plus 3 golfer

Agree with HB. Also, your oil doesn't need changed every 5 months or 5 k miles. It's around 10 k miles. Your car has a built in oil life monitor which will indicate when to change the oil. One can DIY for around $30 or let any local shop do it. In addition, the Hybrid components (see components covered below) are covered for 8 years / 100 k miles. So, if it's these components that you are worried about ("mysterious mangle of hoses and wires"), your covered. One other point and that is does your auto insurer offer Mechanical Breakdown Insurance in your state? Check GEICO's out. You pay yearly for the MBI coverage with your insurance premium. So far I've paid less than $86 total premium for the first 3 years of coverage. It's $250 deductible for 100 k miles / 7 years and covers everything except routine maintenance items and wear and tear. I'm outside the 36 k B2B warranty so my maximum liability for a 3/36 component failure is $250 (for example ABS pump fails, AC electric compressor fails and so forth). Of course, I don't expect any failures. So, IMO MBI is a very cheap way of hedging the cost of failures and since it's an insurance product (unlike extended warranties) is regulated by the states which should assure the consumer of fair pricing.

Good info especially the average capacity which at 4118 miles is 1390 Wh or 1.39 kWh. It will be interesting to follow as mileage accumulates. Here's a link to all testing documents of the C-Max Hybrid. It appears the 4 test vehicles have significantly more mileage on them then in the battery test docs. I hope they eventually update the battery test docs.

You do not want to connect a load across the battery terminals as the negative cable includes a battery monitoring sensor (see below). All loads should be between positive and chassis ground. If you take off the cover off as SS suggests (see image below),you will see that the negative terminal (terminal towards front of car) ties to chassis ground (cable running to ground lug) to the left of the positive battery terminal.

65 mpg is likely Imperial gallons which is 54 mpg US gallons and the EU fuel economy tests are considerably more optimistic than the EPA numbers. Also, the UK Ford specs show 53.3 Imp mpg which is likely the combined city and urban cycles. My guess is the 65 mpg is the urban cycle only. For comparison, I think the VW Jetta 2.0 diesel is also around 53 mpg Imp. The EPA rating of the 2015 2.0 TDI is 31 city, 46 hwy, and 36 combined. Bottom line: disregard the 65 mpg FE number as we have no idea what is refers to. ;) My guess if the C-Max 2.0 were sold here it's EPA rating would be about the same as the Jetta TDI.

If you are talking about the slight gap between the windshield and headliner, that's the way it is. You didn't have to pay extra for the gap. :) See the post for pic.

Ah but I'll lose that parking space in my local Basha's parking lot if I don't take it immediately. :) Most times I have to do a fast, 3 point turn in my C-Max to secure the diagonal spot when cars are parked on both sides of the spot - not so in my Rogue or Jetta TDI. "Unacceptable" turning circle in the C-Max (41 feet bumper to bumper).

Open the Key FOB and inside you will find a metal key to unlock the door. Insert the end into a slot in the key FOB for leverage when turning the key.

I tend to agree with stevedebi. I do not use any OBDII device to continually monitor data while driving except on longer trips which are infrequent. I simply don't see the benefit in normal day to day driving of monitoring various parameters as we are not hypermilers and aren't going to drive differently because of the data. I've done controlled testing several times to see if I can observe aerodynamic benefits of grille covers and gas pods. I've also recorded data to observe how the hybrid system operates under various conditions simply to gain knowledge not to change the way I drive. So, IMO as I stated in another thread, spend around $20 for an ELM327 and download FORScan for free to a Windows machine and one can immediately monitor tire pressure. Just put the car in ready mode and you can check tire pressure on your Windows desk top (doesn't need to be portable machine, just needs to be in wireless range). FORScan when initialized / connected automatically scans your car for DTC. It's the best $20 OBDII reader I've seen. :) ;)

To add to what fbov said, I would not purchase a ScanGauge (very expensive for what you get) to access OBDII data. Do you have a SmartPhone, Tablet, or Laptop (something portable)? If yes, what is the operating system version? Depending on the device you have, there are several APPS that can be downloaded to the device based on its operating system, IMO, you want an APP that allows the user to enter custom Parameter IDs (PIDs) which are codes used to request data from a vehicle like the tire pressure data discussed here. Some APPS are free while others can be purchased for a nominal cost (usually less than $20). Then depending on the APP one selects, one needs to buy an interface module which is either a BlueTooth or WiFi wireless module that plugs into the OBDII port on your vehicle so that the APP can communicate with the vehicle. These modules are usually available on Ebay or Amazon for less that $30. I've purchased both a BlueTooth and WiFi module (less than $40 total). I have Torque Pro ($4.95), FORscan (free), EngineLink ($5.95), and DashCommand ($9.95). So, I can use my IPad, Android SmartPhone, or Windows Laptop to monitor and collect data. You don't have to be an electrical wiz. You simply need to be able to follow instructions which for the most part is easy and you can probably find youtube how to videos or go to the APP forums for help.

I saw one on youtube (just search). That's what I did to find out how to enter custom PIDs. It requires several steps to get to the PID data entry screen. The PID data is entered into the form that's accessed by pushing the menu gear /wheel in lower left, settings, manage extra PIDs, menu options in the upper right (three vertical dots), add custom PIDs, OK, and then entering PID data into the form, You can then cancel, accept, or test the PID. You then have the custom PID in the list of available PIDs to monitor. Setting up a new gauge is done by entering the Real time info screens. Then you can add a new gauge by touching (and holding) finger on a screen to bring up the add display option.

Make sure you put in 726 for the OBD Header (shown above as TP Hdr.) for the pressure PIDs. It should work then. It's nice now to just monitor tire pressure with a smartpnone instead of using a pressure gauge every few weeks or so. Thanks, jdbob. :)

Looks like you can get it for less than $1500 from Flood Ford. The hybrid components are covered for 8 years / 100 k miles. So, buying the ESP you'll get an extra 25 k miles coverage for the expensive stuff like the Hybrid transmission and HVB. The rest of the power train (ICE) is covered for 5 years / 60 k miles. I wouldn't expect any issues with ICE in 125 k miles (remember mileage with ICE running will be a lot less than 125 k miles). You also have the Federal Emissions warranty for the catalytic converter and perhaps a few other emissions items. I suggest you look at whats covered under these warranties and then decide whether you feel better paying $1500 or risk paying several thousand dollars more than the $1500 for an unlikely expensive component failure. One other comment and that is one can cancel the ESP agreement (read the T&Cs for specifics) and either you or your lender will receive a pro rata payment for the unused contract period (months or miles) less a $75 charge. So, all is not lost if one decides to sell the car before the plan expires.

You must have a lot of miles on your C-Max as the 11 k seems low otherwise. My take on selling / trading follows. I agree that the EPA revised FE and the IQS, dependability, and reliability surveys being worse than average car turned many prospective buyers away. In addition, Ford has offered deep discounts on new C-Maxes pushing resale value down. So, resale value goes down. I also agree that taking ones C-Max to the dealership frequently for recalls and updates is a nuisance. Mine has been to the dealer six times since purchase in Dec. 2012. Four times for recalls, one for a wheel alignment, and once for a DTC for traction control. I still have one more trip to make for a recall. So that will be at least five trips to the dealer in last than 3 years of ownership for safety and performance recalls. That may be acceptable for some as they likely have their oil changes and other routine maintenance done at the dealer and incorporate the recall work into their scheduled maintenance visits. But for other owners and prospective buyers it's a negative when comparing to other vehicles they have owned. So, resale value may go down. But having said the above, I do not plan on getting rid of my C-Max anytime soon. My overall FE is approaching 42 mpg. The car has been rock solid in comfort and performance. Any buyer back in 2012 or 2013 through due diligence should have been able to "see through" the incorrect EPA FE numbers (many, many early independent reviews / tests on FE) and the issues affecting the worse than average survey results (much discussion on forums of the issues). Ford lowering the EPA numbers is of no consequence to me as I'm getting what I expected in FE when I made the purchase (and Ford paid me for their mistake). So, I find no "economic" or "performance" reasons to sell / trade my C-Max.

Already posted. ;)

LOL there's usually two sides to every mishap. Congresswoman Norton will likely agree that this is clear evidence that the C-Max turning circle is unacceptable when making a u-turn into a diagonal parking space between two vehicles. I rest my case. ;) :)

Usually full glass replacement is a inexpensive adder. My $100 comprehensive deductible is $52 a year for the C-Max and includes full glass coverage (no deductible on glass). Increasing the deductible to $1000 with no glass coverage except windshield chip repair would only save about $40 a year. IMO, $40 a year for full glass coverage on the C-Max is a no-brainer as the cash price for the C-Max windshield was slightly over $400 when Safelite (see numbers in link) replaced my windshield over a year ago under my $100 comprehensive.

Data below is from hannahWCU monitoring. SoC is data of the displayed HVB battery symbol state of charge, SOC is actual HVB state of charge. 1% change of SoC = 0.38 change of SOC When SoC reads 100 - SOC reads 69.7 When SoC reads 80 - SOC reads 62.1 When SoC reads 70 - SOC reads 58.0 When SoC reads 50 - SOC reads 50.4 When SoC reads 30 - SOC reads 42.7 I've recorded and monitored data many times and have seen similar numbers as above. For sake of discussion we can assume the SOC of the HVB varies between about 30% - 70%. The minimum SOC I've seen is in the mid to upper 30% (don't recall exact number but around 35+%). In normal driving I'll see a SOC varying between about 40% - 55% +- a few % points. One can easily fill the HVB via regenerative braking down a moderate grade to near the 70% level (battery symbol filled including the tip). At that level ICE begins spinning and filling the HVB stops (normal engine braking instead of regenerative braking). I have also tried driving in EV+ mode to deplete the HVB (higher threshold level before ICE kicks in) by driving around the block and have a difficult time getting the SOC anywhere near 30% as the threshold level begins dropping significantly once under 40% SOC.

Correct. I wasn't clear that Torque App applies to an Android device and FORscan applies to an IOS or Windows device.

No, I do not have the Scangauge codes. As I linked to before, here's the link for the Torque APP PIDs. I think the PIDs shown as generator inverter temp and motor inverter temp are the coil temps. I have Torque App on my smartphone but have yet to enter all the PIDs shown in the link. One should be able to convert the torque PID data to scangauge data. If you have access to an IOS device, Android device, or Windows laptop and an ELM327, you could load FORScan (free) or pay a nominal amount for Torque (assuming inverter temps are the coil temps) and get the temp data. You could experminent with various codes for the Scangauge based on knowing the TFT Scangauge PID data and what the codes mean, examples (found on internet) of converting Scangauge PIDs to Torque PID data and then reverse engineering the Torque PIDs in the link above to Scangauge :).

AFAIK, you have no way of knowing the frequency of starting ICE to maintain the HVB charge level at a proper storage level. Mileage is an indication of how much ICE may have run but not the frequency as ICE could have been started every month or so without driving the car (or just driving around the lot) to maintain the SOC of the HVB and the 12 V battery. The HVB will lose storage capacity over time depending on conditions (temperature and level of charge). The best case would be that the HVB SOC during storage was between about 40-50% and ambient temperatures were below about 75 F (batteryuniversity.com). I wouldn't worry about a few % point loss of permanent capacity after a year of so of storage under those conditions.. This should be one of the reasons for the lower asking price. Also, remember that the HVB normally operates between about a 40-55% SOC range with a minimum of around 30% SOC and maximum of about 70% SOC. In my monitoring of SOC I rarely see above 60% SOC and below higher 30% SOC. So, I would think that the hybrid algorithms (and FE) would not be affected until the battery storage capacity fell to the upper limits of operations. Based on Ford's key life tests (see graph below), I doubt you would have any issues with the HVB. The dealer should be able to measure various parameters to estimate any permanent HVB loss as Ford has to be able to determine capacity loss for warranty purposes. I'd require the dealer to provide such data.

Just a couple of comments. Virtually all vehicle control modules have 12 V supplied to them continuously (hot all the time). The Body Control Module (BCM) monitors the "start" sequence (key or push button). It appears that the BCM then communicates via the CAN to other control modules to start the car and the DC/DC converter picks up the 12 V load and so forth. There is a relay that puts 12 V to the accessories / accessory modules. So, IMO either the 12 V battery drops below a threshold level and the BCM won't start the car (but one would believe there would be DTCs in this case or there's a issue with the software that Ford doesn't understand under certain conditions perhaps communications among modules during the starting sequence. So, perhaps applying a 12 V jumper / charger for a short time raises voltage above a threshold for the BCM or raises voltage sufficiently to remove a condition in other modules that prevented starting. I briefly looked at the wiring diagrams for the C-Max and Fusion and the diagrams functionally appear the same with respect to starting and modules. Of courses wiring and location of components may be somewhat different though. So, I don't know why the Ford dealer would say the systems are different. Perhaps there's wiring / connector impedance issues to some modules that differs between the C-Max and Fusion that exacerbates the 12 V no start on the C-Max over the Fusion. Also, it wouldn't surprise me if CR for the Fusion Hybrid reversed the Fuel System and Electrical System ratings. :) Did the Fusion Hybrid really have "Black Circle" issues in its Fuel System in 2013? Since sales of 2014 C-Maxes dropped considerably over 2013, perhaps CR didn't have sufficient data for the 2014 and used the 2013 data. I don't think we've seen as many 2014 with the battery issue as 2013 but again that may simply be due to numbers on the road.

.. and maybe me, I fit a front load LG Washer in the back of my Hybrid laying on its side (carton removed). Washer dimensions are 27" wide, 30" deep (counting knobs and protrusions on back) and 39" tall. There's about 2" to spare at the top center but tapering down towards the sides and 6" side to side. The smallest carton dimension was 29 1/2" which would likely have been too much to "squeeze in" (so didn't try). Fitting it in the C-Max saved a $25 delivery charge (just outside the "free" delivery range) or me driving an extra 50 miles RT to get my Rogue the next day to haul the washer.

So, you're getting virtually the same temp reading with IR thermometer on the transmission case as the TFT and you are measuring cooler line temps with the IR also? If flow is being restricted, maybe the internal fluid pump filter is restricting flow or there's a defective pump / impeller spinning on the shaft. I would assume the impeller is of a high temperature "plastic". I recall VW / Audi having problems with "plastic" impellers a good many years ago with higher coolant temps. A quick search indicates the Audi pumps now use a composite "PPS" material which is good to 400 F. I hope Ford didn't go cheap on their HF35 transmission. Also, did we find out what changes were made to the HF35 as a result of the TSB regarding HEV C-Max Taxi operating conditions and bearing noise? I think some thought that the HEV Taxi transmissions might be overheating since ICE needs to run to turn the fluid pump and since the TSB did not include the Energi models with external fluid pumps. Perhaps the internal fluid pumps were failing causing higher TFT, higher bearing temps, fluid breakdown and bearing noise.

I finally got around to testing transmission temperatures under these conditions: Relatively flat road with very slight rolling terrain. No grille covers. ICE at operating temperature Ambient Temp = 90 F AC on at 74 set point 30 Mile Round trip - 20 miles at 67-72 mph with one exit to turn around - 10 miles at 25 - 55 mph with several stops each direction Temperature Range: 140 F < TFT < 148 F 160 F < Motor Coil Temp < 175 F 150 F < Generator Coil Temp < 165 F Motor coil temps were highest at the end of regenerative braking. When high speed cruising, temperatures varied little and were about in the middle of the ranges above. Paul, have you checked the motor and generator coil temps? You want those to run cool to maximize efficiency. Also, that should give you a good check on whether the TFT sensor is "bad".