How widespread is the eCVT failure?

[Nervous but Excited]

On 1/14/2020 at 10:41 PM, plus 3 golfer said:

“Some 2013-2016 Fusion, MKZ and C-Max vehicles equipped with an HF35 transmission and built on or before 15-Aug-2015 may exhibit a thumping/rubbing or grinding noise coming from the transmission.” 

 

Am I right in understanding that many 2016 model year C-Maxes will have build dates in 2015 - and therefore be vulnerable to this issue?

Very frustrating little problem if you're trying to buy a second hand car!

[homestead]

The car build date is on the sticker inside the driver door.

[Austens39]

Our 2014 C-Max Transmission has gone bad at 127000 miles. We have taken this vehicle to be serviced at a ford Dealership since we bought it in 2018 with 70000 miles. The factory warranty was good until 100k miles (raised by Ford after the transmission issues came to light) and the extended warranty we purchased on the powertrain until 121000. Unlike Paul who commented above, we did not receive a replacement under warranty and are now looking at $13,000 transmission replacement on a vehicle barely worth $6000 and 7000 miles over warranty. 

Not buying another vehicle from these con artists. 

[jzchen]

I’m honestly not sure how you can blame Ford for not covering the transmission above the agreed on 121k mi though.

 

$13k seems steep IMHO for transmission replacement…

[homestead]

Agree with jzchen, Get some more quotes on the new transmission.  

Good luck!

[ptjones]

On 11/17/2022 at 3:56 PM, Austens39 said:

Our 2014 C-Max Transmission has gone bad at 127000 miles. We have taken this vehicle to be serviced at a ford Dealership since we bought it in 2018 with 70000 miles. The factory warranty was good until 100k miles (raised by Ford after the transmission issues came to light) and the extended warranty we purchased on the powertrain until 121000. Unlike Paul who commented above, we did not receive a replacement under warranty and are now looking at $13,000 transmission replacement on a vehicle barely worth $6000 and 7000 miles over warranty. 

Not buying another vehicle from these con artists. 

I don't think they are con artist, It is unfortunate your trans went out and I think you should be able to it done for under 6k if you search around. I got 174k mi out of my second trans before I traded it in.

 

Paul

[C-MaxA2]

Yes, you can own a '2016' that was built in 2015.  That was the case with my '2016' (I didn't know you could easily check the build date on the inside of the driver's door hinge then).

 

Fortunately, the important date is Aug. 15, 2015 ) 'on or before Aug. 15, 2015' means risk of transmission failure.  Our '2016 was built in Oct. of 2015 so it's 'safe'. 

[nogoodbum]

A few questions for those here with knowledge. After a good bit of research, the majority of the trans problems point to high heat as a big factor in the failures. Ford has a history of problems with press-on fittings [[bearings, gears] in the past mainly involving camshaft] in high temp situations. Fittings would heat up, expand, & loosen, resulting in damage. As a preventative measure could I add another trans cooler to the system? Could there be any problems with fluid being too cool for proper operation? What lines coming off trans are inlet or outlet? 2013SEL, fluid changed at 100k [fluid was only about 10% darker than new at the time], very rarely drive at high speed [above 65mph]. traffic jams are limited to mainly behind a school bus once or twice a week, I usually don't turn A/C on, prefer open windows. THANKS for the read & any responses.

[SnowStorm]

On 12/4/2022 at 6:25 AM, nogoodbum said:

Ford has a history of problems with press-on fittings [[bearings, gears] in the past

Interesting, as that appears to be the problem with the early transmissions with transfer shaft failures.  Mine failed, I tore down the old tranny and what appeared to be a pressed on ring had slipped which then allowed the shaft to move sideways causing the problems.  My 'pet' theory was that a software glitch caused a severe jolt after a long down hill run using engine braking and that jolt drove the ring out of place.  (It was quite an awful noise when it happened.)  Or, it was a design or manufacturing problem.  I suppose any of these could be aggravated by too much heat but I would doubt that heat is the root problem - if at all.  I think there are a number of posts where folks have tracked transmission temps under various conditions.  You can certainly get the data with Forscan.  For me, I'll never use engine braking again!

[nogoodbum]

My apology for not detailing Ford's past history on bearing/gear failures. Most of which either predate majority of posters or involved low volume models that few had dealings with. In the early/mid 1980s Ford produced a 2.3L inline 4 that was prone to cam failure/breakage. Cam would break in half in high heat/rev situations. Since the engine was a non-interference motor, very little damaged resulted except to the cam itself in the majority of cases, & the fix was just a relatively easy fix by replacing cam. Ford PR did a great job on the problem pointing to replacing the cam [past & future production] with a "new" hardened steel version. They did not point out that 99% of the cams failed at the center cam bearing point. Ford had an issue in the 1990s with the low volume SHO motors that had  a press-on cam gear that would slip & spin resulting in blowing up the motor. Again most failures came in high heat situations. Fix was a preventative of tack welding the cam gear in place before failure, but if welds weren't correctly done , they would fail in high heat. Based on my very limited [& I mean very, very] on-line research a lot of CVT failures, [not just Ford but industry wide] have happened in high heat/revs spots. As of today I don't have any CVT issues [2013 120k] & would like to keep it that way for the life of the car. As a cheap,[$100-$150] measure to hopefully extend the life of the CVT,  I was looking to add a cooler to the trans & would like to hear of any drawbacks & advice for & or against. Thanks for the read & I hope for all of the C-Max family a very MERRY CHRISTMAS.

[fxo]

On 1/13/2020 at 9:24 PM, plus 3 golfer said:

First, there is no transmission pan.  I suppose you could get a magnetic drain plug.  But, you can easily drain the fluid out and check and then fill by the fill / Fluid level plug. IIRC, fluid change maintenance is 150k miles. 
 

I don’t recall if anyone has made it past 200k on the original transmission on early MY C-Maxes.  There’s likely early taxi fleet C-Maxes that may have made 200k miles.   So, my guess is that the likelihood of a transmission failure prior to 200k on early MYs may be as high as 10%. I would also guess that over 90% make it past 100k miles (8 yr. / 100k mile is warranty  in non CARB states).   I have 122k miles on my 2013 C-Max with no bearing issue “symptoms / sounds.” Unfortunately, only Ford knows the failure rates of the C-Max transmissions. Attached is a snip of CR reliability consumer survey results for the C-Max.  Yellow is average, light green with an one chevron is better than average, and dark green with two chevrons is excellent reliability.

, 

If I were to get a used one,  I’d get a late build 2016 MY or later MY as it appears Ford may have mitigated the bearing issue in those transmissions.  Of course you will pay more for a 2016 than a 2014 all other things being similar.  But, the 2016 likely has a better chance to make 200k miles on the original transmission.  

 

This data in late 2024, looks different now, I think Consumer Reports found some transmissions with issues maybe built around 2015 (MY 2016) and in early 2013 releases, but overall the eCVTs are very reliable. Consumer Reports is stringent with giving out double green arrows. And if you do a bit of research on eCVT from Toyota, these things are iron clad. If Ford used Aisin (Toyota's transmission house) then this should not be a grave concern, outside of what is noted. 

[The Garage King]

We finally removed and split-open the HF35 in our 2013 C-Max Energi after 222,500 miles.  The "grinding" noise had started ~6 months prior (~12,000 miles prior).  This is the first serious problem we have had with this car since new.

 

NOTE: I had changed the transmission fluid twice (first time @ 99,659 miles, the second time @ 200,657 miles).  The interval recommended by Ford in the owners manual is every 150,000 miles(!). 

 

Three of the four roller bearings in our HF35 had severe spalling.  I replaced all four roller bearings as well as the pump filter. 

 

In hindsight, I wish I had changed the transmission fluid every 50,000 miles; maybe that would have extended the life, maybe a lot, maybe a small amount.  I think 100,000 miles was asking too much out of Mercon LV in the HF35 application, let alone 150,000 miles which Ford recommended.  We ordered a 2025 Ford Maverick Hybrid (CVT), and I'll be replacing the transmission fluid every 50,000 miles, religiously.  

 

I have about ~$250.00 into repairing the HF35 in our C-Max.  Transmission has been reinstalled and car has been test-driven:  No more grinding noise.  Hoping to get another 100,000 miles out of this car.

 

If you are mechanically-inclined, have a "cherry-picker", transmission jack, and are willing to spend ~$100 on bearing puller tools (if you don't already own them), this can be done with the help of a second mechanically-inclined friend/relative, and not that much $$...