Toad Charge from LSL Products - charge line for towing

[bossvt]

Hi, I am new to this forum.  We bought a 2013 C-Max a few months ago with the specific intent of towing it behind our motor home.  Turns out we are now also using it as our primary vehicle.

 

Initially I was having problems with the battery draining after about 4 hours of towing.  I suspected the charge line we were using was inadequate. Therefore, I just recently installed a Toad Charge from LSL Products.  Had my first real test of it this past weekend, and it worked great.  No battery problems after 2 different 6+ hour stints of towing.

 

I made a video of the installation, so I'll share it here.  https://youtu.be/dYA5kwHr084

 

By the way, we chose to go with primarily RoadMaster towing gear, but we do use a Blue Ox Patriot braking system.  

[wab]

Greetings and welcome
The cmax has been an excellent toad, we have over 10K towed miles on it.
 
We like to share the $'s, Roadmaster tow bar, Brake Buddy charge wire, Blue Ox base plate.
 
I don't like the Patriot braking system
( the 3 legged base is a terrible idea + when it's time for the morning and every 2 hour motor run I can't get in the car )
and plan to install an Invisibrake.

[garymkrieg]

We tow a 2015 Fusion Energi, as we fulltime RV. My question is how do you set the car up for tow.  Is the ignition off or in accessory?  Our manual stays to turn the car off, which we do.  The longest we have towed without disconnecting or charging the car was three consecutive days, Las Vegas to Seattle, our battery was just fine after three days.  My assumption is that with the car off the draw on the battery is the same as if it were parked. So why after 4 hours of towing is it dead, would it be dead after sitting 4 hours in a parking lot?

[wab]

We tow a 2015 Fusion Energi, as we fulltime RV. My question is how do you set the car up for tow.  Is the ignition off or in accessory?  Our manual stays to turn the car off, which we do.  The longest we have towed without disconnecting or charging the car was three consecutive days, Las Vegas to Seattle, our battery was just fine after three days.  My assumption is that with the car off the draw on the battery is the same as if it were parked. So why after 4 hours of towing is it dead, would it be dead after sitting 4 hours in a parking lot?

 

We have to have our SEL in accessory because the transmission is in neutral.

When I hit the stop button most of the car goes to sleep, BUT not everything which will run the 12V battery down after a couple of hours, the MH keeps the battery charged through the charge wire.

[garymkrieg]

I'm confused.  When you hit the start button, put the car in neutral and hit the stop button again the car does not turn off?  You don't get the "thank you for driving a hybrid" message? The original instructions from Ford had people keep the car in accessory mode.  The new instructions from Ford says to turn the car off. I understand what the charge line does what I don't understand is whether you are towing with the car off.

 

Gary

[wab]

When the transmission is in neutral and I hit the stop button the only message I see is "Shift to Park" and some warning chimes.

If I sit in the car long enough the dash light go out just like it's going to sleep, same thing happens when I hit stop and open the door.

 

The car is NOT asleep just dozing, the battery WILL go dead after a few hours with NO charge wire.

[garymkrieg]

It must be the difference in model year.  When I press the stop button after putting in neutral I get the "transmission is not in park" message but I also get the "Thanks for driving a hybrid" message like I do whenever I turn the car off.  As I said earlier we towed from Las Vegas to Seattle, a total of 13 hours towing over three days with never disconnecting the car from the motorhome.  I'm glad the Toad Charge is working for you, LSL is a good company, we use some the their other products.

 

Gary

[hmatthews102]

I just returned from a trip to the east coast and back.  I had installed a BrakeBuddy charger and when I stopped after my first days drive the battery was dead.  Checked fuse and everything was as it should be.  Apparrenty the thing is a waste of money.  I took it out and simply extended the power line from the MH direct to the jump point under the hood.  Line is putting out approx 14 volts with MH engine running.  After driving the next day the car was charged and all was good.  No problem rest of trip.  Is there any downside to running this way as opposed to having a charge control device installed?

[plus 3 golfer]

I just returned from a trip to the east coast and back.  I had installed a BrakeBuddy charger and when I stopped after my first days drive the battery was dead.  Checked fuse and everything was as it should be.  Apparrenty the thing is a waste of money.  I took it out and simply extended the power line from the MH direct to the jump point under the hood.  Line is putting out approx 14 volts with MH engine running.  After driving the next day the car was charged and all was good.  No problem rest of trip.  Is there any downside to running this way as opposed to having a charge control device installed?

What's the rating of the BrakeBuddy.?  My guess it's 1 - 2 Amps (trickle charger = $17).  That's likely not enough to keep the C-Max battery charged when in N. That's only 12 -24 Watts.  The active modules likely use more than that.   The Toad Charge = $80 appears to be a 10 Amp maximum output which would be able to keep up with about a 120 Watt load.  Most times you get what you pay for. :)

 

By directly paralleling the C-Max and MH batteries, your MH voltage regulator is now trying to regulate two batteries as one AND the C-Max battery can also supply load to the MH.  This is why the Toad Charge has this feature:

 

  "The TOAD-CHARGE™ kit consists of several components: The Charge Controller installs in the towed vehicle's engine compartment - It monitors the charging current and prevents reverse current flow when the motorhome engine is started."

 

So, the issue is that you will have different voltage drops across the batteries when charging because of the different wire lengths (resistance) involved and the batteries are not the same size which they should be using two wired in parallel on one charge controller.

Edited October 24, 2017 by Plus 3 Golfer

[hmatthews102]

Thanks.  I will not be regularly towing the Cmax, but I want it right when I do.  I will put a Toad Charger on it.  I am also setting up a Miata to tow flat.  That will be my usual tow car.  I have been using a dolly for the last several years, but it is getting to be too much for me to move around if I have to take it off the MH. 

[mjrv]

Re: 2015 C-Max Energi & Toad Charge from LSL Products

 

So, it appears that I can hook up the Toad Charge to the 12v posts under the front hood (where my manual says to connect for jump-start).

 

QUESTION 1: I'll be using Blue Ox BX8869 Diodes Taillight Wiring Kit.  I BELIEVE that that umbilical connection cable from my motorhome has a wire with 12 volts; has anyone connected the Toad Charge that way without running a separate umbilical cable direct to the motorhome's battery?

 

Also: I see from the manual (pg 187 in my version) that the procedure is: 

1. Put climate control into "Recirculate" mode.

2. "Start" the car by pushing the button with the brake pedal down to turn the system "On".

3. Put it in Neutral

4. Turn engine "Off" by pressing the button - notice the "Trip Summary" on the dashboard.  (This really isn't "Off", is it?)

 

We know that "Off" is really only notional and that there is some drain on the battery in this state.  This will drain the 12v battery eventually while towing.  So, I'm installing a Toad Charge.  I'm also installing a Blue Ox Patriot II braking system which I will plug into the cigar lighter socket under the gear shift.

 

Question 2: I understand that the 12v battery is normally charged using the 300v HVB when the car is "On".  When the car is hooked up to the motorhome and the Toad Charge is connected and powered up, will turning the car "ON" in step 2 above maybe cause a conflict where the HVB AND the Toad Charge are competing to charge the 12v battery?

 

Question 3: Will the cigar lighter continue to receive power when the car is in this half-off state while towing?  Even after 10 minutes or whatever the timeout is?

[mjrv]

Re: 2015 C-Max Energi & Toad Charge from LSL Products

 

So, it appears that I can hook up the Toad Charge to the 12v posts under the front hood (where my manual says to connect for jump-start).

 

QUESTION 1: I'll be using Blue Ox BX8869 Diodes Taillight Wiring Kit.  I BELIEVE that that umbilical connection cable from my motorhome has a wire with 12 volts; has anyone connected the Toad Charge that way without running a separate umbilical cable direct to the motorhome's battery?

ANSWER 1: Yes, my guy took the "+" 12v off the 7-6 umbilical cable to power the toad charge (and supply power to a separate cigar lighter jack he ran back to the driver's compartment which I tuck into the little cabinet that the engine computer port thingy is in).

 

Also: I see from the manual (pg 187 in my version) that the procedure is: 

1. Put climate control into "Recirculate" mode.

2. "Start" the car by pushing the button with the brake pedal down to turn the system "On".

3. Put it in Neutral

4. Turn engine "Off" by pressing the button - notice the "Trip Summary" on the dashboard.  (This really isn't "Off", is it?)

 

We know that "Off" is really only notional and that there is some drain on the battery in this state.  This will drain the 12v battery eventually while towing.  So, I'm installing a Toad Charge.  I'm also installing a Blue Ox Patriot II braking system which I will plug into the cigar lighter socket under the gear shift.

 

Question 2: I understand that the 12v battery is normally charged using the 300v HVB when the car is "On".  When the car is hooked up to the motorhome and the Toad Charge is connected and powered up, will turning the car "ON" in step 2 above maybe cause a conflict where the HVB AND the Toad Charge are competing to charge the 12v battery?

ANSWER 2: I am TOLD that the whole point of the Toad Charge is to prevent conflicts between the Ford's charging and charging from the motorhome.

 

Question 3: Will the cigar lighter continue to receive power when the car is in this half-off state while towing?  Even after 10 minutes or whatever the timeout is?

ANSWER 3: Apparently not.  I tested all 3 cigar lighters and the two in the front turn off after a while.  I believe the one in the way-back stays on, but I decided to add a 4th cigar lighter jack which I have tucked into the little cabinet under the dash on the left.

Edited February 19, 2019 by mjrv

[TomH]

Joining this conversation in July 2021.  Have a 2013 C-Max I've just begun towing behind my RV.  Ford told me the front wheels MUST be off the ground, so putting on a dolly.  Like others, I can't put it in neutral and shut off the system totally.  Just went on  a month trip with 5 days of towing in neutral, and in accessory mode.  Battery seemed to be fine after each tow.  Trying to find out a good answer to a dumb question.  Q:  Since this is a front wheel drive car, can I place the transmission in PARK and let the rear wheels free spin?  Locking the front wheels would make it more secure on the dolly and enable me to turn the ignition completely off instead of leaving in accessory mode.

[fbov]

4 hours ago, TomH said:

... Have a 2013 C-Max I've just begun towing behind my RV.  Ford told me the front wheels MUST be off the ground, so putting on a dolly. ...

That's odd... your manual says otherwise. Look under "recreational towing."

 

"Can I tow the hybrid behind my motor home with all four wheels down?

Yes. Your hybrid vehicle can be flat towed without modification. See Towing (page 182)."

[njlife]

Best thread I can find on my question. Just got baseplate etc. installed on my 2017 CMax. I have the wiring figured out but wanted to ask about installing the 2-3 Hopkins to separate combined stop and turn as cmax has separate. I also have the diode kit to prevent feedback. Has anyone installed both? Also when towing I have a brake buddy and wondering if when braking it charges the hybrid battery? Manual says key in accessory position after initial startup. First year of snow birding and would appreciate any input.