I HAVE FOUND THE ILLUSIVE MPG SWEET SPOT!

[plus 3 golfer]

Yes, if the amount of energy to cool two vehicles was the same but one vehicle got double the FE as the other, the affect on the fuel efficient vehicle would be twice the % as the inefficient vehicle.  For example, if one gallon of fuel was used for AC on a  400 mile trip but one vehicle got 20 mpg and the other 40 mpg, the affect of the AC on the inefficient vehicle would be 5% (1 gal/(400 miles/ 20 mpg)) while the affect on the efficient vehicle would be 10% (1 gal/ (400 miles / 40 mpg).  So without AC, the inefficient vehicle would normally get 21.1 mpg (400 miles / 19 gallons) - not a big mpg affect of AC on mpg.  But the efficient vehicle without using AC would have got 44.4 mpg (400 miles  / 9 gallons) or a difference of 4.4 mpg - quite noticeable.

 

I said this before that once owners begin using AC in the summer period, there FE will drop considerably more than they likely think it will (especially owners "stepping up" from inefficient vehicles.    

Edited May 1, 2013 by Plus 3 Golfer

[Naplesfred]

When you turn c-max off it gives you your life time mpg as well as miles. at 6500 miles my life time mpg is 48.2

[Riddley]

When you turn c-max off it gives you your life time mpg as well as miles. at 6500 miles my life time mpg is 48.2

 

Fred, that's an insanely good number. Very few SEL drivers (non-Energi) will see 48.2 lifetime at 6500 total. Perhaps ptjones and recompense, who are certified freaks when it comes to mpgs..

 

Before I get bombarded by all the others out there who are great hypermilers, I didn't say you wouldn't see the lifetime average at 48.2, but at that low a mileage?

 

I'm convinced that it is only possible to do this in temperate climate zones, and only by someone very deft with the gas pedal and attention to the charge level in the battery.  

[Jus-A-CMax]

Fred, that's an insanely good number. Very few SEL drivers (non-Energi) will see 48.2 lifetime at 6500 total. Perhaps ptjones and recompense, who are certified freaks when it comes to mpgs..

 

Before I get bombarded by all the others out there who are great hypermilers, I didn't say you wouldn't see the lifetime average at 48.2, but at that low a mileage?

 

I'm convinced that it is only possible to do this in temperate climate zones, and only by someone very deft with the gas pedal and attention to the charge level in the battery.  

 

Thank goodness I am not in the same group...phew....saved, I can safely drink my ice cold coke by the pool now (it's 95F here folks) :drool:

 

;)

[RaPieR]

 

It works, even with a fully loaded CMax...the secret sauce is the high battery. Let eco-cruise regen the battery as much as possible before double clicking down, the best thing is that it works > 65mph!

 

This was taken on the 101 between Las Posas and Carmen drive...note the speed, note the battery...note the high instant MPG.

 

 

 

Used this many times with my trips to Mammoth as well. 

I've been trying to find this high ICE sweet spot on my drives up highway 401 up to Toronto.  I haven't had much luck yet.  I'm able to fill up the battery to full on hills but when the road levels out the electric motor is continually used until the battery drains to near 75%.  MPG is at 60mpg or so until the battery reaches 75% then it dips down to 40-38 range.

[Edsel]

It works, even with a fully loaded CMax...the secret sauce is the high battery. Let eco-cruise regen the battery as much as possible before double clicking down, the best thing is that it works > 65mph!

 

This was taken on the 101 between Las Posas and Carmen drive...note the speed, note the battery...note the high instant MPG.

 

 

 

Used this many times with my trips to Mammoth as well.

Just curious. How long does this state last for those achieving it? Do you guys think this is real MPG, or just another C-Max glitch? I have seen this for a second or two, but that's about it. I'm also pretty sure I was going down hill at the time.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Edsel

[RachelnLa]

I have gotten close to this. 42 or 43. ICE high and a flat road. Going about 68 mph.

 

So yes. I believe it is possible.

Edited May 11, 2013 by RachelnLa

[Jus-A-CMax]

Just curious. How long does this state last for those achieving it? Do you guys think this is real MPG, or just another C-Max glitch? I have seen this for a second or two, but that's about it. I'm also pretty sure I was going down hill at the time.

It is more dependent on the terrain and battery level. When going up slope it will drop to 25-35MPG, all depend on the steepness. On flats or down grade, this is the killer app...provided your battery is high. Which is why the Gen said to just let it run on pure ICE to allow the charge to build...aka secret sauce=high battery.

 

Now the Avg MPG does not increase as much vs pure EV, that's just Fords programming. However, u can always restart the ICE high MPG.

[salsaguy]

what speed did you guys have the eco cruise set to?

 

I tried it and got the same results on the same stretch of road.  It does work

 

 

 

 

[salsaguy]

try 72 or 73 degrees instead of 76. its still comfortable but wont use as much much power

 

We do, too.  It's just too humid here to rely on just opening the windows.  I did, however, set the AC for 76 degrees instead of 63, where I was running it.  It was a bit overcast yesterday, so the car was not as hot.  I'll keep giving that a try.  The question would be - is it better to run the AC at a higher temp (76) and a higher fan speed than to run it at a lower temp and lower fan speed.  I did discover that above 76, there was no way to be comfortable in the car.

[salsaguy]

why just SEL owners? why not SEs as well?

 

Fred, that's an insanely good number. Very few SEL drivers (non-Energi) will see 48.2 lifetime at 6500 total. Perhaps ptjones and recompense, who are certified freaks when it comes to mpgs.

[asb]

It takes me about half my commute to find it.  Then, inevitably, I hit traffic...

[Riddley]

why just SEL owners? why not SEs as well?

 

My bad, I just meant "non-Energi", but grabbed the wrong term. .

[mtb9153]

I seem to be in a downward spiral the last two tanks.  I'm doing everything I can to keep my numbers above 44mpg but they just keep going down and fell to 39.9 on my way home from church today.  Road was flat and hypermiling at 32 mph while staying inside the blue range the whole time.  What gives.  It is warmer today than it was two days ago around 80degrees.  I reset the fuel economy and the numbers rose to 58 in minutes and started falling back down hovering for awhile in the high 40's then started falling again as low as 39.9.  I'm sick of this.  I work hard to get better numbers but this is out of my control.

[Generalbeluga]

I'm noticing the same thing.  Lately, my mileage has been falling.  I think it is a function of fatigue; we are all getting tired of babying the car to get over 43 MPG!  I like to drive with the traffic and not have everyone around me cussing and flipping me off as they speed by.   Over time, you just get tired of watching the gauges all the time and you start falling into your old driving habits which don't include hyper-mileageling or the like.  If you want to keep it above 40-43 MPG, you have to play the game consistently and drive it very carefully and stay in the blue or "sweet spot" most of the time.  Trust me, even if you think you are doing everything right, you probably are slipping back into bad habits for the sake of expediency and what I call "Hybrid fatigue."   The car can get great MPG numbers but, you have to work at it!  

[fotomoto]

Yup, folks that live in large urban areas where traffic is crazy have a tough row to hoe as my grandfather liked to say.  Even if you do throw in the towel so to speak, be rest assured you're still getting way better FE than all the other non-hybrid drivers.

[Noah Harbinger]

Yup, folks that live in large urban areas where traffic is crazy have a tough row to hoe as my grandfather liked to say.  Even if you do throw in the towel so to speak, be rest assured you're still getting way better FE than all the other non-hybrid drivers.

 

Yup, the non-hybrid drivers lack regenerative braking, engine shutoff at idle, EV in slow traffic, etc. Everything that prevents the hybrid from reaching its intended milage, affects regular cars even worse. 

[Jus-A-CMax]

I'm noticing the same thing.  Lately, my mileage has been falling.  I think it is a function of fatigue; we are all getting tired of babying the car to get over 43 MPG!  I like to drive with the traffic and not have everyone around me cussing and flipping me off as they speed by.   Over time, you just get tired of watching the gauges all the time and you start falling into your old driving habits which don't include hyper-mileageling or the like.  If you want to keep it above 40-43 MPG, you have to play the game consistently and drive it very carefully and stay in the blue or "sweet spot" most of the time.  Trust me, even if you think you are doing everything right, you probably are slipping back into bad habits for the sake of expediency and what I call "Hybrid fatigue."   The car can get great MPG numbers but, you have to work at it!  

Hey Gen....good to see you posting! Wow for a while there I thought you were getting natural high MPGs, especially with the auto ICE High MPG. Yeah...thats true, gotta play the game and its not for everyone and not necessarily slow as well and with my changes in the drive terrain, I mostly hit the heavy surface streets like Victory and I am still getting a ridiculous 58MPG average on that street...not much, if at all, any freeways now but I know I am capable of getting MPGs out if I have to...but yeah, its a game for sure :)

[Generalbeluga]

Yeah, I'm still lurking about the forum.  Hey, don't get me wrong, I still LOVE my C Max but, if you drive it "normally" you will not get much above 41 MPG, and that's just the truth.   So you new owners, just suck it up and understand that Ford was stretching the truth a little when they claimed 47 MPG, at least unless you are lucky enough to drive in ideal traffic, terrain and weather conditions.  Unfortunately, most of us do not.  Being retired, most of my trips are on local Simi Valley FWYs to COSTCO, the gym and back.  The car doesn't have time to warm up so my milage really suffers.  Having said that, my mileage is still better than any non-hybrid and I love the looks, fit & finish, build quality and power of the C Max.  I have no regrets in my purchase!

Edited June 3, 2013 by Generalbeluga

[fotomoto]

 I still LOVE my C Max but, it you drive it "normally" you will not get much above 41 MPG, and that's just the truth.   

 

 

I think that's pretty much true of any hybrid.  After "giving up", I avg. 46-48 in my Prius that was rated 51 for urban driving.  My wife who won't even try to drive efficiently avg 39-41 on her hwy commute in it.

 

I've found that practicing P&G enough has eventually become second nature and find myself doing it subconsciously in urban driving.

[Noah Harbinger]

Yeah, I'm still lurking about the forum.  Hey, don't get me wrong, I still LOVE my C Max but, it you drive it "normally" you will not get much above 41 MPG, and that's just the truth.   So you new owners, just suck it up and understand that Ford was stretching the truth a little when they claimed 47 MPG, at least unless you are lucky enough to drive in ideal traffic, terrain and weather conditions.  Unfortunately, most of us do not.  Being retired, most of my trips are on local Simi Valley FWYs to COSTCO, the gym and back.  The car doesn't have time to warm up so my milage really suffers.  Having said that, my mileage is still better than any non-hybrid and I love the looks, fit & finish, build quality and power of the C Max.  I have no regrets in my purchase!

 

It's just plain ignorant to say "Ford was stretching the truth". The only fuel economy they are allowed to advertise is the milage they get when following a very precisely defined pattern of speed/acceleration defined by the EPA. They can only report exactly what they get on that test. There is no other option. They have no choice. There is nothing to stretch. They have no stretch room. None, zip, zilch, zero. 

 

What I say is, the differences between the EPA driving tests and real-world driving give the most benefit to hybrids, and the C-Max in particular does especially well on that test (most likely because of the 62MPH EV-only capability).

[salsaguy]

I'm sure the final re-reviewed testing results report will come out soon and will show it was valid. They didnt cheat. They wouldnt risk marring the image of the company especially after the auto bailout. Sure they wanted to beat the Toyota Prius in sales and they have done that so far. Demand is crazy high for these cars. but yes they need to have a different test for hybrids/plugins

[ScubaDadMiami]

Any links to the numbers?  Is there that much demand?  Honestly, I can't imagine why the C-MAX is not more widely praised and in demand.  I could see any techie in this car, and any Baby Boomer would love it for it's minimal environmental impact.  There should be a good market for people that want something that is great on FE while being able to hold five passengers or a good amount of cargo for its size.  Even higher end people who just want to be smart with their money should be a good match. 

 

While I think that the commercials have been cute, I wonder why Ford isn't going for marketing to each of the above in a more serious way, too.  If I weren't looking for exactly this combo, the commercials wouldn't really grab me, because they really don't show off all of the great things about this special car.

 

Sure they wanted to beat the Toyota Prius in sales and they have done that so far. Demand is crazy high for these cars.

Edited June 2, 2013 by ScubaDadMiami

[salsaguy]

I agree they should show off the car more instead in their commercials. so much great stuff to love. They did show off the hands-free lift gate but that was in the Escape (non--hybrid) commercial.

 

Yes they showed it in the cartoon commercial as well but that doesn't really count in my book

Edited June 2, 2013 by salsaguy

[Jus-A-CMax]

Ok guys, lets keep things on track in this thread to the ICE High MPG and not deviate to the Ford/EPA issue - we have plenty of those threads to carry on the discussion there. Thanks everyone :)