plus 3 golfer

Can you feel a raised lip on any of the flat surface rotor edges as you slide your finger across the rotor to the edge? A new rotor is perfectly flat. After rotors wear and since the pads don't extend to the surface, the edges will be raised slightly as the inner surface wears away.

Paul, just wondering if your regen miles and EV miles are since you owned the car or from the reset of those values which should have occurred with the 13B07 update. My dealer SO shows the mileage on my vehicle when the update was performed. If I inadvertently used the odometer miles to calculate my % from the displayed EV and Regen miles, I would get 2.4% for regen miles and 33.9% for EV miles which is way to low.

I assume EV energy is all energy supplied by the battery to propel the car and thus would include all sources of energy to charge the battery. The regen score only applies to when one depresses the foot brake and is used as a tool to help one to not use the friction brakes. Braking to me simply means that the front wheels have a force applied to them and are slowing down via regeneration and/or friction. The ABS / stability control algorithms know what is going on and there would be no reason that the rear brakes couldn't be applied anytime. The ABS can do proportional braking Wiki says: "When braking or decelerating, the Fusion's hybrid system uses regenerative braking, where the electric drive motor becomes a generator, converting the vehicle's momentum back to electricity for storage in the batteries." I've always seen discussion on "regenerative braking" to include coasting (decelerating). Braking does not mean that one has to brake via friction brakes. So, that's why I assume regen miles is all energy (converted to miles) generated by braking the front wheels. The inverter / battery is capable of 35 kW of sustained charge. I would think that would then be the maximum braking force that MG2 (traction motor) would apply during regen. The question then: is 35 kW of braking force to much force to put on the front wheels while the rear end is free wheeling. I don't know but have a feeling that the rear friction brakes may be used in assisting slow down (the rotors seem to be wearing). Then, the question is does application of the rear friction brakes affect brake score? Edit: here's the definition of regenerative braking in the owner's manual:

I'm not sure I necessarily buy that a higher regen miles % is associated with city driving. I would think that regen miles includes ALL regeneration not just using the brakes. So when one is coasting and using grade assist one is regenerating. My regen miles is 3.6% with a 94% brake score and my EV miles is 50.7%. My lifetime mpg is 42.0. We do a lot of freeway driving at 70+ mph and coast coming off ramps up 1/3 to 1/2 mile. I also try to time lights by coasting and coast to stops. We also have done many 300-400 mile trips into the mountains where I always use grade assist. So, why is my FE about 10% lower than Paul's FE even though my EV and regen miles are a higher %? My guess is that my average speed is considerably higher than Paul's average speed and thus I have significantly more energy available to capture via regeneration when coasting, braking, and using grade assist. One other thought when applying the brakes and that is does the rear friction brakes assist for control purposes when the front wheels are in a pure regeneration mode (no friction braking). I have read papers that have modeled and IIRC tested various control schemes. If so, using the brakes for more regenerative braking may be lowering ones overall % regeneration vs coasting to slow down. One anecdotal fact is that when I feel the surface of the front rotors compared to the rear rotors, the rear rotors have a slightly raised outer lip after 25k miles. There is no perceived lip on the front rotors. Could this be friction braking wear on the rear? Maybe others (be good to get someone with little miles on their car) could check their rotors for what appears to be the sign of rotor wear.

I guess you never saw the "Sal and family" commercial. I think the rub (which I've stated many, many times) is that Ford aggressively promoted 47 mpg (the EPA numbers in those silly C-Max beat the Prius V silhouette commercials in late 2012) knowing that they used the Fusion Hybrid FE test data for the C-Max Hybrid and that the aerodynamic drag of the Fusion was significantly less than the C-Max. Then Raj Nair came up with flimsy reasons why the C-Max didn't score well in FE tests by reviewers instead of coming clean. This was not a safety issue just a deceptive campaign to promote C-Max sales. Ford can't resolve the FE issue (like manufacturers do with safety issues) but tried to appease owners with a $550 payment. But they haven't covered prospective diminished value from the revised FE numbers. If one keeps their C-Max long enough, diminished value will be moot. Of course I knew I wouldn't come close to 47 mpg when I purchased in Dec. 2012 having done my due diligence on FE. I bought the C-Max for the reasons given in the Sal Commercial and expected low 40s mpg.

I'd look at it this way. When I download the 339 fuelly observations for MY 2013, I get a 39.6 mpg mean with a 4 mpg standard deviation around the mean. Your FE is 36.9 or 2.7 mpg from the mean (less than 1 standard deviation). So, the 2.7 mpg difference falls within a 50% probability band around the mean (25% below the mean and 25% above the mean). So, it's likely that 25 % of C-Max Hybrids will get less FE than you and 75% will likely get higher FE than you are getting.

Why do you want to abandon such? Are you saying you downshifted to slow down or coasted to minimize braking? If you've got the time, coasting is better than using brakes. In the C-Max when you coast, there will be regeneration to simulate ICE engine braking as would be the case in non-hybrid cars but not in the C-Max powertrain. Using the brakes increases regeneration and slows the car down faster than coasting but there's energy losses in MG2, inverter, HVB when both storing and using the captured braking energy.

Have you seen this thread and charts.

The issue I see is most battery Tenders have a low Ampere rating. It is not meant to be a quick charger. In addition, if there's a parasitic load of 3-4 A on the battery sometime in the overnight period, a battery tender is unlikely to prevent every dead battery as the drain is likely greater than the capability of the tender. So, eventually the battery will go "dead". A battery Tender is good for vehicles driven on an occasional basis and driven for short distances to keep the battery fully charged. IMO, one needs a portable, rechargeable jump start system or jumper cables plus another vehicle as a better hedge against a dead battery. I'm not familiar with which jump starts are best but it seems that one will likely have to pay $100+ for a decent one although Harbor Freight has one for $50.

dweiser, I have a "fire suit" I can lend you.

If you assume about 3200 Ford US dealerships and every dealer had one C-Max Hybrid on site that's a two month supply at current sales levels. So, I can see why many dealers (especially dealers in the "country") won't have any on site. When I bought mine in late Dec. 2012, Phoenix dealers had about 2 on site, on average available for sale. The closest dealer (4 miles) never had one on site that wasn't sold when I began looking in Nov. 2012.

The effect of weather should be in the total sales trend curve. When comparing winter 2012/13 with winter 2013/14, the winter trends look very similar and virtually the same sales volume. I would expect hybrid sales to be affected similarly during these periods. One sees Dec and Feb sales higher than Jan sales in both the C-Max and Fusion hybrids (like sales for all autos) in the winter periods but the sales volume of the C-Max declined significantly in the 2013/14 winter from the 2012/13 period - a decline of about 60%. So, IMO weather wasn't a significant independent factor in the decline of C-Max sales during the 2013/14 winter period.

Here's the April data added to my charts with significant events noted that may have affected C-Max sales.

Double hogwash!! :) In the macro sense, supply / demand of all cars in total will affect used car prices. But on a micro level, a used C-Max is not a commodity as there are other brand alternatives or even a new C-Max as options. The concept of alternative choices - substitution effect applies. Also, why would someone trade in their perfectly good C-Max simply because a few owners have experienced more issues with their car than other makes and thus their model has a lower rating than other cars. There is no basis to expect 90% (or 5%) of first year Buyers would be trading in their C-Max in mass because of issues and that there be a lot of used C-Maxes for sale. Resale value of a C-Max is what someone is willing to pay for it whether supply is one unit or 100 units. If you need a car, there is a significant number of choices in the used car market besides a C-Max - consumers have free choice to pick what they deem to be the best value taking into account factors important to them. If you need a 100,000 barrels of crude, you will pay market price which is driven by supply / demand expectations - you don't have a choice. Also, it easy to scoff at the battery issue until it happens to you. ;)

After seeing the pics of the black tape, I think I like the silver dots better. :)

I think the repair shop is just trying to find excuses to appease you but they could have a point if replacing struts is a routine maintenance item on taxi fleets. Struts should last at least 100k miles and likely double the average miles a typical NYC taxi does in a year even on NYC streets and expressways (I spent 3 1/2 years working in midtown). Even so, 44 days??? Interesting facts on NYC taxis. Apparently some things haven't changed in 15 years. I don't recall ever having a female taxi driver.

Welcome aboard (I guess). First question is why isn't the speeder's insurance paying for everything including the rental? Did the car not stop or you didn't get the plate number? I do believe that Ford owes you something as good will. It's unconscionable that Ford builds and sells a car and can't deliver one part on the vehicle in one week or less. If that's Ford's MO, it's no wonder Ford gets poor scores on surveys. IMO, what's fair is for Ford to pay for around 37 days of rental. So 37/56 * $2925 = about $2000 which may be more than 4 lease payments. That's where I would start and go from there. IMO, what Geico would have paid is irrelevant in the discussions with Ford. What's relevant is 44 days to get a strut. Come on Ford.

At 70F you should have no issues reaching about 40F. It should also only take about one minute (put fan on high, and temp. set point to minimum). If it takes a long time to reach about 40F, that is also an issue. IIRC, the update did something with the AC control logic to make use of AC more efficient. Is it just taking more time to cool the car or can you not get the car to a comfortable level when temps are high? I will run the test on my car this afternoon when ambient is into the 80s. We might hit 100F over the weekend and I'll run the test again. EDIT: I ran the test after a trip to the barber (but forgot to take my phone to get precise timing but it will vary depending on initial conditions). Ambient was 84F, inside of car was 92F, car was parked. I pushed the start button, set temp to low and auto (I assume fan was near Max but forgot to check). It took about one minute plus for the center vent temp. to fall to 50F and about 2 minutes plus for temp to reach 40F.

Sad to hear mtcmax but you made your dad laugh in a time of sadness. My condolences. So, I hope you enjoyed the time you got to spend with your father, as one never knows when their time is up and how fast moments of joy can turn to sadness. I really never got to know my father as I was six when he passed of throat / lung cancer (2+ packs a day and breathing air ladened with toxic chemicals from working in a tannery couldn't have helped). My mother will be 93 next month with mild dementia. She says the family doctor never suspected his symptoms were cancer (or perhaps conditions that would ultimately lead to cancer) until a couple months before his death and had told him to find other employment and move to a "different" climate and his respiratory problems would go away.

Yes, around 40F out the center vent is fairly typical with fan on high and temp set to minimum as the controls will regulate the compressor to prevent icing of the evaporator core. My AC is fine in AZ even above 110F. pjurek99, the thermometer test is very reliable in assessing the AC performance. Give it a try and report back. Four (Nissan, MB, and 2 VWs) out of my last 5 vehicles have all been around 40F. If it's not below around 45F than something is likely wrong. I did have a 1996 Maxima where the temp never got below 50F and the PA dealer wouldn't do anything under warranty having run his checks. In AZ (then my son's car) when the temp got near 100F, it wouldn't provide sufficient cooling but was bearable. I believe it needed a new compressor right from the factory.

No black tape on mine. So the black tape covers the dots and extends to the glass edge? If so, that's a good distance on the rear hatch. I wonder what the glass looks like without tint--- are the dots still showing a silver hue? It would seem to me that the raised edge of the tape on the glass could allow dirt buildup (like on pinstriping and clear bra) and may require extra cleaning and lift up if not careful. I would presume the tape is easy to remove should it become problematic.

What's the diagnostic trouble code? It sounds like a similar message I got. See this thread. My message cleared on restart and has been fine since.

jes_ma, the 12V battery does not crank the engine. The HVB cranks the engine via MG1 (motor / generator 1) and is like a "starter" motor found in non-hybrid cars for ICE. When ICE is running MG1 can be used as a generator to charge the HVB. The 12V battery is needed to power the control modules (like in a non-hybrid car) so that high voltage from the HVB can be supplied to MG1 via an inverter . So, both the 12V and the HVB are needed to start the car. If the 12V battery dies, the control modules won't work that operate the high voltage system and all other electronics / accessories in the car. So, it's likely not practicable to put a secondary 12V battery and necessary controls to switch in should the primary 12V battery fail. I carry my set of jumper cables in the compartment under the driver's seat as a hedge against being stranded with a dead battery. Some have purchased a portable "jump start" system. Also, the owner's manual shows the procedure to use to move the shift lever out of park to neutral for an electrical problem like a dead battery.

Welcome Melinda. Practice, practice, practice and you will achieve 100% brake scores anytime you want to (but for an "unplanned" traffic light change). :) I have always tried to "time" traffic lights and coast to stops as using ones friction brakes in conventional cars wastes energy. I do the same in the C-Max (time lights) to lessen the chance of getting a lower brake score. Also, become familiar with the "grade assist" button as it can be used when going down hills to maintain speed (so car does not begin to accelerate and pick up speed). Grade assist will first use up to maximum regenerative braking and then use engine braking to maintain ones speed going downhill. But if speed continues to increase, you can always use the brakes to engage friction braking. Okay, so it looks like fotomoto is the guy to beat. So, what's the prize for the lowest brake score? Just some thoughts below on how one might minimize ones brake score. Probably need the HVB full (go down a steep hill to full charge the HVB) and then slam on the brakes to achieve a near zero brake score. Otherwise, if there is HVB storage space available and since the traction motor MG2 is always spinning when the car is in motion, one would think the traction motor should be charging as one is slowing even under full ABS activation as ABS should not allow the wheels to lock up. Even with a full HVB, one might not be able to get to zero brake score as there will always be load on the car when running that needs supplied and the PCM will likely regulate the operation of MG2 to meet the load (sum of HV power interfaces = zero) when the HVB is full. Also, does one want to be going fast or slow when trying to achieve a zero brake score assuming brake score is a % of the energy captured to the available energy that could be captured. Since vehicle load (watts) should be virtually constant during the braking, the energy would simply be load * time. The time to stop will be a function of the kinetic energy at the time of brake application and maybe potential energy if the ground is not flat once one starts the braking. One would also have to account for the drag (aero and rolling resistance) on the moving vehicle as it is slowing down and the ABS brake load such that the wheels don't lock up. Any volunteers to come up with the equations that tie all this together or to run tests :)

Right and Wrong. :) We don't know the extent of the battery issue but it's likely small (maybe affects just a very small % of C-Maxes). But if other manufacturers don't have that issue with their vehicles and if a C-Max owner has had the issue multiple times because Ford can't fix it or Ford says it's fixed with software updates, replacing the battery, connectors and so forth but the problem occurred again, the effective % increases (because of more trips to the dealer). So, the C-Max then gets a poor rating in that category than other manufacturers. That doesn't mean the C-Max is a Dud. I wouldn't expect anyone to dump the car because someone else had a no-start / battery issue especially since it is an likely to most an inconvenience and not a high out-of-pocket cost. Who has insinuated that the C-Max is a Dud or Defective but perhaps certain owners who have had issues and perhaps got Ford to buy back their car. CR and JDPowers hasn't. Surveys, EPA mileage estimates. reviews, forums and the like are tools a prospective buyer may consider when purchasing a car. Consumers' risk aversion varies. Some may see a "black" circle to be avoided at all costs, others may research and assess the underlying risk issues causing the black circle, some may believe they can hedge the risk, others may ignore the black circle as "hogwash", and some may never get the word. If Ford wants to increase reliability perception, they've got to change the "black circle" to a "red circle" and there will be virtually no risk to avert for this no start issue and sales may increase as the prospective buyers' pool will have increased.