogue.  But noise level (and FE) are key considerations for me, so I would buy the C-Max over the Rogue as my main vehicle. Of course, this comparison is for a 2008 Rogue.  The 2014MY is the second generation Rogue and is likely different than 2008MY.

 

 

 

Thanks, Plus 3.

 

Excellent and comprehensive summary.  To my eye, from the outside, the new Rogue sems a little smaller than the old.  Of course, the new model Escape and C-max cars are a bit smaller than the older Escape and Escape Hybrid cars that they replaced.  The new Explorer looks smaller as well.   Most car models seem to be shrinking.  Global warming effect?

[salsaguy]

Nooooooooo!!!! they are doing away with our fav #1 exterior color choice of Sterling Grey!!!

we dont want silver

and that other one is just a lighter black? whats up with that?

how could they kill the MOST popular color they had??????

 

idiots

Now what do we do?

looks like the CMax is no more for us.... :(

 

Link to 2015 Ford Fleet buyer's Preview, showing the new 2015 C-MAX colors (page 23).

http://www.fleet.ford.com/resources/ford/general/pdf/brochures/2015/15_FleetPreviewGuide_lr.pdf

 

Tectonic Silver Metallic seems to be a great match to the Stone interior color.

 

And somehow I missed this April 1st announcement of a special model just for BBQ enthusiasts…  ;)

http://blog.consumerguide.com/ford-cooks-new-hybrid-meet-2015-c-max-energi-kingsford-edition/

[salsaguy]

YOU have a say in this too You are married and are supposed to share everything and YOUR opinion matters just as much as hers.

Get the CMax

stick to your guns

better to not regret it later with a bad back/neck

nothing worse than being stuck in traffic in a car that is uncomfortable!
if you switch cars often then your vote counts

offer to pay for the difference out of your share of money so she cant complain

 

It's a fantastic deal and They don't have a deal like that for the C-max and the most I've seen on an electric one is a 6,000 rebate. My wife and I drive each other's cars a lot and although she can fit into a focus, I have an issue with the headroom. I'd much rather get a C-max Hybrid.

[fordfan82]

As much as We both like the blue candy color is it really worth the extra 395 for it? We don't want black or oxford white. It is between the Grey, Ruby Red or Candy Blue.

[shinytop]

My choice is the Gray.  If you don't get it now it may not be available!

[robfixit]

I love my Ruby Red. My wife never liked the look of the CMax. When I finally convinced her to let me buy one (after I let her by her used Mini), she only saw the red between cars in the lot. When they drove it out to give it to us, she commented that it did not look as bad in red.  The red gives it a sport look.... and it is very easy to spot in a parking lot.

[fordfan82]

We have 6 payments to go on our current lease so unless Ford has an early bird program we will have to wait. We are at 20,000 miles and 6 months to go. Is it better to turn it in early to avoid going over on miles or go over miles and roll into next lease?

[hybridbear]

Interesting because when I saw the $11k offer, there was no obvious mention on the Ford website when you build the car that it applied to leasing. I recall doing a quick internet search and others also assumed it was a purchase discount.  When I called the local Ford dealer, I specifically asked the salesman about the tax credit and he never mentioned that the $11k offer was a leasing offer and indicated that the tax credit was in addition to the $11k.  Anyways, since the dealer said a few days later they couldn't get a Focus EV, I didn't pursue it any further.

 

I just looked again on Ford's website and built the car.  The build clearly shows the $11k incentive (no mention of lease) taken off the MSRP and when you click on the available incentives balloon in the build, the reference was program "RCL Available Cash: program 50256".  Googling 50256 does show it's their "Red Carpet Lease" program.  I hate to say this but when is Ford going to stop with misleading the consumer and bring transparency to their business.  I guess the consumer is suppose to know RLC = Red Carpet Lease. ;)  So for purchase, it's $13,500 cash and tax credit benefit off the MSRP which is okay but I probably wouldn't have purchased one at that price. Also, I don't think the Ford Electric is part of the "X Plan" program.

For purchases it's $6000 cash back plus 0% financing. Then you can claim up to $7500 as the Federal Tax Credit, provided you have enough income to pay $7500 in federal income tax. You are correct that the Focus Electric is excluded from X-Plan. It is not excluded from A/Z-Plan though.

[plus 3 golfer]

For purchases it's $6000 cash back plus 0% financing. Then you can claim up to $7500 as the Federal Tax Credit, provided you have enough income to pay $7500 in federal income tax. You are correct that the Focus Electric is excluded from X-Plan. It is not excluded from A/Z-Plan though.

Thanks for clearing it up.  I added parentheses around "cash and and the tax credit benefit" in my previous post which should now be clear:  $13,500 = $6,000 cash incentive + $7,500 FTC (provided one can use it) for a cash purchase.  

[SnowStorm]

Some have mentioned they hate the wide turning radius on the C-max. What are they referring to and is it really that bad?

A total non-issue with me - if its an issue at all.  If I hadn't read about it on this forum I doubt I would have ever given it a thought.  Not even on the radar screen given all the other advantages of the C-Max.

[fordfan82]

My wife seems to want the one without my ford touch but all those buttons crammed in the middle looks terrible. How do I convince her my ford touch is the way to go??

[Smiling Jack]

My wife seems to want the one without my ford touch but all those buttons crammed in the middle looks terrible. How do I convince her my ford touch is the way to go??

 

 

Easy Argument: 

According to what I read on this forum, the ones with all the buttons seem to be the ones that have - BY FAR -  with the most troubles with dead 12-volt batteries.

 

My preferred strategy: 

Change plan and convince her go for theC-Max Energi rather than the Hybrid. (The Energi does not come with aall the buttons.) With tax rebate and incentives many report on the Ford C-max Energi Forum  ( fordcmaxenergiforum.com ) that The Energi can be bought for essentially the same price as a comparably equipped Hybrid.  (It certainly was true in my case.)  With this choice you get 30 more horsepower, higher highway speed in EV, far lower fuel consumption, more advanced technology, a 20-mile or more EV range and much, much lower chance of 12-volt battery failure (not only because of the entertainment system choice but because every time you plug in, the system tops off the charge on the 12-volt battery as well).

[ptjones]

Easy Argument: 

According to what I read on this forum, the ones with all the buttons seem to be the ones that have - BY FAR -  with the most troubles with dead 12-volt batteries.

 

My preferred strategy: 

Change plan and convince her go for theC-Max Energi rather than the Hybrid. (The Energi does not come with aall the buttons.) With tax rebate and incentives many report on the Ford C-max Energi Forum  ( fordcmaxenergiforum.com ) that The Energi can be bought for essentially the same price as a comparably equipped Hybrid.  (It certainly was true in my case.)  With this choice you get 30 more horsepower, higher highway speed in EV, far lower fuel consumption, more advanced technology, a 20-mile or more EV range and much, much lower chance of 12-volt battery failure (not only because of the entertainment system choice but because every time you plug in, the system tops off the charge on the 12-volt battery as well).

You could go with that, but unfortunately that is not all true. Hybrid will go as fast as Energi 85mph (86mph in my case) and I don't know where you got the extra 30HP. The deal breaker on the Energi for me was the big bump in the back(HVB). To me the Energi only makes sense if you can use the battery most of the time, not for trips. IMO :) 

 

Paul

[Smiling Jack]

You could go with that, but unfortunately that is not all true. Hybrid will go as fast as Energi 85mph (86mph in my case) and I don't know where you got the extra 30HP. The deal breaker on the Energi for me was the big bump in the back(HVB). To me the Energi only makes sense if you can use the battery most of the time, not for trips. IMO :)

 

Paul

 

I will stand corrected re. the max EV speed in the Hybrid.  I did not know that, and I apologize for posting incorrect info..  Thank you.

 

Re. the added HP: This is well reported (Ford info and many posts here).  In the case of both the Energi and the Hybrid, the electric motor has more HP than the batteries can deliver; so the batteries limit the electric HP.  however, the Energi's larger battery pack can deliver about 30 HP more.  This makes the Energi quicker.  Test one, and you will see what I mean.

 

Re. Fuel cost and pattern of use:  With the Energi, you save so much fuel cost in the first 20 miles or so in EV mode, you would need to drive another 200 miles or so in hybrid mode before the slightly better fuel economy of the Hybrid would overcome the initial savings,  If your pattern of use were such that If you plug in once a day and exceed the EV range every day, you would need to drive another 70,000 miles or so a year before the Energi would cost more in fuel (gasoline plus electricity) than the Hybrid.

Edited July 5, 2014 by Smiling Jack

[salsaguy]

The deal breaker for a wife/mom on the Energi even with all the incentives/rebate is the super small trunk/cargo area site to the higher hump of the battery. most moms/wifes need that larger space in back to carry around stuff and won't want to lift it up higher over the hump than they need to.

Get the hybrid SEL.

 

Also the Energi is only for folks who mostly do stuff around their house and drive mostly the town/city at less than 35/40 mph. If you plan to drive at highway speeds at 45-75 mph most of the time and some city then the hybrid makes much more sense. don't forget to take into account the cost of installing and running the extra power source in your garage if you go for the Energi. Some houses aren't even rated for it and have to put in a separate breaker.

 

Easy Argument: 

According to what I read on this forum, the ones with all the buttons seem to be the ones that have - BY FAR -  with the most troubles with dead 12-volt batteries.

 

My preferred strategy: 

Change plan and convince her go for theC-Max Energi rather than the Hybrid. (The Energi does not come with aall the buttons.) With tax rebate and incentives many report on the Ford C-max Energi Forum  ( fordcmaxenergiforum.com ) that The Energi can be bought for essentially the same price as a comparably equipped Hybrid.  (It certainly was true in my case.)  With this choice you get 30 more horsepower, higher highway speed in EV, far lower fuel consumption, more advanced technology, a 20-mile or more EV range and much, much lower chance of 12-volt battery failure (not only because of the entertainment system choice but because every time you plug in, the system tops off the charge on the 12-volt battery as well).

Edited July 5, 2014 by salsaguy

[hybridbear]

My preferred strategy: 

Change plan and convince her go for theC-Max Energi rather than the Hybrid. (The Energi does not come with aall the buttons.) With tax rebate and incentives many report on the Ford C-max Energi Forum  ( fordcmaxenergiforum.com ) that The Energi can be bought for essentially the same price as a comparably equipped Hybrid.  (It certainly was true in my case.)  With this choice you get 30 more horsepower, higher highway speed in EV, far lower fuel consumption, more advanced technology, a 20-mile or more EV range and much, much lower chance of 12-volt battery failure (not only because of the entertainment system choice but because every time you plug in, the system tops off the charge on the 12-volt battery as well).

I agree about the Energi. The Energi has a few more HP as measured as the max combined output. This is because of different computer programming and a higher max discharge rate of the HVB. The hybrid max discharge rate is 35 kW which limits how much power the electric motor can deliver. In the Energi it is 65 kW.

 

The Energi should never have a 12V battery failure since the 12V is charged whenever the car is connected to an EVSE.

 

The deal breaker for a wife/mom on the Energi even with all the incentives/rebate is the super small trunk/cargo area site to the higher hump of the battery. most moms/wifes need that larger space in back to carry around stuff and won't want to lift it up higher over the hump than they need to.

Get the hybrid SEL.

 

Also the Energi is only for folks who mostly do stuff around their house and drive mostly the town/city at less than 35/40 mph. If you plan to drive at highway speeds at 45-75 mph most of the time and some city then the hybrid makes much more sense. don't forget to take into account the cost of installing and running the extra power source in your garage if you go for the Energi. Some houses aren't even rated for it and have to put in a separate breaker.

I disagree with both statements. The Energi hump is not that large & still leaves a lot of cargo room.

 

And, even at 75 MPH the Energi on battery is far more efficient than the hybrid.

 

However, understanding your electrical situation is important before buying an Energi. If you have a 15-amp circuit with no other power draw then you'll be fine with that. The Energi pulls about 13 amps when charging. If you want to go 240V then you usually have to get a permit and get the work inspected in most municipalities even if you can do the installation yourself. 240V charging should not be looked at as a "will it pay for itself?" decision. It should be a convenience decision. With 240V charging you can completely recharge in under 2.5 hours. That is one benefit. But, the big benefit is preconditioning. With 120V only your preconditioning will be very limited. It is so nice to get into a car that is already cool in the summertime, or warm in the winter. We're loving it with our Focus Electric!

[ptjones]

hybridbear "The Energi hump is not that large & still leaves a lot of cargo room."   For some of us the space in the back is barely enough and would not been able to take some equipment with the bump in the back. I don't know what the weight limitation is for stacking heavy boxes on top of the HVB is.  Frankly I wish they would come out with the Grand CMAX with a bigger HVB. :)

 

Paul

[Adrian_L]

 

I disagree with both statements. The Energi hump is not that large & still leaves a lot of cargo room.

 

 

You have GOT to be kidding.  My wife and I figured you could get 2, maybe 3 of those little flight attendant suitcases in there.  It was an absolute deal breaker for us.   The space is tiny.

[Smiling Jack]

You have GOT to be kidding.  My wife and I figured you could get 2, maybe 3 of those little flight attendant suitcases in there.  It was an absolute deal breaker for us.   The space is tiny.

 

Others have reported fitting 4 of those (max carry-on bags), and that is without folding down either of the back seats.

On the othe hand, if you need more space than the C-max Energi has, then a Plug-in Hybrid is simply not in your picture at this time.

 

Or if you generally like the C-max overall and you need even more space than the C-max Hybrid has, you would probably love the the eco-boost Escape.

 

Looking at it the other way around, If youve already chosen the C-max Hybrid over the Escape, then you have already chosen to give up a bit of cargo space to accommodate the Hybrid system.  The next question is:  Would you be willing in to give up a bit more to have the Plug-in Hybrid?

 

For some of us, the clear answer to that was yes.  For others, it was no.   And now most of us will defend our choice to the death!

Edited July 8, 2014 by Smiling Jack

[Adrian_L]

Don't get me wrong, I think the Energi is a great car.  But the statement "alot of cargo room", is simply not true. 

 

Shouldn't you be over here, partner? 

 

http://fordcmaxenergiforum.com/

[Smiling Jack]

Others have reported fitting 4 of those (max carry-on bags), and that is without folding down either of the back seats.

On the othe hand, if you need more space than the C-max Energi has, then a Plug-in Hybrid is simply not in your picture at this time.

 

Or if you generally like the C-max overall and you need even more space than the C-max Hybrid has, you would probably love the the eco-boost Escape.

 

Looking at it the other way around, If youve already chosen the C-max Hybrid over the Escape, then you have already chosen to give up a bit of cargo space to accommodate the Hybrid system.  The next question is:  Would you be willing in to give up a bit more to have the Plug-in Hybrid?

 

For some of us, the clear answer to that was yes.  For others, it was no.   And now most of us will defend our choice to the death!

 

Further to this, space comparison (cubic feet):

 

                                          Escape                  C-Max Hybrid                  C-Max Energi

 

passenger space              98.1                       99.7                                99.7

 

space behind 1st row        67.8                       52.6                                42.8

 

space behind 2nd row       34.3                       24.5                                19.2