Extended Warranty... yes or no???

[tishpit]

Going to pick up my new C-Max tomorrow and filled out all paperwork today.  Dealership is family run and small with great sales staff and service department.  Smooth, painless transaction!  HOWEVER... here is the $50,000 question... whether it is "wise" to get the extended warranty?  I usually pass on EW unless the car has a dubious repair history.  In my old Pontiac Montana, warranty paid for itself in 2 visits.  In other cars, never used the darn thing and was out $$.  With the complexity and possible expense of both parts and labor in the C-Max... how many of you bought the Ford extended warranty and how many passed???

 

We were quoted about $3,095 for a 7 year/125,000 mile Premium Care 1000+ warranty with $100 deductible at 0% interest that would add another $46/month to our payments.  May not sound like much, but we are on a very tight budget and the payment now is at our comfortable limit.  Of course this warranty overlaps the 3/36,000 and other standard warranties (powertrain, hybrid, etc.) that come with the car.  We would also receive free oil changes for as long as we own the car (every 5 mos. or 5,000 miles).  Usually... I would pass.  But concerned with this car as looking at the engine bay... my goodness, we could not even SEE the air filter!  Everything there is a mysterious mangle of hoses and wires!  It appears the average small mechanic shop would refer us to the dealer for even basic work.  That means big $$$ down the road....  Tried to negotiate a cheaper price, but the price was obviously written in stone.  Looked online and another dealership touting cheap warranty prices came out even higher for the same warranty.

 

So... need some quick opinions!!!  Shake the few last coins from the monthly piggy bank or roll the dice on future repairs?????????

[wab]

Search "Ford ESP", fill out the form, print the quote and take it to your dealler.

Ask them to meet or beat, they will and you'll be surprised.

 

http://www.google.com/search?as_q=&as_epq=Ford+esp&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_nlo=&as_nhi=&lr=&cr=&as_qdr=all&as_sitesearch=&as_occt=any&safe=images&tbs=&as_filetype=&as_rights=#q=%22Ford+esp%22&as_qdr=all&start=10

 

Thanks for reminding me, our regular warranty is a little over 2 years old, I'll order the extended warranty in a few months.

[hybridbear]

Flood Ford and Anderson Koch Ford sell the Ford ESP online cheaper. Buy it there.

 

An extended warranty is an insurance policy, they wouldn't sell it if they can't make money on it. Overall the consumer loses. It's all about your risk tolerance.

[scottwood2]

I am not a fan of these.  Hybrid bear said it best.  It is what you are comfortable with as far as risk.  $46 a month sounds like a lot to me.  I bet they could afford to give you oil changes with that amount. 

 

I hear a lot from people thinking they are covered saying that the part that is bad is not covered by the extended warranty.   I hear a general rule of thumb that 50% of the cost goes to the sales person/dealer that sells it to you.  If they were not making money they would not offer the plan.

 

But that is my opinion and I was a licensed mechanic for a years so I might do some of my own work too.   No experience with hybrid repair yet.   

 

Don't forget that your hybrid system is already covered for a long time.  I think 8 years or 100K miles? 

[plus 3 golfer]

Agree with HB.  

 

Also, your oil doesn't need changed every 5 months or 5 k miles.  It's around 10 k miles.  Your car has a built in oil life monitor which will indicate when to change the oil.  One can DIY for around $30 or let any local shop do it.

 

In addition, the Hybrid components (see components covered below) are covered for 8 years / 100 k miles.  So, if it's these components that you are worried about ("mysterious mangle of hoses and wires"), your covered.  

 

One other point and that is does your auto insurer offer Mechanical Breakdown Insurance in your state?  Check GEICO's out.  You pay yearly for the MBI coverage with your insurance premium.  So far I've paid less than $86 total premium for the first 3 years of coverage.  It's $250 deductible for 100 k miles / 7 years and covers everything except routine maintenance items and wear and tear.  I'm outside the 36 k B2B warranty so my maximum liability for a 3/36 component failure is $250 (for example ABS pump fails, AC electric compressor fails and so forth).  Of course, I don't expect any failures. So, IMO MBI is a very cheap way of hedging the cost of failures and since it's an insurance product (unlike extended warranties) is regulated by the states which should assure the consumer of fair pricing.

 

Hybrid Component Ford Warranty:

The following hybrid parts are covered during this extended coverage

period: high-voltage battery, hybrid continuously variable transmission,

Inverter System Controller (ISC), DC/DC converter, high-voltage

battery connector, battery pack fan assembly, thermistor probe, Hybrid

Battery Pack Sensor Module (HBPSM), Battery Energy Control Module

(BECM), and the PHEV onboard charger.

 

Federal Major Emissions

8 years or 80,000 miles (whichever occurs first) for catalytic

converters, electronic emissions control unit, and onboard emissions

diagnostic devices, including the Battery Energy Control Module

(BECM).

 

Edited April 10, 2015 by Plus 3 Golfer

[stevedebi]

It is worthwile to note that the hybrid has components that are not covered by the 8/100, even though Ford doesn't use them on anything except hybrids.  The 8/100 is the engine and hybrid components, which basically means the engine, battery, and powertrain. It does not cover the braking system / ABS, which (as an example) on my 2008 Escape Hybrid, would be a 4K repair.

 

The Ford PremiumCare warranty is basically everything except wear and tear items. That is the one I will purchase when I get over 30K.

 

But as others have noted, it depends on your personal risk tolerance.

[Bugblndr]

 It does not cover the braking system / ABS, which (as an example) on my 2008 Escape Hybrid, would be a 4K repair.

 

The Ford PremiumCare warranty is basically everything except wear and tear items. That is the one I will purchase when I get over 30K.

 

But as others have noted, it depends on your personal risk tolerance.

 

To be fair, all new cars have brakes and all have ABS too.  I'd argue that Hybrid vehicles are much easier on brakes than conventional ICE only vehicles.  My 2011 Highlander Hybrid had 85,000 miles on it when I traded it in.  Only service other than oil changes was for rear pads and rotors.  Total spent, $250 CAD including tax ($200 USD).  Front brakes still passed safety.

[stevedebi]

To be fair, all new cars have brakes and all have ABS too.  I'd argue that Hybrid vehicles are much easier on brakes than conventional ICE only vehicles.  My 2011 Highlander Hybrid had 85,000 miles on it when I traded it in.  Only service other than oil changes was for rear pads and rotors.  Total spent, $250 CAD including tax ($200 USD).  Front brakes still passed safety.

The Ford ICE products do not have those same components. They are specific to the hybrid design, and so far as I know, more expensive to repair (but I don't follow other Ford forums as much). A single repair on any of those system would cover an ESP warranty.

 

But, as many has said, Ford is betting they will last the length of the ESP, or they wouldn't offer the protection...

[AS2014]

If you can afford to buy extended warranty, buy it. My radio went out in car the other day,that also work the sync system, If not for the extended warranty I would be paying major dollars for this repair. This car is more computer than any other car I have ever owned. This one situation that happened has already paid my money back in buying the extended warranty.p

[raadsel]

The Ford ICE products do not have those same components. They are specific to the hybrid design, and so far as I know, more expensive to repair (but I don't follow other Ford forums as much). A single repair on any of those system would cover an ESP warranty.

 

But, as many has said, Ford is betting they will last the length of the ESP, or they wouldn't offer the protection...

 

The brakes don't seem to be the item to fear. As pointed out, while the parts may be unique to the hybrids, likely because of the regenerative braking, the systems are roughly the same as those found on every other Ford produced. This just isn't an area that Ford seems to have issues with. On top of that, because of the regenerative braking, brakes on hybrids have tended to have less problems, and last longer, than conventional cars; the goal on a hybrid is essentially to not use the physical braking system. I can recall Hybrid owners talking about selling their cars with 75,000 miles and that they never had to replace their brake pads; YMMV.

 

That isn't to say there aren't things that could be an issue; as was pointed out, repairs on an MFT/Sync could be expensive. Another would be a problem with the "speedometer" display, with it's two LED screens and the computer that runs it. It will be interesting to see how the C-Max holds up over time. Having said that, there are hybrids, the Prius, for example, that appear to be doing quite well long term.

[ScubaDadMiami]

New cars have a lot of new technology. I went with the same plan that you are considering 7/125,000. I can't remember the price.

[ArizonaEnergi]

The general consensus is that it is not wise to buy an extended warranty.  I know the three I bought in my younger days were never used, so I learned this lesson the expensive way.  On going thread on this at Bogleheads:  https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=163165

[SPL Tech]

I can recall Hybrid owners talking about selling their cars with 75,000 miles and that they never had to replace their brake pads; YMMV.

 

 

That's not exactly a bragging point. You can get that out of some conventional cars. I sold my VW Jetta with 66k miles and it had over 50% pad life remaining. Hybrid pads should last 200k.

[stevedebi]

The brakes don't seem to be the item to fear. As pointed out, while the parts may be unique to the hybrids, likely because of the regenerative braking, the systems are roughly the same as those found on every other Ford produced. This just isn't an area that Ford seems to have issues with. On top of that, because of the regenerative braking, brakes on hybrids have tended to have less problems, and last longer, than conventional cars; the goal on a hybrid is essentially to not use the physical braking system. I can recall Hybrid owners talking about selling their cars with 75,000 miles and that they never had to replace their brake pads; YMMV.

 

That isn't to say there aren't things that could be an issue; as was pointed out, repairs on an MFT/Sync could be expensive. Another would be a problem with the "speedometer" display, with it's two LED screens and the computer that runs it. It will be interesting to see how the C-Max holds up over time. Having said that, there are hybrids, the Prius, for example, that appear to be doing quite well long term.

Not the pads, the mechanical components in the engine compartment. I have not had a Ford that energized the braking system when the car was unlocked - unless it was a hybrid. I think you will find the systems are different.

 

I realize that some folks have bought these and never used them. I've bought 3 and used each two such that it was worth it. The third car is still new and I don't know if that will turn out to be worth it. It is a personal decision.

[stevedebi]

I just thought I'd mention that the warranties can be canceled if desired, and are refunded on a pro-rated basis depending upon how much of it you have used.

[raadsel]

Not the pads, the mechanical components in the engine compartment. I have not had a Ford that energized the braking system when the car was unlocked - unless it was a hybrid. I think you will find the systems are different.

 

I realize that some folks have bought these and never used them. I've bought 3 and used each two such that it was worth it. The third car is still new and I don't know if that will turn out to be worth it. It is a personal decision.

 

Except the regenerative braking components -- which is primarily the same electric motor that powers the car -- are largely covered under the hybrid warranty (8 years or 100,000 miles). That electric motor seems to be one of the most reliable parts on a hybrid vehicle. I just haven't ever heard of regenerative brakes having an issue with failing.

 

There can be other issues with the regenerative brakes, though they are typically design/build issues -- in most  cases it just getting the regenerative and friction braking to work together seamlessly. This is something you'll frequently see mentioned in hybrid reviews. So, in those cases, you should be able to feel the issues when you test the car.

[stevedebi]

Except the regenerative braking components -- which is primarily the same electric motor that powers the car -- are largely covered under the hybrid warranty (8 years or 100,000 miles). That electric motor seems to be one of the most reliable parts on a hybrid vehicle. I just haven't ever heard of regenerative brakes having an issue with failing.

 

There can be other issues with the regenerative brakes, though they are typically design/build issues -- in most  cases it just getting the regenerative and friction braking to work together seamlessly. This is something you'll frequently see mentioned in hybrid reviews. So, in those cases, you should be able to feel the issues when you test the car.

The stuff I'm speaking of relates to the mechanical braking system. Regen is covered under the hybrid warranty because it is done by the transmission and battery.

 

Anyway, to me the cost of the warranty is worth the peace of mind. To others it is not.

[tishpit]

Thank you all for your replies.... for now, I've decided to forgo the extended warranty as other unexpected bills popped up.  Will re-evaluate when I am closer to the bumper-to-bumper expiring.  I know the Prius is the queen of reliability, but with Ford's system, not sure how it will hold up long term.  So far, about 2,000 miles, so good!

[stevedebi]

Thank you all for your replies.... for now, I've decided to forgo the extended warranty as other unexpected bills popped up.  Will re-evaluate when I am closer to the bumper-to-bumper expiring.  I know the Prius is the queen of reliability, but with Ford's system, not sure how it will hold up long term.  So far, about 2,000 miles, so good!

I'm waiting a while as well. Just remember to go in before 35K miles, my dealer said there is something about that number that is important.

[ptjones]

I would recommend 125K Premium Warranty, I'm in the process of replacing my Trans assembly(very expensive ) with 98Kmi., I knew my Trans was going to fail, it was just a matter of time. I had a 100K warranty with 96Kmi on the car, I decided to extend it another 35Kmi with potential Trans problem, good thing I did.

 

Paul

[stevedebi]

I would recommend 125K Premium Warranty, I'm in the process of replacing my Trans assembly(very expensive ) with 98Kmi., I knew my Trans was going to fail, it was just a matter of time. I had a 100K warranty with 96Kmi on the car, I decided to extend it another 35Kmi with potential Trans problem, good thing I did.

 

Paul

Paul,

This is something I hope everyone reads - if you already have an ESP warranty, it can be extended so long as there is still time or mileage on the existing ESP. I had a warrenty extension on my FEH up to around 140K miles.

[Zathrus]

I've read elsewhere on this forum that the eCVT trans is unique to the hybrid powertrain. If this is true, is the trans covered under the standard 8 year/100K power-train warranty?

Edited April 28, 2015 by Zathrus

[raadsel]

I've read elsewhere on this forum that the eCVT trans is unique to the hybrid powertrain. If this is true, is the trans covered under standard the 8 year/100K power-train warranty?

 

From what I can find, it is under the standard power train warranty.

 

From the warranty brochure: "(1) Your vehicle’s Powertrain components are covered for five years or 60,000 miles, whichever occurs first. The extended coverage applies to the Engine: all internal lubricated parts, cylinder block, cylinder heads, electrical fuel pump, powertrain control module, engine mounts, flywheel, injection pump, manifold (exhaust and intake), manifold bolts, oil pan, oil pump, seals and gaskets, engine thermostat, engine thermostat housing, timing chain cover, timing chain (gears or belt), turbocharger/supercharger unit, valve covers, water pump; Transmission: all internal parts, clutch cover, seals and gaskets, torque converter, transfer case (including all internal parts), transmission case, transmission mounts; single-speed gear (for The Focus Electric); Front-Wheel Drive: axle shafts, front bearings seals and gaskets, universal and constant velocity joints; Rear-Wheel Drive: axle shafts, bearings (front and rear), center support bearing, drive axle housing (including all internal parts), drive shaft, retainers, supports, seals and gaskets, universal and constant velocity joints"

 

For the Hybrid warranty:

 

"Your vehicle’s unique hybrid / electric components are covered during the Hybrid / Electric Unique Component Coverage, which lasts for eight years or 100,000 miles, whichever occurs first.

 

"The following hybrid parts are covered during this extended coverage period: high-voltage battery, hybrid continuously variable transmission, Inverter System Controller (ISC), DC/DC converter, high-voltage battery connector, battery pack fan assembly, thermistor probe, Hybrid Battery Pack Sensor Module (HBPSM), Battery Energy Control Module (BECM), and the PHEV onboard charger."

Edited April 28, 2015 by raadsel

[stevedebi]

I've read elsewhere on this forum that the eCVT trans is unique to the hybrid powertrain. If this is true, is the trans covered under standard the 8 year/100K power-train warranty?

There is a member over on the Energi forum who bought a used 2013 with 79K. The transmission was making noise. The first dealer said they would charge 1K to diagnose, and then if it was the "hybrid part" of the transmission it would be covered, otherwise it would cost 7K. I have a feeling that dealer was either sleezy or clueless. He took it to a separate dealer who said (correctly) that there was nothing that could be rebuilt on the transmission anyway, charged $170 to check it, and discovered the transmission had to be replaced under the hybrid warranty.

 

It got a bit confused because the warranty booklet for the 2013 included a lot of generic words under the "60K powertrain" warranty. It mentioned locking wheel hubs and AWD! Obviously that is impossible, and in any case that entire hybrid CVT is unique to the hybrid car. I've never heard of anyone thinking the 8/100 didn't cover the full transmission, but that dealer tried to say so, and Ford corporate apparently backed the dealer up. It was hogwash as far as I was concerned, and it appears to have turned out all right.

 

But back OT, if an extended warranty had been involved, there would have been no quesion - and an included rental car while the transmisison was fixed.

[Zathrus]

 

raadsel and stevedebi...Thank You for clarifying the eCVT transmission should be covered as part of the standard Hybrid / Electric Unique Component Warranty Coverage (which lasts for eight years or 100,000 miles, whichever occurs first).