Differences between 2013 and 2014?

[plus 3 golfer]

Ford ran the EPA FE tests on the Energi which yielded 41 Highway and 44 City (43 Combined).

 

EPA ran the EPA FE tests on the Hybrid and got 40 Highway and 45 City (43 Combined) post 13B07.  EPA also ran the tests pre 13B07 and got 40 Highway and 42 City (41 Combined).

 

The tests are run on a dynamometer with a driver "trying" to follow the EPA prescribed driving schedule for the particular test.  I don't recall how much "driver" deviation from the schedule is permissible for a valid test.  But, there will likely be variances in the test results based solely on the driver.  But, it does make me wonder how the 300 pound heavier Energi with a shorter final drive ratio gets 2 mpg better EPA FE than the Hybrid pre 13B07 and basically the same FE rating post 13B07. The 2013 Hybrid has taller gearing which should at least yield better highway FE than the Energi all other things being the same. 

 

It wouldn't surprise me if the 2014 Hybrid EPA FE Highway numbers surpass the Energi by 1 or 2 mpg based on what apparently is even a taller final drive in the 2014 than the 2013 (and likely reprograming of the PCM) and the aero enhancements.  Ford will be running the 2014 EPA tests with their likely "programmed" driver. ;)

[hybridbear]

Thanks for useful tips! I'll probably wait for 2014, unless there is a really good deal for 2013 built after October. But I wouldn't agree that hybrid battery for a car built in January is still good, after sitting for the entire year on parking lot  :secret:  What do you think?

Government tests have shown that battery degradation is not an issue in hybrids. The hybrids use a very small portion of the HVB. Capacity loss is not an issue.

See these links:

http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/topic/7492-understanding-the-ffh-better-with-a-scangauge/?p=69378

http://avt.inl.gov/pdf/hev/batteryfusion4757.pdf

http://avt.inel.gov/pdf/hev/end_of_life_test_1.pdf

[hybridbear]

As far as the comparison to the Energi ratios goes...when I have driven my parents' Energi in hybrid mode I have found it to be terribly inefficient compared to the FFH. The FFH uses the ICE to charge the HVB pretty much anytime the ICE is on. The Energi seems to operate more like the Prius and runs the ICE for more time at a lower power demand, rarely using it to charge the HVB. Their Energi has about the same number of ICE miles as our second (current) FFH. On the same 60 mile highway trip in very similar weather, the Energi got only 35-36 MPG in hybrid mode, the FFH manages 39-40 MPG. That's basically a 10% difference. Some of this is aerodynamics, but some of it is the way the ICE ran. The FFH typically has 35-40% of those miles in EV mode, the Energi did only 20% of the miles in EV Mode. The FFH ICE usually shows a LOD on the ScanGauge of 85+ indicating that the ICE is running very efficiently when the power output is 35-43 HP and the HVB is being charged. The Prius does so well on the highway because Toyota designed its ICE to run very efficiently with a low (15-20 HP) power output showing LOD numbers of 80-90. Since the C-Max Energi didn't really use the ICE to charge the HVB the power output was often only about 20 HP and the LOD was 65-70. This is very inefficient and leads to lower fuel economy. I hope Ford doesn't mess with the gearing of the hybrid too much to make it worse. Perhaps that is why the 2014 hybrids have been so delayed...they can't get it to work correctly.

 

Has anyone bothered asking Ashley to check on the 2014s? She's been very helpful on the FFH Forum.

Edited January 3, 2014 by hybridbear

[plus 3 golfer]

hybridbear, the Prius weighs about 600 pounds less than the C-Max, has a the 17% lower C_d and less frontal area than the C-Max.  This accounts for the lower power requirements of the Priis vs the C-Max at highway speeds (not programming).  A simple spreadsheet on drag demonstrates this. At 65 mph the C-Max will require about 22-24% more power to overcome drag (frontal area of C-Max est) than the Prius. No matter how one programs the powertrains,about 23% more power will require the C-Max to burn more fuel. 

 

Wayne Gerdes (cleanmpg.com) tests show the C-Max at 44 mpg at 65 mph vs the Prius at 52.2 mpg or about a 18.6% advantage for the Prius. I have yet to see anyone show that the C-Max is not programmed efficiently given it's weight, drag, and larger HVB differences compared to the Prius.  I would argue that the programming of the Prius and C-Max are comparable - the Prius requires about 19% less power than the C-Max at 65 mph and gets 18.6% better FE than the C-Max at 65 mph. ;) 

[alexus]

After test driving the C-Max twice and looking at the various packages we have decided to purchase a Ruby Red C-Max with panoramic sunroof and package 302A (navigation, Sony sound system, HD Radio, Backup camera, hands free ligtgate). No local dealer (not a single dealer in New York) has this exact configuration in a 2013 so we will be ordering a 2014. As a bonus might just get a few more MPG.

 

HendersonD, congradulations!!! I think this is definitely a right decision to go for 2014. Even it seems mpg is not much higher, the build quality should improve.

Edited January 3, 2014 by alexus

[HendersonD]

Ashley did say that 2014s are not in production yet, no reason given

Click link above and look at post #35

I hope she is correct that production will start soon

Edited January 3, 2014 by HendersonD