fbov

The C-Max was a tremendous surprise; it handled more like a go-kart than a top-heavy SUV. The Escape is that top-heavy SUV. I blame geometry as much as Ford's desire to please their target audience (this isn't a "man's car," whatever that might mean). Weight higher on the same track width will always be less stable. Then there's the seats... very comfortable in a straight line, but the lack of lateral support is a real barrier to spirited driving. That would help, and it's in the plan, but... I'm still in the getting acquainted period. Haven't even tried the Eco driving mode (Normal is default). It's possible the lovely smooth ride will go away as handling improves. Better ride is as obvious as the poorer handling. I'll raise them eventually. Per Tire Rack's spec sheet, there are three Ecopia tires in the 225/55R19 size. H-speed rating is available in a Japanese Ecopia H/L 422, and a domestic Ecopia H/L 422 that's OEM only on the 2020 Escape. The same is true for the 225/65-17, the base Escape tire size. Specs are slightly different, as you can see, below. The third tire is a domestic V-rated 51-psi version, but it's not an OEM. 225/55R19 99H SL 600 A A 1,709 lbs 51 psi 10/32" 27 lbs 6-8" 7" 9.2" 7.2" 28.8" 724 JP 225/55R19 99H SL 700 A A 1,709 lbs 44 psi /32" 25 lbs 6-8" 7" 7.2" US And none of these Ecopia fit a C-Max. That's the Ecopia 422, what TR calls a Grand Touring, not the Crossover/SUV Touring Ecopia H/L 422. My idea of an "unsafe" tire is one that is perfectly linear, until it lets go with no warning. Think cantilever-sidewall racing slicks. Safe enough for trained race car drivers who know the traction limit and have practiced recovery (ever wonder why racers will saw the wheel back and forth?). A "safe" tire warns the driver with progressively ineffective steering response as cornering forces increase. As the driver increases speed in a turn, as on a freeway on-ramp, increased steering input is required to maintain a constant radius. Going into a turn too hot, that increased steering input provides significant braking force which reduces speed to safer levels. It took me years of autocrossing to learn to stop braking with the steering wheel, and steer with the throttle. That's a double-edge sword. Analog gauges can tell you much more in a glance than any numeric display. Race cars are set up with gauges turned so "good" readings are all point up; a glance tells you if one's tilted. These displays must be read, requiring the same cognitive attention that's critical to avoiding collisions. There are analog markers in the circles around the numbers of the L/R displays, but they're very hard to see, and somewhat distracting; the speed display has a highlight that flashes in and out, annoying at night. Glad to hear there's light at the end of the block heater tunnel. I'm holding out for the proper factory routing the harness is design to provide. And in the FWIW department, I've seen no sign of EV+ but will keep an eye out as my home arrivals pile up. Having fun, Frank

Now over 200 miles and more observations. I finally found "grade assist." It's undocumented. Despite the manual's instruction to "Press the grade assist button to activate grade assist," I am unable to find the button! However, I did a long downhill today that normally had C-Max Grade Assist filling HVB and running the engine if I didn't brake before the bottom. To my surprise, the "Hill Descent Control" light came on (same icon as C-Max Grade Assist) and regen cranked up to 30 kW. It acted a little differently at the bottom of the hill, but the engine never turned. Once I knew what to look for, it seems to act like the L setting on the C-Max transmission, but only when going downhill. As I moved the throttle, regen lessened based on position, through zero, until it switched to EV. I'll have to go through the menus again to see if there's a setting option. I've driven enough to feel there's little-to-no loss in EV capability with the smaller HVB. I think they're charging more quickly when the HVB is low. I see the EV Available outline shrink as the HVB runs down, but find a short ICE burn gets me back past 10 kW available (of about 20 kW max). There's enough energy to EV for a bit. As a result, I think the maximum EV range is lower, but useful EV is accessible more of the time. Weather's warmer today so I've been driving a bit more aggressively. Handling isn't as quick as the C-Max, but it's not bad. These domestic Ecopias are fairly linear but I can feel a safe mushiness coming at the limit. This car has electric steering, and I do feel that bit of isolation, but it's fast enough for quick maneuvering. I also got to try out the AWD today, up a long, steep, snow-covered driveway. I needed my brakes at the top, while the C-Max has barely made it on occasion. It's warm today, and the snow was soft so the full-tread tires had a lot of bite. The car was very stable accelerating up the hill (sharp turn at the bottom) and it seemed I wasn't pushing the car at all. But I wasn't looking at the dash so no idea how hard I was actually pushing it. Having fun, Frank

Thanks for the kind words, but who said I'm going anywhere? In fairness, I went looking for an analogous Escape forum, and the "best" I found was at Blue Oval, about 1 post/week. Lots more activity here! HAve fun, Frank

As readers know, I am now driving a 2020 Escape Hybrid. Here's the closeout on our 2013 C-Max. Lifetime summary was reset at the first PCM update, at 11,152 miles on 10/15/2013. Actual miles since update is 55,398.5 miles, for 54.6% EV and 4.4% Regen. Trip 2 was also reset in my attempt to capture the benefit of that first PCM update. Sadly, counters don't have enough digits. MPG might be close, but the rest are way off. Regardless, I'm yet another owner who had no problem beating EPA mileage estimates, despite a long, cold, mileage-killing winter every year. It was an excellent car, overall, save for the brakes; front rotor rusted out and rear brakes needed repeated service. The unexpected part was that the car changed my personality. I was a typical type-A driver, focused on speed, speed and speed. I drove underpowered cars in part to keep my license. And our relationship start off poorly; the car really needed the tailgate recall and I didn't play well with automated doors. But, my wife wanted us to get the car from her father's estate, so I joined the forum and we got the car, just as the EPA thing started. It took me a year to "get" that this was not a highway car. By the second winter, I was committed to taking the "dribbly way" as my kids put it; shorter, more direct surface routes instead of interstates. Instead of trying to stay 9 MPH above the speed limit all the time, I was trying to stay below the blue outline that defined EV Available. I started to drive the wife and kids nuts because I was driving so slowly. I still am. Frank

More observations. The hood latch is a double pull to open; there's no safety latch to find with fingertips under the edge of the hood. If you don't get the hood fully closed the first time, you have to go back in the cabin to open it. 18" is about the right drop to latch mine. Yes, the hood still has a prop bar... Unlike C-Max, there's a seal at the front edge of the hood, so airflow is much smoother from the point of the nose over the hood. I hope it reduces rust; my car's hood edge perforated. I noticed the tailgate is also lower than the roofline, just like the C-Max, but with a couple air baffles spanning the gap underneath. Wheels are very different from C-Max. The silver areas you see in photos are coplanar; the face is nearly flat with depressions where its open. C-Max wheel have many small spokes sticking up, into the air flow, like fan blades. They never looked efficient.... Paul, I believe you use wheel covers; what kind of effect do you see? HAve fun, Frank

Thanks, Paul. Yours is just where I imagined it, but it looked like an aftermarket kluge job with the harness armor and cap over the prongs, when it didn't get caught in the hinge or crushed when closing the hood. I came around to the idea that I paid for factory install, and I want no excuses if there are warranty issues. Frank

You heard wrong on both counts. Please post in the "Who is going to jump..." thread. This thread is not for speculation. Everyone is welcome to ask questions, but please answer ONLY if you're an owner, speaking from experience. Facts are welcomed, rumors are not. - my rear seats recline, and move fore and aft. - my spare tire well is the same sheet metal as non-hybrids; neither will fit a full size tire. The only potential "hybrid sacrifice" is the flat load floor. Non-hybrids can tilt the floor to match the plane of the rear seats. The battery under the spare tire prevents this in the hybrid, but it also gives the load floor great center support. I look forward to more owner participation in the near future.... Have fun, Frank

The back end is interesting; Ford took a modular approach, using large styrofoam blocks to define the underfloor space and support the cargo floor. The undersized spare sits on a spacer, bolted to a bracket over the 12v battery, and surrounding blocks give the floor even support. The 155/70-17 spare has lots of room around it, but not enough to fit a 225/55-19. The well is only about 28" wide while the tire is 29" tall. A slight undersize might fit, but then you have to deal with height since the load floor sits on the mini-spare. And a slight undersize still causes speed mismatch on the axel, so there's no great advantage over the mini-spare. And we're not keeping any snow up here. 5' have fallen, but there's barely any on the ground. Warm January... Have fun, Frank

Time for a report. I'm over 100 miles now, and I've done nothing to the car. Tire pressures (max 41 psi BTW) are at 33 psi. Fuel is whatever the dealer put in, 87E10 I suspect. Initial aerodynamic mods were temporary, "snow covered" the first day. It's a very nice car. Ride is quiet and smoother than the C-Max at 50 psi on the tires. No idea if it's as nimble. Ride height doesn't seem much higher until you realize you can see over the C-Max next to you. The car is 4.5" taller and you sit higher in it so it feels like twice that. The sloping hood gives the same kind of forward view, so it's really not noticeable at the wheel. I like the inside rearview mirror better (darker) and don't miss the wide-angle mirrors on the wings as much as expected. BLISS isn't intrusive, although I do get an odd steering feel sometimes, I really miss the road feedback of a direct steering linkage, but the computer can't save the unskilled driver without being in control. I'm waiting for Big Brother to take over, like the C-Max did with the faulty RSC module. I believe all hybrids get the fancy display, speed to the left, power to the right with a user-selectable screen in between. The power screen shows ICE and EV kW being provided, based on throttle position, switching to a single regen power display on braking. There's also a perimeter display around the numbers, 0-180 kW of power, with regen displayed as negative values. There is no "My View" option. The center screen shows the kind of data C-Max shows in the left display, like trip odos, along with an EV Coach that's similar to the C-Max Empower screen power display. A single horizontal bar shows Regen power to the left and ICE power, EV power, and EV Available to the right. Yes, the blue outline showing EV Available in the Empower screen has been retained, and it behaves similarly. I can EV up to a maximum of 19 kW at speed before the ICE kicks in. The only sign of HVB charge status is a shrinking blue outline in EV. When the ICE runs, EV Available shrinks to sort of say "I'm here" without saying how much is there. I'm learning to use the throttle to switch to EV, but it's not as easy as the C-Max. At the same time, "chasing blue" from a stop works much better; I'm routinely getting to 20 MPH before ICE kicks in. That said, the first time I went out to see what I had, I hit 50.4 MPG in 32F weather over snow-covered roads. Auspicious, but I drove slow and had a tail wind. This was my old work commute, albeit at 3:00 AM Sunday morning, so I also took a return trip that was faster into head wind. I had no traffic and a very well known route where ICE burns points and durations were well defined over many years. Average trip time was 35 minutes for 15.3 miles, same as C-Max, at 48.4 MPG for the round trip. Average in the C-Max at 32F was 45.4 MPG, but those were 100% cold starts, which this was not. Still, auspicious at least. The one big dissatisfier is the block heater... Ford didn't route the cable, just left it behind the engine. Dealer set it up under the hood and using about half the clamps, clips and tie-downs placed along the harness, and a ton of slack. I doubt Ford issued a generic power cord. If anyone has access to the Ford routing documentation, I'd be very grateful. It's length easily reaches the lowest grill opening where there's lots of space and easy access. Under the hood is a non-starter. Any questions? Frank

That's what many folks thought about the HF35, but while it was the 3rd generation transaxel, it was a 1st generation Ford design. The HF45 in the Escape is the 2nd gen Ford design where we hope that might be true. It's certainly a different implementation; lots more metal next to the ICE. I suspect they integrated the inverter and controls. If you want details, I recommend the Weber State videos. This links to all their Ford entries, so looks for the eCVTs. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLIn3FrDiB1lwAhpYXTHmgEJLHwEDPYv2d Have fun, Frank

That's a big part of what makes them so good. They're not blue. Blue light has two problems.... 1) we can't see any detail in blue light. I have a demo using red and blue LEDs... you can't read in blue light. Too few blue sensors to resolve letters. 2) blue light doesn't play well with air. If you search "why is the sky blue" you'll find this from NASA: "Blue light is scattered in all directions by the tiny molecules of air in Earth's atmosphere. Blue is scattered more than other colors because it travels as shorter, smaller waves. This is why we see a blue sky most of the time." When blue light hits air, it stops and goes sideways. It doesn't illuminate the road, it illuminates everything between you and the road. Add water in any phase, snow, rain or fog, and blue light will hide the road even better. I wear gradient, blue-blocker sunglasses. They sometimes help in rainstorms, allowing me to see many car lengths farther through the spray. At night, sunglasses are a no-no; you need good lights. I plan for worst case. Have fun, Frank

Some of us are betting they got it right the second time (HF45).

How would you improve on the best headlight system out there? Ford got everything right with the C-Max. The new Escape, not so much... LED headlights suck. Frank

Neither did mine, but the same USB runs a dash cam perfectly! Frank

65 MPH trip? I found that terrain matters at all speeds. Somehow, the NYS Thruway gets lower mileage than the interstates in Ohio, where the car was purchased by my Father-in-law. We inherited it, so there were lots of trips to Ohio. Their rolling hills worked a magic that flat upstate NY highways can't. Now, get off the interstate and our terrain can be exploited. What did you use to create the charts? I've used a GIS-based system... HAve fun, Frank

It's been a while. ELM327 is what I was recalling, either with WiFI or Bluetooth. Just be aware that not all work with Ford; I have one that does, and one that doesn't. Have fun, Frank

Informed decisions. The more you learn, the more you get choices, not outcomes. My meaning, too, because EV and heat come at the same time in the C-Max. You can tell the folks with AccuGage or other OBDII interrogator. They know the values... And thank you , Plus3, for starting the data dump. We have some interested, new owners; your pointers to past discussions are just the thing for them. Have fun, Frank

Want to see inside the engine controls? Get an OBDII BT of WiFi adapter and use a smartphone app to get the data. Plus3 and ptjones can tell you details. Frank

It also depends where you live. Single digits are a different driving experience. On back roads, the ICE never gets to operating temperature on flat land; you need some hills. A thermal head start really helps. I'll let you know once I get mine figured out. I have seen a picture of it, so I know where to look. Frank

In the old days, Ford did Vehicle Health Reports using your cell phone to transmit the information. That ended a couple years ago. FordPASS isn't a replacement. I found no functional benefit. Newer cars are a different story. Frank

Welcome! First, your 2013 has 4-door entry; rear doors unlock as well as the front. They got rid of that in later years. I used the back door whenever it happened. Second, Ford had a service bulletin on them because they didn't work when wet. TSB14-0078 per service records. It involved disassembling the handle and applying a drying spray... can't find the copy, hopefully someone will chime in. Issues did disappear eventually. have fun Frank

There's more to this than cost, not unlike using ethanol-free fuel. I have no idea how much it costs for effective pre-heating but I do know you'll get heat sooner. EV becomes available when the heat comes up, and the engine won't run when the car's stopped, both good things. Creature comforts and better mileage won't be free, more like a quarter. Conversely, a 1000W heater uses 1 kWh per hour, by definition. I'm paying about $0.13/kWh, delivered, so let's say 25 cents per 2-hour use. At $3/gal for gas, it costs 1/12 of a gallon to use. Then it's up to trip length. Short trips benefit most, but don't use enough fuel to pay for it. If you're getting 36 MPG, you'd have to go 6 miles using half the fuel, of 72 MPG for the 6 mile trip. I'll let you know, but I only get that kind of mileage going downhill. And then there's ambient temperature... not THAT many nights below freezing, are there? Have fun, Frank

It won't heat up near as much when closed. The cloth is as effective as an umbrella. I only opened mine when it got cold out. Frank

Turning radius is no different than any other FWD Ford.

Promising... for 42.2 MPG coming home from the market (warm start). I'm letting it get buried in snow. My apologies for the weather. Frank