Test Drive

[my2cents]

Hi everybody I'm new to the forum,

 

Stopped by the dealer yesterday to test drive a CMAX.  I've never driven a hybrid before and I'm looking for a new car so I thought I'd check it out.  I'm aware of the controversy about the gas mileage (recent lawsuits).  I went on about a 30 minute test drive in cloudy, chilly (about 50 degrees) SW MI.  Overall I was favorably impressed with the handling and the ride.  But I was really focused on the MPGs.  Here's my results.  Leaving the dealership and doing about 25 MPH through town the car was on EV (999.9 MPG), doing 45 MPH on the way to the interstate yielded a consistent 48 MPG, on the interstate I first set the cruise on 60 MPH and got 35 MPG and then set the cruise on 70 MPH and got 30 MPG.

 

I'm wondering about the real world cruising @70 MPH on the interstate MPGs.  Is the 30 MPG  I saw on a short test drive really indicative of what I could expect to see once the car had several thousand miles on the engine?  Or what is your experience @70 MPH?

[rtshinn]

The mpg goes way down at 70 and above, which is how I drive. You can probably get 32-35, but I don't have many long trips under my belt yet.

[rtshinn]

The mpg goes way down at 70 and above, which is how I drive. I probably get 32-35 (C-Max Energi), but I don't have many long trips under my belt yet.

Edited April 10, 2013 by rtshinn

[C-MAXER]

My experience with hwy mileage is you need to set it to eco-cruise within the menu settings (not usually done on a test drive) AND have a reasonably long hwy trip (longer than a test drive) to see decent hwy mpg.  The EPA test is at absurdly low 60 mph; think country road speeds not interstate.  Anyway, I was able to achieve 46mpg at 65mph with a tailwind yesterday on a 100 mile interstate trip once the battery buffer had filled up.  On your test drive, I bet the battery was low/empty from your in town driving and once you hit the hwy, the engine/generator began running double duty (hwy speed and charging up the battery) producing the low mpg's.    Also, 50F is a little low for top mpg's.  

 

I've only had my CMAX less than two weeks but have owned a couple of other hybrids.  With those experiences I think the 'max can achieve it's city/urban epa figure with careful driving under ideal climate conditions but will never achieve it's HWY rating at typical interstate speeds.  Hope this doesn't come across as sour grapes.  Nope, I love it:  more power, better built, more features, more room, etc.

[lowbar]

My morning commute was 17 miles, mostly interstate, and I averaged 65 to 70 mph.  At the end my mpg reading on the car stated 40.1 mpg.

[zhackwyatt]

I'll try to upload the picture, but I drove across Phoenix the other day.  45 mile trip, a large portion of the trip if not majority above 70 mph, and i got 46.2mpg average.  That was with a little over 3000 on the odometer and it was 66 outside.

 

Temperature and break-in of the car I have found to be major influences.

[JohnnOhio]

I drove 70 on the interstate for 35 miles and averaged 46.6 for the trip.

[plohnes]

Sound like great numbers for interstate - just curious:

- mostly flat or somewhat hilly?

- temperature?

- did you use AC/Heat during that time

 

these seem to be factors that have the most influence on achieving these good numbers ...

[my2cents]

Thanks for the input. My next test drives will be a Mazda 3 (highway 39 mpg) and a Ford Focus (highway 36 mpg). Then I'll make a decision.

[jhinsc]

I test drove a CMax yesterday and while I think it's a good effort on Ford's part, it's not for me.  Three things I have an issue with;  1) for such a short wheelbase, why is the car so heavy for it's class of vehicle? 2) the style of the car for me is a bit odd and I can't get past it.  3) can't get anywhere near EPA mpg's.   I loved the gee whiz features of the interior thought and it did ride with a nice isolated, quite feel, but the shorter wheelbase makes for a more bumpy, but not harsh ride.  I know it's subjective on my part but I just wasn't feeling I had to have it.

[wab]

Thanks for the input. My next test drives will be a Mazda 3 (highway 39 mpg) and a Ford Focus (highway 36 mpg). Then I'll make a decision.

 

We briefly considered the CX5, same motor as the 3.

Couldn't face the 155hp, lowest in the class!

 

Even the CRV has 185.

[C-MAXER]

Thanks for the input. My next test drives will be a Mazda 3 (highway 39 mpg) and a Ford Focus (highway 36 mpg). Then I'll make a decision.

 

You're quoting hwy figures.  Is this a hwy commuter purchase or everyday car?  If the latter, you can forget getting anywhere near those EPA figures.  If the former, the EPA hwy tests are at 55-60mph not 70-80mph freeway/interstate speeds.  FWIW

Edited April 12, 2013 by C-MAXER

[mtb9153]

These cars can achieve great numbers both in town and on the highway.  But not without very consistent driving on your part.  No pounding on the brakes harshly, must be a slow gradual braking over a longer distance than you might be used to.  That is the only way to get a 100% score under braking.  You have to think ahead to your next braking and plan how to do it slowly and gradual.  If I accidentally brake with a shorter harsher pedal my braking score will drop from 95% to 75% in one fail swoop.  I find braking scores are my biggest threat to higher mpg ratings.  Also pulling out from a stop light or stop sign requires a slower consistent acceleration over a longer distance.  Starting out with a harsher pedal like in a jack rabbit start will eat into your numbers as well.  All the nature of driving a hybrid I have found.  The key is constancy from light to light or stop sign to stop sign.  My current tank of gas is giving me a 45.3mpg average, mostly city driving.  I drove 337miles on the first half of the tank.  Still have a little less than half to go and hope to get a 550mpg rating.  I'd love to make the 600mile club but it will take serious effort on my part I think to do it.  Enjoy the ride...

Edited April 12, 2013 by mtb9153

[Jus-A-CMax]

Hi everybody I'm new to the forum,

 

Stopped by the dealer yesterday to test drive a CMAX.  I've never driven a hybrid before and I'm looking for a new car so I thought I'd check it out.  I'm aware of the controversy about the gas mileage (recent lawsuits).  I went on about a 30 minute test drive in cloudy, chilly (about 50 degrees) SW MI.  Overall I was favorably impressed with the handling and the ride.  But I was really focused on the MPGs.  Here's my results.  Leaving the dealership and doing about 25 MPH through town the car was on EV (999.9 MPG), doing 45 MPH on the way to the interstate yielded a consistent 48 MPG, on the interstate I first set the cruise on 60 MPH and got 35 MPG and then set the cruise on 70 MPH and got 30 MPG.

 

I'm wondering about the real world cruising @70 MPH on the interstate MPGs.  Is the 30 MPG  I saw on a short test drive really indicative of what I could expect to see once the car had several thousand miles on the engine?  Or what is your experience @70 MPH?

 

Welcome to the forum  :)

 

There is an expression - there are many ways to skin a cat. And the CMax is certainly a great cat to optimize FE or just FANG to your heart's content.

 

Here are some tips for handling the Freeway drive in a CMax.

 

The first thread are testing I did on the various methods to maximize FE on the freeway - using eco-cruise, using P&G (if u don't know what P&G means, click on my signature link  ;) ) or "ICE High MPG"

Eco Cruise vs P&G vs ICE High MPG

 

The General also posted a great thread on an "eco-cruise" version of ICE High MPG:

I have found the illusive MPG sweet spot!

 

I switch between a manual and eco-cruise ICE High MPG in my long drives - the key with the CMax is the high battery - this car SINGS when the battery is high. This is what ICE High MPG looks like:

 

 

What you should see is the speed above 65 mph, the instant MPG dances between the 40s and 60s. If you change to the ENGAGE mode, you can see the EV motor assisting the ICE at the cruise speed. NOTE: this works on flats and downhills but on uphill where more power is needed, it will drop to 20s and 40s due to the larger power requirement.

 

As usual, if you have more question - please feel free to ask away, there are a lot of very knowledgeable owner-drivers here and WELCOME and good luck with your decision  :)

Edited April 12, 2013 by Jus-A-CMax

[my2cents]

You're quoting hwy figures.  Is this a hwy commuter purchase or everyday car?  If the latter, you can forget getting anywhere near those EPA figures.  If the former, the EPA hwy tests are at 55-60mph not 70-80mph freeway/interstate speeds.  FWIW

I'm well aware of the EPA highway test average of 48 MPH with a top speed of 60 MPH. Here's a link:

 

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml

 

My question was very specific @70 MPH because within recent memory I've been able to achieve EPA highway numbers @70 MPH with my vehicles. Most recently I'ved gotten 25 MPG with my AWD Ford Fusion @70 (EPA of 25) and I've gotten 32mph with my Mazda 3 @70 (EPA of 31). I've done that consistently (of course under good weather conditions). Generally what I've read is don't expect to consistently hit (or even come close) to the 47 MPG EPA rating with the Cmax @70 MPH. I thought I would check on this forum what real world numbers the members are getting. My last long road trip with my Fusion was 5300 miles. We traveled the interstate to SoCal from MI went up through the High Sierras to Reno/Lake Tahoe and returned via Interstate and averaged 26 MPG for the trip. I live in a small town and we don't really have heavy city stop and go traffic. So yes my driving is heavily biased to interstates. I'm beginning to think there's not enough fuel savings with a Cmax over other conventional cars given the way I'll use the car.

[C-MAXER]

 

 

My question was very specific @70 MPH because within recent memory I've been able to achieve EPA highway numbers @70 MPH with my vehicles.

 

 

Hybrids in general and, it seems the CMax in particular, meet their city ratings much easier than hwy.  But as has been pointed out, the 'max will do well given a long enough stretch so it can fill up the battery.  A short test drive on a new drivetrain delivers lackluster results. BTDT on two test drives but I finally got a 48 hr test drive and found out what it really was capable of and purchased.   A couple of days ago, I did a 200 mile interstate leg and by then had reached 45.9mpg after beginning the leg at 40mpg (eco cruise at 65-70mph).    My current tank (80/20 city/hwy daily ratio) is 46.2mpg and my car isn't broken in (1100 miles).

 

It sounds like you get good results from any car so you'd do well with the cmax too.

[RachelnLa]

My town isn't very big. I am getting 41mpg driving my car. That's just driving it like a regular car. I don't watch the EV and I don't force it into EV. this tank is my test tank. 41. It's not the 47. But it's a helluva lot better than my Tahoe at 17. My dad bought one too. He's at 41 mpg. It's better than his pt Cruizer, which was getting 21? It's a nicer car. Comfy. The 47 isn't what sold me. It helped tremendously but it wasn't a deal breaker for me. I know if I worked at it I could easily get the 47. I am just enjoying it. Life is short. Gotta have fun.

[roninsd]

You go, girl!

[JAZ]

Here's a re-post from the "I know it's only going to get better" thread:  

  FWIW, just returned from a long journey down south of over 3,500 miles with the Hybrid carrying a total of about 700 lbs. (don't forget:  maximum for passengers and cargo is 825!).  Reported mpg was 37.8.  I drove mostly as I would have a non-hybrid and did not hypermile other than a few instances where slowdowns were inevitable, and used ECO Cruise almost all the time.  Temps ranged from 20s to 80s and I used air and heat to maintain comfort, though no extremes.  Along one ideal stretch of several miles in Florida's panhandle (flat, smooth and sheltered by tall trees on both sides) I recorded about 37.5 mpg at a steady 70 mph.  That seems quite decent to me given the speed and cargo I was carrying.  EV is not really part of the picture at those speeds and long fast drives will lower the mpgs.   I've found it's the non-freeway at lower speeds that really pushes up the mpgs.

     High point was about a 30 mile drive entering and crossing Houston on one of its many freeways in heavy traffic where I achieved 48 mpg (50-60 mph).  Low point was leaving Houston over much the same route in a heavy downpour (45-50mph) where the average was only 30.  Surfing is not the C-MAX's forte.

     It seems obvious to me that given identical situations any of the Prii will out-mpg the Max, but that is only one of many criteria we all must weigh in the decision to purchase.

     The MAX served us very well on the trip and I'm quite pleased with it.  Built on 2-7-13 it has the 3.5.1 version and the lady in the dashboard kept us on our planned routes and side trips with no errors through the 14 states we visited.

     Prior to the trip did over 30 miles on one of Detroit's freeways in temps slightly above freezing and scored 52 mpg, so it seems not only YMMV, but YMMV greatly.

[my2cents]

Thanks JAZ. Very informative post. Your trip is very similar to the type of driving vacation my wife and I like to take. I live in SW MI now but I'm originally from Detroit so I can relate to driving in the Detroit area.

[BWP]

189 mile round trip last week in the Mississippi Delta (farmland that's flat as can be).  Estimate 65 mph speed limit 30%, 55 mph 60%, city 10%.  Air conditioning on the last 50 miles (temp 82 degrees) and I got 46.6 mpg.  More tailwind coming home that headwind going out, but I'm pretty happy with the mpg.

[SnowStorm]

I'm well aware of the EPA highway test average of 48 MPH with a top speed of 60 MPH. Here's a link:

 

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml

 

My question was very specific @70 MPH because within recent memory I've been able to achieve EPA highway numbers @70 MPH with my vehicles. Most recently I'ved gotten 25 MPG with my AWD Ford Fusion @70 (EPA of 25) and I've gotten 32mph with my Mazda 3 @70 (EPA of 31). I've done that consistently (of course under good weather conditions). Generally what I've read is don't expect to consistently hit (or even come close) to the 47 MPG EPA rating with the Cmax @70 MPH. I thought I would check on this forum what real world numbers the members are getting. My last long road trip with my Fusion was 5300 miles. We traveled the interstate to SoCal from MI went up through the High Sierras to Reno/Lake Tahoe and returned via Interstate and averaged 26 MPG for the trip. I live in a small town and we don't really have heavy city stop and go traffic. So yes my driving is heavily biased to interstates. I'm beginning to think there's not enough fuel savings with a Cmax over other conventional cars given the way I'll use the car.

The real issue with the 47 rating seems to be that we all have past experience in matching the EPA highway figure at "normal" interstate speeds.  Then here comes the C-Max at 47 mpg and people are saying they can't get that mileage.  I don't expect to get it either (steady 65-70).  So what's wrong?  I've given my analysis in this post:

 

http://fordcmaxhybridforum.com/index.php?/topic/1523-treehugger-getting-to-the-bottom-of-fords-hybrid-fuel-economy-controversy/

 

but the short version is that the C-Max is a "better" hybrid in that it can run at higher speeds on the battery alone.  This means that the ICE runs less, and when it does, it operates more efficiently.  (A gasoline engine is very inefficient at light loads.)  The result is a great EPA rating because the tests average 48 mph and include starts and stops (for highway driving!).  The EPA formulas are "calibrated" for conventional cars but just don't work for a "good" hybrid at steady interstate speeds.

 

Another way to summarize is that the C-Max (or Fusion hybrid) should give great mileage on the interstate and superior mileage everywhere else.  From all the numbers I've seen, I would use 38 mpg for 70 mph.  Figure the savings from there.  Its going to be really hard to get an exact figure without some very tightly controlled tests.

 

Before ordering our C-Max we test drove a diesel but the higher fuel cost combined with the timing belt replacement cost (adds about 45 cents per gallon!) was not a good deal.

 

Hope you find the right car.