Ford C-max least reliable car in America (Says CR)

[Seth7721]

I just saw a article on the internet from consumer reports, saying the C-maxes are the least reliable cars.

 

The vehicle with the top predicted reliability score was the 2014 Subaru Forester SUV, while FordCo's C-Max Energi plug-in hybrid vehicle received the worst score, Consumer Reports said.

 

Here is a link to read the full article http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/28/autos-consumerreports-idUSL1N0II0JJ20131028

 

If you are currently subscribed to consumer reports, like I am I'm sure your just as angry.

I am terminating my consumer reports subscription immediately, for being so bias. :nonono: :gaah:

I hope you feel and do the same. :rtfm:

[ArizonaEnergi]

At least they didn't put the Energi on their Not Recommended list, but still very disappointing for us early adopters.  Must be the dead 12v battery problem [EDIT: Although few Energi owners reported this problem] that dragged the rating down, as I'm unaware of any major mechanical problems.

 

While Toyota's luxury Lexus and namesake brands were ranked most reliable in the U.S. auto industry in Consumer Reports' annual new-car reliability survey, the magazine said it will no longer recommend the Camry, Prius v model or RAV4 sport utility vehicle because they received "poor" ratings in a crash test started last year by the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety.

Edited October 28, 2013 by ArizonaEnergi

[drdiesel1]

CS has always favored imports and I believe they take manufacture money for good reports :secret:

 

I never considered CS to be a worthwhile source for anything, especially automotive information :future:

[drdiesel1]

I like how they can predict a cars reliability :drop:  The biggest cause of this rating is the NAV/MFT system issue's.

I haven't had any issue's with mine. I updated to 3.6.2 the day after I purchased my car.  I think they need to reevaluate this rating.

 

From the CS article:

The vehicle with the top predicted reliability score was the 2014 Subaru Forester SUV, while Ford Co's C-Max Energi plug-in hybrid vehicle received the worst score, Consumer Reports said.

Two popular models, Honda's redesigned 2013 Accord with a V6 engine and the 2013 Nissan Altima, scored too poorly for Consumer Reports to continue recommending them.

One of the main problem areas in the survey was in-car electronics, including infotainment systems. Of the 17 categories tracked, the area generated the most complaints, including buggy systems with screen freezes, touch control lag or a reluctance to recognize a cell phone or other device.

For instance, last year, Ford tumbled to nearly the bottom of the survey due to flaws in its touch-screen navigation and entertainment system, MyFord Touch.

Edited October 28, 2013 by drdiesel1

[hybridbear]

Another potential source of bias in the CR reporting is that they only gather data from their subscribers. I doubt that CR subscribers are a truly representative group.

[HotPotato]

You can fault CR's testing methodology or criteria, but they are the one source that actually does NOT have a financial incentive for bias. They accept no advertising, refuse paid junkets, and anonymously purchase the cars they test. As noted above, the C-Max is not on their "not recommended" list, but several Toyotas including the Prius V are, which hardly suggests they are in Toyota's pocket.  If I were king of CR I'd have different criteria for rating cars than, say, refrigerators -- because I believe a car should be fun to drive and rated largely on that criterion -- but that's just me. I think a bigger issue with CR, JD Power and all the rest is that with ALL cars becoming so reliable, and minor infotainment snafus being rated as a defect no different than failed brakes, the ratings tend to misrepresent and overstate problems.

[obob]

Foreign manufacturers tend to debug there cars on their own population or not the US population so by the time they come here they will get good marks.  

 

The CR C-Max review in my opinion was positive. There was an early video where the reviewer, a young woman, said it was not cool looking or somthing like that which I thought was totally wrong.  If I wrote the review I would have slammed the entertainment system more than they did, though I haven't seen the competition but compared to using my computer. I have considered Velcroing a tablet to my dash and running Linux for my entertainment system.

 

They got bad marks for reliability because they had some bad stuff in the first model year - battery, entertainment system.  And I hope Ford has a good resolution to the transmission problem cab drivers are having.

 

So far Ford seems to be handling things with class.

Edited October 29, 2013 by obob

[ArizonaEnergi]

CR collects a lot of data points from their subscribers and I think the MFT problems hit the C-Max especially hard leading to this rating, although I don't know why the Energi got picked except with its fewer sales it probably had the higher per capita score.

 

 

Consumer Reports provides the most available to consumers (available to subscribers). It's based on CR's annual surveys of our approximately 7 million magazine and website subscribers. These surveys ask about any serious problems they've had with their vehicles in the preceding 12 months. They generate hundreds of thousands of responses—the 2013 survey, for instance, provided information on 1.1 million vehicles—which give us a solid foundation for our reliability Ratings.

[Adair]

OK Seth and all, I took the liberty of editing the title..........for clarity to those dropping in here from, say, the moon or a Google or Bing search. Hope you don't mind.

 

I heard part of the report on the way home from work yesterday and didn't hear either C-MAX mentioned. The story I heard focused on 4 vehicles, 3 of which were Toyota, 1 was the Prius V, and was about crash test scores. I held my breath but they didn't mention the C-MAX.

[ArizonaEnergi]

I just saw a article on the internet from consumer reports, saying the C-maxes are the least reliable cars.

If you are currently subscribed to consumer reports, like I am I'm sure your just as angry.

I am terminating my consumer reports subscription immediately, for being so bias. :nonono: :gaah:

 

 

Before you terminate, can you access the details of the C-Max Energi reliability rating so we see if it is indeed due to the MFT system problems?  All those details are behind the CR paywall.  http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/ford/c-max/reliability.htm

[Seth7721]

Before you terminate, can you access the details of the C-Max Energi reliability rating so we see if it is indeed due to the MFT system problems?  All those details are behind the CR paywall.  http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/ford/c-max/reliability.htm

 Here is the official ConsumerReports release http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2013/10/2013-consumer-reports-reliability-survey/index.htm

[ArizonaEnergi]

 Here is the official ConsumerReports release http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2013/10/2013-consumer-reports-reliability-survey/index.htm

 

That doesn't provide the details that I can find.  Is there more behind the paywall?

 

Someone on the Energi forum posted "They docked it for electrical system, climate system, body hardware, and audio system."  Few Energi's have reported a dead 12v battery IIRC, the climate system seems to work just fine, hardware is excellent, and the audio system is MFT and at least for me has worked just fine.  All I can conclude is: WTF?

 

Note:  The battery problem survey done here shows 63 Hybrids with problems vs 12 Energi.  http://fordcmaxhybridforum.com/topic/1294-for-those-who-have-had-12v-battery-problems/?mode=show

Edited October 29, 2013 by ArizonaEnergi

[C-MaxSea]

CR, always a flawed (deeply flawed ?) system.  A valuable tool, but only to a degree - say 13 grains of salt, rather than 20.  Often problems reported are just perceptions, manufacturers resolve issues before CR even issues 'results', projecting forward with old data, ..........................  many 'great cars'  have had issues that CR has neatly identified, many of which were cars well worth owning & resolving their 'issues'.  CR, never a replacement for good judgment, and owning what you want / like (for a myriad of other, often much better, reasons)

 

The C-Max Energi still rates at the very top for me!

 

Oh, and :love_shower: our C-Max Hybrid, itty bitty warts and all. Great so far.

Edited October 29, 2013 by C-MaxSea

[wab]

This is MY FAVORITE YouTube.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2Bv9WL3vpY

[DaveofDurham]

This is MY FAVORITE YouTube.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2Bv9WL3vpY

 

Thanks for posting.  This kind of driving could also explain their poor mpg results :)

[Jus-A-CMax]

This is MY FAVORITE YouTube.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2Bv9WL3vpY

 

Its funny that this thread is out. I had a buddy just emailed me about this CR report on the Energi.

 

Good stuff wab....that is a damning as it gets :finger: .

 

Congratulations Consumer Report - you are well publicized now. Good thing about the 2013 and onward - it's called SOCIAL MEDIA. Enjoy the coverage CR ;)

[C-MaxSea]

"....................does NOT have a financial incentive for bias."

 

Sadly, yust a huge financial incentive for controversy & hyperbole.

 

Yust MHO

Edited October 29, 2013 by C-MaxSea

[DaveofDurham]

See   http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/04/reliability-histories/index.htm   for CR's explanation of its "Reliability" ratings system.

 

Note they say "Models that score a  are not necessarily unreliable, but have a higher rate of problems than the average model. Similarly, models that score  are not necessarily problem-free, but had relatively few problems compared with other models."

 

They also say, "Consumer Reports subscribers reported on any serious problems they had with their vehicles during the past 12 months that they considered serious because of cost, failure, safety, or downtime, in any of the trouble spots included in the table below."

 

Maybe I didn't read the survey carefully enough when I was filling out, but, for example, I am sure I marked down the problem I had with the auto tailgate feature even though I wouldn't call that a serious problem as described above.

Edited October 29, 2013 by DaveofDurham

[DaveofDurham]

They classify the C-Max (both the hybrid and the Energi) as wagons. They give the C-Max an overall score of 83 and say the best wagon got an 88 and the worst wagon got 62.

 

Reliability is discussed separately .   As noted in my previous post, they explain their "Reliability" ratings system at

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/04/reliability-histories/index.htm

 

For the Energi they say "much worse than average" reliability.  [but remember they also say, "Models that score a  are not necessarily unreliable, but have a higher rate of problems than the average model. Similarly, models that score  are not necessarily problem-free, but had relatively few problems compared with other models.] They give the top rating to 8 categories. They downgrade one notch from the best possible rating on fuel system, brakes, paint/trim, squeaks/rattles and power equipment.  They downgrade three notches on climate system.  They downgrade four notches (worst possible rating) on electrical system, body hardware and audio system.

 

For the hybrid they say "much worse than average" reliability.  They give the top rating to 10 categories.  They downgrade one notch from the best possible rating on fuel system, paint/trim, and squeaks/rattles.  They downgrade two notches on body hardware and power equipment.  They downgrade three notches on electrical system.  They downgrade four notches (worst possible rating) on audio system.

 

They also say.  "Based on the latest survey, we expect reliability of new (Energi) models will be 226% below average." and "Based on the latest survey, we expect reliability of new (hybrid) models will be 143% below average."   I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

[ScubaDadMiami]

I sure don't recall hearing many complaints about body hardware and the climate control system since becoming a member of this forum.  So, it would seem that we would have heard about these things being issues.  I wonder if the climate thing is related to the compressor noise, which is certainly not a defect.

[DaveofDurham]

I sure don't recall hearing many complaints about body hardware and the climate control system since becoming a member of this forum.  So, it would seem that we would have heard about these things being issues.  I wonder if the climate thing is related to the compressor noise, which is certainly not a defect.

 

How does the heater work on the Energi when you are driving in EV mode in cold weather?  Maybe people were commenting on the heat quality or that it cut into EV range?

 

I do find some quirks in the climate system on my SEL hybrid.  Things like the system not coming back on at the previous settings when I restart the car.  The fan coming on full blast when it was previously set at a low setting.  Today we needed a little heat at 7am by 11:30am it was sunny and 70 degrees.  The sun warmed up the interior of the car and when we turned the car on it decided to run the AC even though we didn't want it or need it.  I have seen this happen before even when the interior of the car wasn't that warm.  It's quirky but not a significant problem.

[Laurel]

"....................does NOT have a financial incentive for bias."

 

Sadly, yust a huge financial incentive for controversy & hyperbole.

 

Yust MHO

Are you Swedish LOL?

[fbov]

Whenever I see audio system trouble, I think "what were they thinking with MFT?"  It appears to be a major problem for every quality survey I've seen!

 

And if you leave the environmental system on AUTO, you should never be surprised that it seems to be thinking for you... regardless where your head's at, at that moment.

 

So, given that it's a lot of gimics causing the low ratings, would you have bought the car without MFT and the like? Is Ford trading perceived reliability for bells and whistles to fill the showrooms?

 

Have fun,

Frank

[Jus-A-CMax]

Whenever I see audio system trouble, I think "what were they thinking with MFT?"  It appears to be a major problem for every quality survey I've seen!

 

And if you leave the environmental system on AUTO, you should never be surprised that it seems to be thinking for you... regardless where your head's at, at that moment.

 

So, given that it's a lot of gimics causing the low ratings, would you have bought the car without MFT and the like? Is Ford trading perceived reliability for bells and whistles to fill the showrooms?

 

Have fun,

Frank

 

Frank, its no just the CMax that has issues with the MFT. One clear thing that in one of the surveys I participated in was that ALL the Ford owners complained about the MFT. All. Out of 10 people, 8 were different Fords ither than CMax and they all gave a thumb down on the MFT. I told them the 3.6.2 solved a lot of issues..but the past versions left a very bad taste in almost all of the survey's group minds. Ford did get the message.

[DaveofDurham]

 

 

I do find some quirks in the climate system on my SEL hybrid.  Things like the system not coming back on at the previous settings when I restart the car.  The fan coming on full blast when it was previously set at a low setting.  Today we needed a little heat at 7am by 11:30am it was sunny and 70 degrees.  The sun warmed up the interior of the car and when we turned the car on it decided to run the AC even though we didn't want it or need it.  I have seen this happen before even when the interior of the car wasn't that warm.  It's quirky but not a significant problem.

 

 

. . .

 

And if you leave the environmental system on AUTO, you should never be surprised that it seems to be thinking for you... regardless where your head's at, at that moment. . .

 

Have fun,

Frank

 

Frank -

 

Not sure if you were responding to my climate system comment - I never use AUTO climate, but I do observe occasional odd (at least to me) behavior of the climate system.

 

Dave