Transmission problem

[drdiesel1]

I don't look at the PRNDL or the shifter. I have a habit of knowing what gear it's in when moving the shifter :love_shower:

My scan gauge covers the PRNDL, so it's not an issue for me. Happy Motoring :victory:

Edited August 17, 2014 by drdiesel1

[plus 3 golfer]

Here's a question.  Why does a car with a CVT need a low gear?  If the computer chooses the proper ratio depending on all the inputs would it not put it into low gear when needed?

From the service manual:

Low

The range selector LOW position provides:

• engine braking.

• improved traction on slippery roads.

 

It doesn't and "L" on a C-Max doesn't actually change any gears. All it does is use regenerative braking when you let off the "gas" pedal instead of coasting. Other manufacturers call it something else (someone calls it "B" mode I think) but I suspect they used "L" because they already had those plastic parts for another model :)

L does not increase regeneration.  It engages ICE.

 

I am not convinced that is correct.  The two times I have had it in low instead of drive I could tell by the high pitch sound. I know the L does not change gears in a CVT but it feels like it tells the CVT to use a different ratio.

Correct,   There are no conventional gears to change in the transmission.  Effectively,  when in L, the PCM changes the speeds of the planetary gear set by altering the speed of MG1 and MG2 by using or producing energy which allows ICE to engage and spin and act as an engine brake if no throttle is applied or to provide power both at a lower effective drive ratio than normal.

 

Could be. I just use EV only mode 340+ days of the year. Can't say for sure if I've ever tried "L" with the engine running. Not sure what the point of running the engine faster would be.

Engine braking when going down hill. I use it all the time when descending longer, steep hills in additional to grade assist.  Grade assist provides additional regenerative braking and engine braking to maintain speed going down hill but L will add additional engine braking which typically reduces speed .

Edited August 17, 2014 by Plus 3 Golfer

[jdbob]

Ooops - wrong forum. Just ignore me  :doh:

[FordService]

Well, just finished talking with a service adviser from dealership. He told me it would take 3-4 days before he will have a chance looking at it...  

 

Let me know when you get a diagnosis from the dealership, dmk2000. I'll keep an eye on this thread in case you need my help. :)

 

Crystal

[dmk2000]

Hello Crystal.

Absolutely, I will let you and members of this board know about diagnostic results of this problem.

Thank you very much for your support.

[dmk2000]

Just got a call from service department. 

They told me that car is ready. When I asked what was wrong, they told me a 12 V battery.

Hearing this, I ask that guy if he knew that when this happened, the car was driven 40 minutes, and also was on when this issue occurred.

I also told him that after shutting car off, I could still use power windows. Also, the car could be successfully turned on with A/C on, all after this issue happened, except transmission was stuck.

So the guy told me that since technician is gone for the day, he will talk with him tomorrow morning and then give me a call back.

If it is indeed 12 V battery, then drdiesel1 is right. Said that, I feel this car is dangerous. If depleted 12 V battery causes this car not to engage park position properly, then when parked on incline, could it roll by itself anytime?

Odd things.

[drdiesel1]

Just got a call from service department. 

They told me that car is ready. When I asked what was wrong, they told me a 12 V battery.

Hearing this, I ask that guy if he knew that when this happened, the car was driven 40 minutes, and also was on when this issue occurred.

I also told him that after shutting car off, I could still use power windows. Also, the car could be successfully turned on with A/C on, all after this issue happened, except transmission was stuck.

So the guy told me that since technician is gone for the day, he will talk with him tomorrow morning and then give me a call back.

If it is indeed 12 V battery, then drdiesel1 is right. Said that, I feel this car is dangerous. If depleted 12 V battery causes this car not to engage park position properly, then when parked on incline, could it roll by itself anytime?

Odd things.

If it's parked with a proper 12V input, the car will not move if the battery dies. IMO, the dealers don't check the cars

for battery SOC before delivery. They won't do anything they can't get paid for, so it's left to you. I always charge

my new car batteries. I usually service my batteries a few times a year with my micro processor charger.

[kostby]

 If depleted 12 V battery causes this car not to engage park position properly, then when parked on incline, could it roll by itself anytime?

 

PARKING BRAKE

Note: Do not press the release button while pulling the lever up. To set the parking brake:

1. Press the foot brake pedal firmly.

2. Pull the parking brake lever up to its fullest extent.

Note: If you park your vehicle on a hill and facing uphill, move the transmission selector lever to position P and turn the steering wheel away from the curb.

Note: If you park your vehicle on a hill and facing downhill, move the transmission selector lever to position P and turn the steering wheel towards the curb.

 

To release the parking brake:

1. Press the brake pedal firmly.

2. Pull the lever up slightly.

3. Press the release button and push the lever down. 

[dmk2000]

Well, here is a final update.

Picked up CMax. Technician told me that they performed TSB that addresses reprogramming information display that prevents car to fully turned off.

They also checked battery, and fully charge it.

Drdiesel1 was right, it is due to 12 V battery.

I also notice in this car, when placing shifter to the park position, the "P" is light up. However the shifter has about 3/16" play. So, while it is in "P" position, if it moves down so slightly, the display no longer shows "P", and it looks like transmission does not engage in any gear. It only happens in "P". No other gear position have this.

Can anyone else replicate this behavior of the shifter?

Thank you.    

[dmk2000]

If it's parked with a proper 12V input, the car will not move if the battery dies. IMO, the dealers don't check the cars

for battery SOC before delivery. They won't do anything they can't get paid for, so it's left to you. I always charge

my new car batteries. I usually service my batteries a few times a year with my micro processor charger.

Hello Drdiesel1.

Believe it or not, before picking up car from a dealer, I ask sales person to prep the car. The guy is a trustworthy. Before delivering it to me, they change the oil, checked for outstanding recalls, tested and recharged battery. Based on this info, I am not sure what is going on. On top of this, during four weeks of owning this car, it was never driven thou the rain.

[Ponypower]

I love every aspect of my C-Max, not one single thing bothers me.  Its not worth it, enjoy,  life is short.

[HPRifleman]

I have found that I never even look at the gear indicators. Whenever I shift, it is done by feel. Sometimes I will over-shoot "D" by going into "L" but the shifter travels farther so it is pretty easy to figure out. Going from "P" to "R" is also pretty easy.

[drdiesel1]

Hello Drdiesel1.

Believe it or not, before picking up car from a dealer, I ask sales person to prep the car. The guy is a trustworthy. Before delivering it to me, they change the oil, checked for outstanding recalls, tested and recharged battery. Based on this info, I am not sure what is going on. On top of this, during four weeks of owning this car, it was never driven thou the rain.

Buy this and use it to keep the 12V battery charged. You'll need to let it run until the green charged light comes on.

I don't trust the dealers to properly charge a battery. I've worked at the dealers for too long and I have never seen

a car get properly charged. They throw it on the charger for a short period and ship it. 

 

With this charger you can hook it up and let do it's thing. You can also periodically check the battery SOC.

This will give you an idea of how often to use it. I regularly check mine about every month just to make sure.

Even if it's not too low, I'll charge it.

It only takes a little effort to keep it maintained and you'll have less issue's until something is found to correct it.

 

Charger......http://www.amazon.com/Schumacher-SSC-1500A-CA-SpeedCharge-Charger-Battery/dp/B000H961YI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1408635551&sr=8-2&keywords=1500+charger

Edited August 21, 2014 by drdiesel1

[dmk2000]

Buy this and use it to keep the 12V battery charged. You'll need to let it run until the green charged light comes on.

I don't trust the dealers to properly charge a battery. I've worked at the dealers for too long and I have never seen

a car get properly charged. They throw it on the charger for a short period and ship it. 

 

With this charger you can hook it up and let do it's thing. You can also periodically check the battery SOC.

This will give you an idea of how often to use it. I regularly check mine about every month just to make sure.

Even if it's not too low, I'll charge it.

It only takes a little effort to keep it maintained and you'll have less issue's until something is found to correct it.

 

Charger......http://www.amazon.com/Schumacher-SSC-1500A-CA-SpeedCharge-Charger-Battery/dp/B000H961YI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1408635551&sr=8-2&keywords=1500+charger

Thank drdiesel1 for an advise. I do have a battery charger, I use it to maintain my ATV and backup diesel generator batteries. I guess I will start to use it on CMAX.

[drdiesel1]

Thank drdiesel1 for an advise. I do have a battery charger, I use it to maintain my ATV and backup diesel generator batteries. I guess I will start to use it on CMAX.

Is an actual charger or just a battery tender.  You'll need a charger capable of about 15 amps to properly charge it.

Tenders don't have the ability to properly charge a battery. They keep the voltage up in float mode, but only produce 1.25 amps.

 

Here's an image of the power stud and the ground stud located under the hood. Just hook up to them for charging.

Edited August 22, 2014 by drdiesel1

[dmk2000]

It is charger, cheep one, from garage sale. It has a lights, red when charging in process, and a green upon completion of a charge cycle. Not sure what Amp does it feed battery with.

[drdiesel1]

It is charger, cheep one, from garage sale. It has a lights, red when charging in process, and a green upon completion of a charge cycle. Not sure what Amp does it feed battery with.

For 55 bucks, I wouldn't use a cheap POS on my vehicles.

Knowing your battery is properly charged and maintained is worth more than a few bucks.

[dmk2000]

Here is another twist to the transmission issue.

Coming home from work, got a $118 bill from a dealer for a labor of 12 V battery charging. Are they for real?

Wow, just wow.  

[drdiesel1]

Here is another twist to the transmission issue.

Coming home from work, got a $118 bill from a dealer for a labor of 12 V battery charging. Are they for real?

Wow, just wow.  

Don't pay it. The car is under warranty and they're just trying to get free money.

Did you sign an R.O. with a dollar amount on it ? Or was it a zero dollar warranty R.O. ?

Gotta watch these shady rip-off dealers.  I had a new BMW motorcycle with a bad front tire

and when I came back the next day to complain about front end vibration, the SA tried to get me

to sign an R.O. for $85. I about tore his head off for even mention a dollar amount on an R.O.,

on a new bike. I work in the industry and told him I would report his underhanded dealing to the B.A.R.

and he quickly changed his tune. I hate sleazy dealers/people that think they can take advantage of people.

Edited August 23, 2014 by drdiesel1

[dmk2000]

Don't pay it. The car is under warranty and they're just trying to get free money.

Did you sign an R.O. with a dollar amount on it ? Or was it a zero dollar warranty R.O. ?

Gotta watch these shady rip-off dealers.  I had a new BMW motorcycle with a bad front tire

and when I came back the next day to complain about front end vibration, the SA tried to get me

to sign an R.O. for $85. I about tore his head off for even mention a dollar amount on an R.O.,

on a new bike. I work in the industry and told him I would report his underhanded dealing to the B.A.R.

and he quickly changed his tune. I hate sleazy dealers/people that think they can take advantage of people.

I am not planning give them anything. My line of thought is along your line, it is a new car with 1400 miles on it, that is why there is manufacturer warranty on it. They reprogram computer display to address 12 V battery, so why charge me and not FORD? I do not remember if R.O. had a $ amount. This is not my new car, other cars had their share of warranty repairs, but I was newer charged a penny, not even $5 a day for a loaner, it was inconceivable for me to think they will charge me for a repair under warranty that is not a consumable item.  I am with you on sleazy dealers. If I wanted to pay for repairs, I would buy used out of warranty car. 

[drdiesel1]

I am not planning give them anything. My line of thought is along your line, it is a new car with 1400 miles on it, that is why there is manufacturer warranty on it. They reprogram computer display to address 12 V battery, so why charge me and not FORD? I do not remember if R.O. had a $ amount. This is not my new car, other cars had their share of warranty repairs, but I was newer charged a penny, not even $5 a day for a loaner, it was inconceivable for me to think they will charge me for a repair under warranty that is not a consumable item.  I am with you on sleazy dealers. If I wanted to pay for repairs, I would buy used out of warranty car. 

They filed a warranty claim to get paid, but will try to get paid from you too.

They hope you're foolish enough to fall for this type of swindle tactic. Amazing as it sounds,

some people will pay it and never question it. That charger looks great @ 55 bucks now, huh ;)

Edited August 23, 2014 by drdiesel1

[dmk2000]

Well drdiesel1, I guess I has wrong. It was a copy of a bill dealer send to ford, not me.

Should had read it more carefully first time.

O well....

[dmk2000]

Well.

Here is an update to ongoing transmission problem.

two weeks ago, I had same transmission problem when trying to place transmission into park, it gets lucked up.

This time battery was good and fully charged. Ford towed car to the dealer, and they where able to diagnose this problem to a faulty range finder sensor.

In order to replace it, engine and transmission must be removed from the car as a single unit, and only then decoupled from each other in order to replace this sensor.

Today I picked up car fro the shop. Here is a final story.

After gaining access to the back of the transmission, technician found a bolt that was wedged inside gear shifting mechanism. Dealer called ford engineering hot line to get an idea where this bolt come from, since they could not fined a place for it.

Ford could not answer. So technician proceeded with a replacement of the sensor, even thou now it looks like a rouge bolt was a reason for transmission getting stuck near parking gear.

So far it shfts well.

How the heck rouge bolt could endup there, and does assembly line have Quality Control?

Also, I was able to verify that this car was assembled on Monday morning. I guess it does makes a difference what day of the week car is assembled.

[Laurel]

Wow what a saga with your car dmk2000.  Glad it is fixed.  Maybe an unhappy employee put the rouge bolt there?

[Kelleytoons]

Ah, Monday morning car.  

 

Yep, folks just aren't feeling good after a weekend <g> (although maybe it also applies to the robots that mostly assemble things now as well).