Battery dead

[RachelnLa]

I agree with laurel. If your selling it you should know about it! Your name is on that car. I find the auto world and most other businesses just don't care. They don't care about customer service or making a name for themselves.

 

My dealership has been less than helpful in keeping me updated on my car. I am not saying invite me tgiving dinner but when I am buying two, the first two, from your dealership then step up. When we negotiated the sales the saleswoman commented on how much we knew about the car. Hello? I don't just run out and plop down my money on anything. I do my research. So should she. It helps her be a better saleswoman. I got a text this week asking if I was tracking my cars. Uhm. And how do I do that without info from the dealer? HER? Crazy. Thankfully I have met wonderful people on the message board who help me out. When I relied I needed more info from her she said she would send it after she saw about her customer. Must be one helluva sale cause it's been a few days and she hasn't replied.

 

I fear having to bring it in. I can only imagine that visit. We shall see.

Edited February 14, 2013 by RachelnLa

[plus 3 golfer]

It's not "dumbing down". A salesperson may be an expert in the technical issues but when you run a business you cannot have employees overstepping their job duties. But they should be able to refer a customer to an appropriate person or get an answer to a question which may be we are not aware of that issue.

 

 

I agree a salesperson needs to know the product but not technical issues nor should they comment on what they read on forums. Like I said before, if Ford issues a TB or memo on an issue (and many times it will spell out what to say to the customer), then the dealer will be able to answer questions on issues. Ford cannot have dealers commenting on issues on forums.

 

 

My salesman couldn't sync my phone. He synced his and said my phone must be bad to which I said it works on my other car. I said I'll do it when I get home which I did. I also asked him if he read the many reviews on low FE to which he said he hadn't heard of such complaints. I didn't expect him to say yes and it looks like you won't get 47/47/47. Just like I don't expect them to comment on battery issues.

Edited February 14, 2013 by Plus 3 Golfer

[mbedit]

All these numbers and percentages are interesting but just suppositions. Anyone out there with connections to Ford? Monitors on this site? I've been lucky but sympathize with all of you who've experienced battery issues.

 

erwhitham,

 

I think it might be good to have some data from people who haven't had the problem. Sort of a control group if you will...

 

I would like to hear from people that have owned their C-Max for several months and have broken them in w/o issue! I know they are out there, and it might help to determine that if you don't see the issue after X months and Y many miles, your probably not going to see it.

 

With mine, it seemed to surface with-in 3-4 weeks, and about 800-1600 miles. Just about the break-in period. I'm sure there were other things that I just didn't notice because I wasn't looking for them. For example, I have a propensity to use accessories such as an iPad plugged into the USB port. One thing I noticed was that the C-Max USB port (on my previous C-MAX) did not have enough power to actually charge the iPad. This isn't unusual for an iPad as it requires more power than most USB devices and many USB ports simply don't supply enough. However, in retrospect, it makes me wonder if it could be a contributing factor to a cascade of failures.

 

Another thing I recall happening with my C-Max, prior to the failure, was at least two times, I went to start it, I put it in reverse, step on the peddle and it wouldn't go. I had to turn it off and then turn it back on and then it worked. Up until recently, I just didn't think anything of it, but in retrospect, its yet one more thing that may have been an indicator something wasn't quite right.

[Bill-N]

I would like to hear from people that have owned their C-Max for several months and have broken them in w/o issue! I know they are out there, and it might help to determine that if you don't see the issue after X months and Y many miles, your probably not going to see it.

I've owned my plain-vanilla SEL since early October.  I've driven it some 5500mi, including a 75-80 MPH round trip from Connecticut to South Carolina when it was just a week old.  So far, my only problems have been Sync/MFT related.

 

Hope this helps.

[Jus-A-CMax]

I think it might be good to have some data from people who haven't had the problem. Sort of a control group if you will...

 

I would like to hear from people that have owned their C-Max for several months and have broken them in w/o issue! I know they are out there, and it might help to determine that if you don't see the issue after X months and Y many miles, your probably not going to see it.

 

No battery issues. 6300+ miles since 1st week of December. October 2012 build. Only mechanical issues at all but I am having is software related, the GPS inaccuracy and MFT very unstable.

[flatbat]

salman, i think the working remotely referred to ford connecting to the car's computer from wherever the C-MAX engineering team is.

 

Yesterday we heard from the dealer that the car had yet to fail there but did post a few error codes while sitting over the weekend that lead them to checking all the wiring harnesses.  they found a pinched harness from the audio system that they think might have been the cause.  The car will stay there for a couple of more days for monitoring.

If there are no more error codes i am willing to give this attempted fix a try.  I 'll update you guys when i know more

[salman]

Flatbat

 

It would be extremely helpful to many of us if you could find out more about two things:

 

1) Confirming that the service department has connected the car's computer to monitoring engineers or service techs at a central Ford office, and finding out as much as you can about how they do this and why they decided to do it.

 

2) How the service department (and remote monitoring team) monitored error codes over the weekend. It is one thing to monitor the engine and other things  by computer when the car is on and mechanics are present, but quite another to monitor the car over 2 or 3 days. Different equipment is required. My understanding is that typical Ford dealerships commonly have equipment to monitor cars only when they are turned on and in the presence of mechanics. That is what my large dealership in Los Angeles says they have (Buerge Ford). But you and Mbedit have reported that your cars were monitored over 2 or 3 days or longer. It would be hugely helpful to know how your dealership did that.

[flatbat]

salman

 

My understanding from what the dealership says is that the car was not continuously monitored.  The error codes were stored by the car's computer while it was sitting for two days and simply read afterwards.

 

I can try to find out more about the remote connection, but I don't think I'll be able to get more detail.

[DaveofDurham]

erwhitham,

 

I think it might be good to have some data from people who haven't had the problem. Sort of a control group if you will...

 

I would like to hear from people that have owned their C-Max for several months and have broken them in w/o issue! I know they are out there, and it might help to determine that if you don't see the issue after X months and Y many miles, your probably not going to see it.

 

With mine, it seemed to surface with-in 3-4 weeks, and about 800-1600 miles. Just about the break-in period. I'm sure there were other things that I just didn't notice because I wasn't looking for them. For example, I have a propensity to use accessories such as an iPad plugged into the USB port. One thing I noticed was that the C-Max USB port (on my previous C-MAX) did not have enough power to actually charge the iPad. This isn't unusual for an iPad as it requires more power than most USB devices and many USB ports simply don't supply enough. However, in retrospect, it makes me wonder if it could be a contributing factor to a cascade of failures.

 

Another thing I recall happening with my C-Max, prior to the failure, was at least two times, I went to start it, I put it in reverse, step on the peddle and it wouldn't go. I had to turn it off and then turn it back on and then it worked. Up until recently, I just didn't think anything of it, but in retrospect, its yet one more thing that may have been an indicator something wasn't quite right.

 

Maybe I missed it, but has there been data collected (e.g., a survey on this board) on the vehicles that have had 12v battery problems.  For example:  SE, SEL or Energi; accessory package 200A, 201A, 202A or 203A OR 300A, 301A, 302A or 303A; days/weeks from purchase to first occurrence; miles to first occurrence; other problems before first time battery dies; etc.?

[salman]

salman

 

My understanding from what the dealership says is that the car was not continuously monitored.  The error codes were stored by the car's computer while it was sitting for two days and simply read afterwards.

 

I can try to find out more about the remote connection, but I don't think I'll be able to get more detail.

 

Thanks. That is helpful information.

 

Don't underestimate the extent to which the service manager will respond to polite and persistent questions about the extraordinary efforts they are making to diagnose your car, which is very difficult to do and you appreciate so much because of the great inconveniences you have absorbed through these repeated 12 volt failures. I think that kind of spin of the questions will get you details if you ask for details, especially since your service department has already been apologetic about not taking the issue more seriously when you first brought it in. 

[plus 3 golfer]

Maybe I missed it, but has there been data collected (e.g., a survey on this board) on the vehicles that have had 12v battery problems.  For example:  SE, SEL or Energi; accessory package 200A, 201A, 202A or 203A OR 300A, 301A, 302A or 303A; days/weeks from purchase to first occurrence; miles to first occurrence; other problems before first time battery dies; etc.?

I don't believe so but IIRC data collection has been suggested before and is a good idea.

 

Someone needs to start a new thread (suggestion would be someone that has had the issue) devoted to reporting every 12 V battery failure experienced (no discussion in the new thread) with pertinent data in a standard form which then can be easily input to a spreadsheet for analysis.  Of course one problem is this forum is a small subset of C-Max owners and the failures reported will be a small number of total failures.  There may not be enough data to draw any conclusions at this time.  Members that have already had failures should be PMed to add their data to the data collection thread. 

[valkraider]

It really seems like the battery issues plague the SE.

[erwhitham]

erwhitham,

 

I think it might be good to have some data from people who haven't had the problem. Sort of a control group if you will...

 

I would like to hear from people that have owned their C-Max for several months and have broken them in w/o issue! I know they are out there, and it might help to determine that if you don't see the issue after X months and Y many miles, your probably not going to see it.

 

With mine, it seemed to surface with-in 3-4 weeks, and about 800-1600 miles. Just about the break-in period. I'm sure there were other things that I just didn't notice because I wasn't looking for them. For example, I have a propensity to use accessories such as an iPad plugged into the USB port. One thing I noticed was that the C-Max USB port (on my previous C-MAX) did not have enough power to actually charge the iPad. This isn't unusual for an iPad as it requires more power than most USB devices and many USB ports simply don't supply enough. However, in retrospect, it makes me wonder if it could be a contributing factor to a cascade of failures.

 

Another thing I recall happening with my C-Max, prior to the failure, was at least two times, I went to start it, I put it in reverse, step on the peddle and it wouldn't go. I had to turn it off and then turn it back on and then it worked. Up until recently, I just didn't think anything of it, but in retrospect, its yet one more thing that may have been an indicator something wasn't quite right.

I now have 1600 miles on my SEL which was purchased in Oct. Although I also have had 2 reverse problems which surfaced in the first 2-3 weeks, I think that was due to my not allowing enough wait time to shift. I do not use the USB port. My MFT screen, phone connection, and clock have had glitches-all of which were reported to my service dept. and supposedly corrected with a Sync update. . Crossing my fingers and all other appendages that the battery won't become a problem.

[valkraider]

Energi, SEL

2700 miles

8 weeks.

 

No problems other than stupid MFT issues.

 

I use stuff plugged in to inverter, USB, and 12v outlets frequently. (I actually have a device plugged in to USB and another in 12V right now as I type this)

Edited February 14, 2013 by valkraider

[salman]

There is a dead battery roll call thread, abandoned for some time now.

 

12 volt failures have hit every kind of CMax with varying option packages, with few and many miles, in warm and cold climates, with and without accessories plugged in. There is no simple pattern.

 

We can't figure out an incidence rate on this forum. The posts are voluntary self-reporting by people who choose to search for and log into these threads. We won't get a count of all the 12 volt problems. Personal messaging everyone who has posted about a 12 volt problem on any thread (and there are a handful with such reports) will get spotty results. Some posters are gone. Others don't check their messages. And not everyone wants to post information (or more information).

 

Posts about cars without problems do not help. Most cars have not had 12 volt problems. We know that. We cannot possibly get a count of cars without problems from volunteers who come to this thread since the likelihood of coming to this thread and participating in it is very low if your car does not have 12 volt problems.

 

What I think is helpful is to have people who have experienced 12 volt problems post as much information as they can about what happened, when, where, and then about Ford's responses to the problem. We won't get an incidence rate, but it is very useful to be able to say we know about many cases, and more useful to know details about a bunch of cases. It is also useful to know what has been tested and what, if anything, provides a cure (battery change outs have helped in some cases, but not in others).

Edited February 14, 2013 by salman

[plus 3 golfer]

There is a dead battery roll call thread, abandoned for some time now.

 

12 volt failures have hit every kind of CMax with varying option packages, with few and many miles, in warm and cold climates, with and without accessories plugged in. There is no simple pattern.

 

We can't figure out an incidence rate on this forum. The posts are voluntary self-reporting by people who choose to search for and log into these threads. We won't get a count of all the 12 volt problems. Personal messaging everyone who has posted about a 12 volt problem on any thread (and there are a handful with such reports) will get spotty results. Some posters are gone. Others don't check their messages. And not everyone wants to post information (or more information).

 

Posts about cars without problems do not help. Most cars have not had 12 volt problems. We know that. We cannot possibly get a count of cars without problems from volunteers who come to this thread since the likelihood of coming to this thread and participating in it is very low if your car does not have 12 volt problems.

 

What I think is helpful is to have people who have experienced 12 volt problems post as much information as they can about what happened, when, where, and then about Ford's responses to the problem. We won't get an incidence rate, but it is very useful to be able to say we know about many cases, and more useful to know details about a bunch of cases. It is also useful to know what has been tested and what, if anything, provides a cure (battery change outs have helped in some cases, but not in others).

The member that started the "battery roll call thread" needs to take ownership of the thread and be proactive when members post about a battery failure.  There's needs to be a lot more data gathered than what's been posted in that thread (and in a consistent format).  There's more discussion than failures reported (not what one want in such a thread).   A thread like that will gain momentum if these failures affect a significant number of vehicles as most members will know of the thread and also direct new members with failures to the thread.    

 

Evidently, it's not considered a significant enough issue by most that have had failures - why? probably because it hasn't cost them $.

[andrewwx]

Hi All:

 

My Service tech just called. It looks like Ford is placing its bets on the wiring Harness. Just like Flatbat case - Ford Engineering told my guy to check 3 harnesses and report back.

 

Cheers

 

Andreew

[salman]

There's more discussion than failures reported (not what one want in such a thread).   A thread like that will gain momentum if these failures affect a significant number of vehicles as most members will know of the thread and also direct new members with failures to the thread.    

 

Yes, I agree with those points. It would be better to have a cleaner thread in which people post more information (about episodes, repair experiences, and trying to figure out the problem) with less chat that does not impart new or additional information. But it is an open forum with no moderation to keep discussions on point, so I don't think there is much one can do about that except hope that people exercise self-restraint to stay on topic and devote a little time to acquire and share information.

[salman]

Hi All:

 

My Service tech just called. It looks like Ford is placing its bets on the wiring Harness. Just like Flatbat case - Ford Engineering told my guy to check 3 harnesses and report back.

 

Cheers

 

Andreew

 

 

Thanks for this information. My fingers are crossed that maybe they have spotted the problem. If you can, please try to get them to tell you which 3 wiring harnesses are in question, especially if they  think it fixes the problem. (all 3 related to the radio?)

Edited February 15, 2013 by salman

[Mike51]

My car's build date was 9/2012. The date I purchased it (and the first occurance of a dead battery that I know of) was 10/20/2012.

[mipmapped]

The MyFord Mobile Android app released today for the Energi includes a notification feature (email or text) with a number of options, one of which is low 12V. The car should now text me if the battery goes low.

 

 

That is unless battery drain bug is due to a computer hang...

[Bill-N]

The car should now text me ...

How does that work?  Does  you car have a phone number or Wifi connection?  (Sorry if this is a stupid question.)

[mipmapped]

The Energi, at least, has a 3G cellular modem for management use only. It's hidden from the user so you can't use it for anything else. I'm sure the text will be indirect via Ford's MyFord Mobile servers.

[JPD]

Thanks to this forum and someone mentioning wiring harnesses, my Ford service department took this problem seriously from the second time I had a battery failure.  The first time they replaced the battery, having not found any other problems.  a Ford field engineer happened to be visiting the service department the last day my car was there, the deadline before considering a replacement or buy back etc.  The field engineer said the problem is in the wiring around the liftback or a door.  Sure enough, a wire was "chafed" i the liftback causing a short circuit that activated a "module' (?) that caused said module to stay on and drain the battery.  Wiring repaired, problem solved hopefully.  in any event, the problem and solution are documented and should there be further issues, they will be resolved.  Also they were appreciative of my input, most of my info coming from this forum since they have lately had a few more mysterious dead batteries.  i hope this puts this vexing problem to rest  and we can all enjoy our vehicles!

[RachelnLa]

Yeah!!! I hate hearing of problems but I LOVE when they are resolved. Much praise for all the posters and this forum. So glad to hear there was someone with ears willing to listen to a solution. Future cars will benefit from this.