Battery dead

[MichaelM]

Pressing the radio's on button after shut off will turn the radio on for another 20 mins. or so

Edited September 13, 2014 by MichaelM

[drdiesel1]

I'll add another interesting electrical observation regarding my radio. On several occasions, I've driven to pick up someone and had to wait for them, so I shut off the car but still had the radio on. After what I thought was a rather short period of time, the radio turned off by itself and I think there was some wording in the display regarding 'battery low' but I don't remember. I never timed these periods but perhaps they were around 15-20 minutes. 

 

Am I expecting too much for the radio to play for a longer amount of time without turning the key to accessory position? I really don't remember, but I may have actually had to blip the key into start, and then turn off again. I have the base SE with no options, no touch screen.

The car has an accessories power buss that is on a timer. It will run for about 15 min. and then time out,

unless you open the door. Opening the door will turn the buss off. It you want to leave it on for longer time

periods, just turn the ignition on to the accessory mode and it will run as long as you leave the key on.

[Hybrid dude]

Ok, thanks

[CMax-Traveler]

I'll add another interesting electrical observation regarding my radio. On several occasions, I've driven to pick up someone and had to wait for them, so I shut off the car but still had the radio on. After what I thought was a rather short period of time, the radio turned off by itself and I think there was some wording in the display regarding 'battery low' but I don't remember. I never timed these periods but perhaps they were around 15-20 minutes. 

 

Am I expecting too much for the radio to play for a longer amount of time without turning the key to accessory position? I really don't remember, but I may have actually had to blip the key into start, and then turn off again. I have the base SE with no options, no touch screen.

 

Actually, this "battery low" condition you mentioned is different than the 15 minute power bus mentioned by drdiesel1.  I've experienced it myself several times.  I don't recall if I had the car in accessory or if it was off, but whichever it was, after sitting in the car having the radio on for a few minutes, apparently it's able to detect that the charge on the 12v is too low, and the 4" center display flashes a message about "battery too low, powering off", and then powers off the radio.  This was much shorter than the typical 15 minutes you're given, after which things just power off with no message.

 

When you flip the key on to re-engage the radio, it also re-engages the DC-to-DC converter, thus recharging the 12v battery.

Edited September 15, 2014 by CMax-Traveler

[Hybrid dude]

Yes, I recall the display indicating 'battery too low'. Wouldn't the 12V battery in normal condition be able to power the radio for longer than a few minutes, like perhaps hours, and thus is this a clue to the mystery, or am I forgetting something?

[kostby]

Yes, I recall the display indicating 'battery too low'. Wouldn't the 12V battery in normal condition be able to power the radio for longer than a few minutes, like perhaps hours, and thus is this a clue to the mystery, or am I forgetting something?

 

Those "low battery/audio-shutting down" messages are one of the reliable indicators that the 12-volt battery is not fully charged.

 

The 12-volt charging system of the car is apparently geared toward maintaining a properly-charged and fully-functional 12-volt battery, not intended for fully recharging it from 'dead' in the way a sophisticated battery tester/conditioner in a dealership could do.  A home plug-in 'trickle charger' has much the same limitation.

[Hybrid dude]

Just spoke with regional customer service manager, who indicated a new TSB came out last Wednesday, TSB 14-0155 which supposedly is another attempt at resolving battery issues. I haven't seen that particular TSB mentioned here yet. I was able to secure a rental vehicle this time and did ask her to ask them to check the coolant pump connectors as well.

Dealer still has not received new module, as per TSB 14-0155. It's been 7 days. Hard to believe but luckily I have a rental.

[kc1174]

That TSB is missing a couple of key steps. 1. Drive through a storm/wash car/stick a hose on full up under the front. 2. Observe if central locking opens the car after a few hours. If central locking works, customer likely left a cellphone charger plugged in. Hand over our sarcastic letter attached to this TSB. If car does not unlock, jump start the car and inform customer you cannot replicate the concern.

Edited September 18, 2014 by kc1174

[Hybrid dude]

Dealer still has not received new module, as per TSB 14-0155. It's been 7 days. Hard to believe but luckily I have a rental.

Car back this afternoon, new Control Assembly-Mobile Phone part no. DM5Z-19K350-B list price $190.71. 

[kc1174]

Car back this afternoon, new Control Assembly-Mobile Phone part no. DM5Z-19K350-B list price $190.71.

Uh oh, step 5 of the TSB says "is the vehicle an Energi built on or before 9/12/2013" yes = replace the TCU module (what they installed) no = go to step 6, then check for wiring chafing in the rear liftgate and drivers side door of the car (not specified if hybrid or Energi, so presume both) if built on or before 6/3/2013. The TSB itself is on another thread here in pdf format. Am on my cell out of the house or I'd tidy this up with a link or the pdf itself, but you might want to ask the dealer or Ford why you had to wait a week for a part the TSB says isn't supposed to be replaced :/

Edited September 19, 2014 by kc1174

[Hybrid dude]

Yes, I wondered about step 5, since I have a hybrid, but I have to draw the line somewhere. Though I have no evidence, I'm sure they're very enthusiastic when they see me drive in ... not.

[kc1174]

Yes, I wondered about step 5, since I have a hybrid, but I have to draw the line somewhere. Though I have no evidence, I'm sure they're very enthusiastic when they see me drive in ... not.

Cool - well at the least it's documented as another real attempt by Ford to fix the same 12v issue, which may, depending on your state, bring you closer to the point at which lemon law comes into effect, if that's what you choose. Plus your car got a new piece added to it :)

 

I ordered a new OEM water pump off eBay for about $30 last night from a company called Tasca in CT #DS7Z-8501-C. I've decided since my car only dies after heavy rain, and during that rain prior to it dying, my electric usage gauge in My View under the AC one is past 5kw (is normally just under 1kw), there's a short going on caused by that rain. So anyway, if Ford won't fix it and instead want to mess around with other stuff, I'll just take the car and the new pump in, and have them fit it along with a roll of 3M temflex cloth tape and pay to have them fix it and also go over all the wiring in the bay, and tidy up all the loose taping on all the wiring in there - the electric tape is all over the place in mine.. Shouldn't really have to pay to get it working, but it saves leaving it with them for days I suppose. Last time they said they checked the connectors on the water pump, I dropped some wax on the join - the wax was still there afterwards, so it'll be another dealer that gets my money this time. Meh... :)

[kc1174]

Btw, I'll be asking for the old pump back, so will see what it looks like and will post up photos. Might be next weekend. The connector - well, if it's corroded that's something they'll have to take care of. And I'll insist on them covering the connector with silicone adhesive too assuming the heat there will allow it. Then I'll go find a storm somewhere. I'll report back when all this is done though.

[beeewell]

New member of the C-MAX dead battery club here.  Not much to add, but I just had the car serviced for the 1st battery failure, and dealer installed TSB 14-0155.  Only time will tell if installing that TSB alone will solve the battery draw problem on my vehicle only. 

 

On another note, it seems that Ashley is not accepting new messages.

[ptjones]

New member of the C-MAX dead battery club here.  Not much to add, but I just had the car serviced for the 1st battery failure, and dealer installed TSB 14-0155.  Only time will tell if installing that TSB alone will solve the battery draw problem on my vehicle only. 

 

On another note, it seems that Ashley is not accepting new messages.

You need to have 5 post before you can private message Crystal. :)

Edited September 25, 2014 by ptjones

[kostby]

FYI:  The FordService liaison in these forums is now Crystal.

Rebecca continues as FordIVTteam liaison for technology issues such as SYNC, MyFordTouch, and navigation.

 

Ford is not the only company with challenges involving batteries in early production models:

http://online.wsj.com/articles/boeing-787-battery-troubles-still-unidentified-1411643750?mod=rss_whats_news_us

[jomebrew]

My battery has died 6 or 7 times now.  Today is another gem of a day.  Last time, the dealer had the car a few days but never found anything.  Told me to call next time it happened so they can investigate immediately.  They boasted how advanced the car electronics are and every event that could possibly happen is logged but for some reason, the power drain and slow death s not logged.

 

I only live 30 seconds from the dealer and they could actually pop right over and poke around my dead car but they haven't gotten around to calling back.  They actually wanted to do that  and asked me to not jump it when it happened again.  A couple months go by and they lost interest.

 

Past observations:

 

- The electronics kept running.  I assumed it would shut off.  battery eventually died.

- Car automatically rolled the windows down (in the rain of course) and batter eventually died.  Happened twice.  Once I caught it.

- Automatic headlights never shut off. ( i heard the sound but didn't realize it was the lights on sound because they were on automatic).  battery died.

- Accidentally hit the emergence alarm on the remote.  Then hit lock and shut off the alarm.  battery was dead when it was time to drive home.

- Other times, no apparent event preceding the dead battery

 

 

 

 

[fuzz-ion]

Hi there... I'm considering buying a C-Max SE Hybrid, but the whole random battery dying Thing has given me pause. There seems to be lots of info in this thread (and others), but 69 pages is way too much to read through right now. So, would someone(s) who knows a lot about this problem mind answering a few questions or otherwise pointing me in the right direction?

1. About what percentage of C-Max Hybrid (not Energi) cars are affected? Just a ballpark idea; my thinking is that because I've never heard of this issue before actively looking into C-Max problems, it's probably a fairly low percentage. Hopefully. Could be totally wrong.
2. Does this problem affect all model years, or mostly earlier ones? From what I've read, Ford didn't make many changes between the 2013, 2014, and 2015 model years, but it almost seems to me like I've seen reports of problems more with 2013 models. I'm contemplating either ordering a new 2015 or buying a discounted 2014 off the lot, but I'm a little concerned about an older model if the older ones have more problems.
3. Has anyone noticed a pattern with respect to equipment present, e.g., MyFord Touch or not, navigation or not, etc.?
4. Has anyone successfully "cured" their car or otherwise figured out scenarios where the battery dies? I remember seeing something about being in the rain. Is there ever any kind of warning sign before it happens? The post by jomebrew right before this one mentions a few odd occurrences, and I thought I saw something here or elsewhere about maybe the battery cooling fan coming on and draining the battery.
5. The post by jomebrew above mentions the windows randomly rolling down, and I think I've seen this and maybe similar occurrences before. Is this a common thing?
6. Does the battery ever die after a period of time that isn't overnight or otherwise prolonged (e.g., not just sitting in a parking lot for a few hours)?
7. How long (time after buying, mileage) does it take for the problem to crop up? Shortly after buying, or a long time after?
8. What has been the general service experience with respect to having to pay for anything? I would imagine that this would be under warranty.
9. Has anyone pursued their state's Lemon Law successfully? Particularly anyone in NC?
10. Is it worth buying the C-Max knowing that this potential problem could crop up? (I'm already aware of the MPG débâcle. Doesn't bother me too much.)

Thanks for any help you can offer!

[ptjones]

The Short and Simple answer is get a 2015 SEL and you shouldn't have any significant problems. BTW your gas mileage is a reflection of how much effort you put in to it. Many of us CMAXers are getting 50+mpg regularly. It is fun to challenge yourself to do better than last time. I have three tanks of +60mpg on cross country trips. :)   

[Adrian_L]

Fuzz-ion, Fuzz-ion, Fuzz-ion,

 

Make yourself a nice cup of tea.  Get comfortable and do your research.  Trust me, you'll enjoy it.  It's like Young and the Restless around here without the sex.

 

But because I don't have two hours free, I'll just say that I agree whole-heartedly with Paul.  Stay away from the SE model.  And get a 2015 if you can.  And don't worry about windows going up and down.  They don't.

 

Adrian
 

[Kelleytoons]

And for my two cents I do believe that those cars without MFT tend to have more battery problems than those with it (which is still another reason to think that SE models, who mostly don't have it, are more prone to these issues).  

 

And life is too short to worry about this particular issue, which has to be affecting a minority of cars or Ford would have a problem selling ANY of these.

[fuzz-ion]

Thanks for your replies.

 

@Adrian--I'd love to sit down and spend a few hours reading over the forum, but I'm working mega overtime this week and we don't have a whole lot of time--one of our cars is giving us problems and we're hesitant to drive it too much--hence my idea of trying to get the "reader's digest" version.   :)  If I had the time, I could envision putting together a spreadsheet to analyze model year, trim level, equipment present, etc. to find a commonality--sounds like fun, but...

 

@ptjones--I agree about the mileage being a function of the driver--it's all in the wrist--er, ankle. I routinely coax 24-25 MPG out of my Fusion V6. In the city, not the highway.

 

@Kelleytoons--thanks for the reassurance. Nice to know that it's not something to lose sleep over.

 

@ptjones and Kelleytoons--Unfortunately, due to money and equipment concerns, we don't really want the SEL (especially don't want the leather interior and some of the other stuff that comes on the SEL--until now, that included MyFord Touch, but now I'm second-guessing). Must ponder.

 

Thanks again!

[fuzz-ion]

Follow-up question (and yes, I know I can dig into the forum, but if someone has the answer in their brain already, it saves me time  :) )--when the battery goes dead, it can be jump-started, right? And afterwards, can it be driven around like a conventional gas car, or no (or is it Game Over as soon as the gas engine stops at a traffic light)? Just thinking about how inconvenient it would end up being--can I drive to the dealer, or do I need a tow--if I ended up with a lemon.

[stevedebi]

Follow-up question (and yes, I know I can dig into the forum, but if someone has the answer in their brain already, it saves me time  :) )--when the battery goes dead, it can be jump-started, right? And afterwards, can it be driven around like a conventional gas car, or no (or is it Game Over as soon as the gas engine stops at a traffic light)? Just thinking about how inconvenient it would end up being--can I drive to the dealer, or do I need a tow--if I ended up with a lemon.

It can be jump started. I believe the 12v battery energizes the electronics to start the car. After that the HVB takes over.

 

Check your owner manual for jump start instructions.

Edited October 23, 2014 by stevedebi

[wab]

It can be jump started. I believe the 12v battery energizes the electronics to start the car. After that the HVB takes over.

 

Check your owner manual for jump start instructions.

 

Jumpstarted yes, just not very many times, the C-Max Drain is VERY hard on 12V batteries.