plus 3 golfer

I think it's 38.3 feet not what Edmunds says. My 2009 Jetta Tdi was 35.8 feet. There's no way the C-Max is the same as my Jetta. After driving the Jetta for over 4 years, I had to re-calibrate my perspective when pulling into parking spaces and so forth with the C-Max.

I monitored a/c load and other load through MyView. Ambient temperatures were between 92 - 96 F. Humidity is very low about 10%. No re-circulation. Here's my observations: 1) After car has been sitting in full sun, the compressor load appears to be about 2 1/4 - 2 1/2 kW upon initial start up. Fan is on a high speed about 0.8 kW (my best guess as there is other load being metered on the "Other" load besides the fan). 2) After a few minutes of driving (cabin temperature has dropped significantly) the fan speed drops to around 4, the compressor runs about 0.9 - 1 kW. 3) After cabin temperature has stabilized the compressor runs at about 0.5 kW and the blower is running around the 3rd indicator (more on this later) and on average the other load is 0.4 - 0.5 kW. So, it looks like the total a/c load is around 1 kW. The other load does jump around especially when accelerating maybe 0.3 kW which may be the radiator fans coming on. I wish there was a way to know when the radiator cooling fans come on. 4) Speed affects compressor load as it seems to vary between maybe 0.4 - 0.8 kW. I attribute this to condenser load. Higher speed means more air flow through condenser, more heat removed from the refrigerant circuit and the less the compressor has to work to maintain the appropriate evaporator temperature. 5) The blower speed when in manual mode shows 7 manually selected speeds. But it appears when in auto mode the speed adjust is infinite or at least significantly more speeds than 7. There seems to be at least one other speed between the manual indicated speeds. The way one can tell this is if one changes back and forth from manual to auto. It appears the manual speed indicator will select the nearest manual speed to the current blower speed. You can hear a change in sound (when stopped) and feel a change in air flow when flipping back and forth yet the indicator stays the same. It's hard to detect while moving. While stopped and the temp is stable, check the manual fan speed and return to auto. If no change in blower speed is detected, then lower or raise the temperature one or two degrees and wait a few seconds. Then, repeat the check of the manual fan speed. The indicator will likely be the same as before but you should notice a change in blower speed either up or down depending on whether the temp was increased or decreased. It appears to work the same on dual by changing only one temperature dial but I had to change the temperature at least 2 degrees or more. Of course, if you change the temperature too much under either mono or dual, such that the speed changes to the next manual blower speed, the blower speed manual indicator will also change. So, lets assume an average compressor plus radiator cooling fan load of 0.7 kW or for ease of calculation 2400 Btu. Now assume the engine efficiency is 30%. So, the amount of gasoline need would be 8000 Btus worth of gas or about 0.07 gallons for each hour under the conditions I describe about. Assume my overall fuel economy was 40 mpg and my average speed was 40 mph. So if I traveled for one hour and burned one gallon of fuel with 0.07 used for AC, I lost 7% on FE due to the use of AC. I'm assuming that I would have run the blower the same with / without a/c. If I assume I would shut down the HVAC system, I probably would have saved another 2-3% or 10% total. I can't wait until it gets to triple digits and the monsoon season with higher humidity (maybe 30-40%). :) Here's a few things from the shop manual:

You can't cover every situation but generally if one lowers the overall temperature a few degrees blower speed.will increase (assuming nothing else has changed). But I'm going out now and will test and also I will monitor energy usage in My View.

Yes, the compressor is electrically driven with speed determined by maintaining the evaporator core temperature at a certain level. So during re-circulation of air, as the input air to the evaporator core becomes cooler, the evaporator core cools, and the speed of the compressor can be reduced to maintain the evaporator core temperature at the proper level. If one would switch the re-circulation off and the ambient temperature were higher than the cabin air temperature, the compressor would have to speed up to maintain the evaporator core temperature. So, running with the re-circulation on for longer periods should result in lower energy use. Also in auto-mode, the blower speed is used to maintain cabin temperature. If more cooling is needed (like when one lowers the set point cabin temperature), the blower speed will be increased. More air will now be blowing across the evaporator core and increasing the core temperature. The electric motor will then speeds up to lower the core temperature to the appropriate level.

X3 on the 8 months in Phoenix too. Yesterday we hit 100 F. Today's forecast is 102 F. I'll see if I have time to check kW usage on initial cooling and then when running after initial cooling. I believe, I can then estimate AC's effect on FE in Phoenix. I find if I set the temp above 75 F it gets uncomfortable -- "my seat and back" get too hot -- regardless of blower speed. I believe cooled seats would allow a higher temp setting and reduce overall energy consumption while maintaining comfort. Given that the AC compressor is electric and variable speed, I just let the auto feature regulate blower speed and hope that the algorithm to control the HVAC optimizes for comfort and energy consumption (there's certainly enough sensors to do such). By using My View, you can watch the kW consumption of manually changing blower speed and temperature and perhaps determine consumption vs comfort for lower temp, lower speed blower operation vs higher temperature, higher blower speed operation.

Correct about the EPA. Nowhere did I say Ford should not supply the EPA numbers although they can supply other numbers (see below). The issue is disclosure in the commercials. If Ford knew the EPA numbers would be difficult to achieve, all Ford needed to do at the end of the clever commercials would be to put disclaimers that cold weather, increased speed and so forth can significantly reduce your fuel economy like their issued statement in late fall 2012 and as the EPA allows (see below), instead of the small, few second text at the bottom saying that your mileage may vary. Why did they do issue the statement? Likely because Ford was getting bad publicity from the numerous reviews of the C-Max that the EPA numbers would be difficult to achieve. There's no question in my mind that Ford used the EPA numbers to their advantage. The question is did such violate any laws.

That's great. As I've said many times, getting 50+ isn't a problem under the right conditions. At the end of the day, what matters with respect to the suit is the average fuel economy of the fleet over a long period of time. If the C-Max fleet FE were nearer 47 mpg or maybe even slightly above the Prius V, there would likely be little basis for the suit. The question is how far away does actual have to be from 47 mpg to be material. Currently, fuelly shows 165 - 2013 C-Maxs at 38.7 MPG and 23 - 2013 Prius V at 42.5 MPG. Fueleconomy.gov shows 84 -2013 C-Maxs at 38.6 MPG and 9- 2013 Prius Vs at 39.1 MPG. So let's round to 39 for the C-Max and 41 for the Prius V. The combined EPA rating of the C-Max is 47 MPG and the Prius V is 42 MPG. IMHO, this is the fundamental issue in the suit as to whether Ford misled consumers ------- the C-Max is 39 actual vs 47 in the commercial and the Prius is 41 actual vs 42 in the commercial. It will likely be a good while should the suit actually go to trial. There should be significantly more FE data available by then and perhaps the FE of the C-Max fleet will increase after a few years of operations and surpass the Prius V. What will a jury think when they watch the C-Max vs Prius V commercial I linked to above should the actual FE numbers stay the same.

Actually, I'm not sure it's really about Ford following the EPA procedures correctly to get 47 mpg (I'm assuming Ford did). It's about Ford misleading the consumer in the C-Max commercials / ads to gain an unfair advantage over its competition and "dupe" the consumer. I believe the suit hinges on fair trade and consumer protection statutes. The commercial about C-Max beating the Prius V in MPG is well done, cleverly constructed but IMHO could mislead the consumer . Yes, in small print, for a short period of time there is an EPA reference and mileage disclaimer. I believe it will be virtually impossible for the plaintiffs to prevail unless during discovery (should the suit proceed), data surfaces that Ford went forward with commercials knowing that the "average consumer" will have a difficult time achieving 47 mpg and the average owner of a C-Max won't beat the average owner of the Prius V in MPG. I also believe that statements to the public in late 2012 and the FE explanation document to dealers in February 2013 indicate that Ford knew the 47 MPG number used in their ads / commercials would be hard to achieve for the average consumer. Are consumers not to operate their vehicles during the winter, not use a/c, not drive above 65 mph and so forth? I believe the complaint will likely indicate Ford should have know these facts about FE even if they didn't prior to the commercials. The question then becomes what is an acceptable deviation from the 47 mpg before the commercials might be deemed misleading. Again, one can look at the Prius V as an example since Ford used it in their commercials. Of course, as Wingrider01 says when one lets "12 to decide and each and every one of them will have their own judgment and feelings to follow", the outcome is likely anything but certain.

fotomoto, the car looks super. Keep us abreast of how "it" performs, like bug, bird poop, sap, and tar removal and water beading, water spots, general ease to clean and the like. I wonder if a clay bar or or auto car washes would affect it's appearance (I know Opti-coat says okay to clay and use "truck" washes). Also, is there any "maintenance" to do like touching up "thin / wear spots" over time and the like. A 2 micron layer is not very thick. For example, I can see the frontal parts and other leading edges of the car being subjected to more "abrasive debris" over time. Can it be applied over a clear bra (Opti-coat says it can be applied over trim, bumpers, headlights)? Also, is there sufficient opti-coat left over for maintenance purposes or would one have to buy more? I can not find any Opti-coat warranty info. If appears each dealer of the Opti-coat product would offer the warranty. Since I hate to detail my car or pay someone to do, this certainly looks like a fantastic product to save time and $ by DIY. I think it is similar if not the same product that the dealer had listed as dealer option on the sticker price of my C-Max at around $795 with lifetime warranty but I think you had to take the car in every year for a checkup on the coating to maintain the lifetime warranty and I believe you had to pay for a wash, removal of contaminates and dry and then the surface would be checked free and if needed a reapplication would be done.

So, what does the carpet look like where the dead pedal (foot rest) should be? The dead pedal is the floor area where the finger of my mat to the left of the brake pedal rests.

Have you tried turning off the automatic phone contacts update feature? Since I've turned it off, I've only had one wrong time in nearly one month instead of the 2 - 4 per week.

There's a panel below the glove box held in place by two screw / push caps over two posts. When that is removed, the filter is to the left in the center area held in place by a U - clip. It does look rather simple to change. But from the workshop manual it looks to perhaps be a tight fit (don't know the actual depth of the filter).

You may want to contact the law firm representing the plaintiffs.

:hysterical: I wonder what would have been Bill's response to the "supposed" GM response if that press release was true. ;)

Read more: http://www.autonews.com/article/20130423/OEM05/130429959/ford-hybrid-owners-sue-over-fuel-efficiency-rating-claims#ixzz2RTzsU3zK

I agree, I see virtually no benefit in knowing the total time. Since there is a GPS receiver in the C-Max, it would appear to be rather easy to keep track of moving time and then also compute stopped time and display both. I don't have the Navigation System in my C-max but I would think the system would keep track of moving and stopped time - my Garmin does.

Although the program "requires" such, I provided nothing but my driver's license and of course the pin. There is also a Partner X-Plan which limits the number of annual pins to two. I checked the Costco program when I bought in Dec. and IIRC, it came slightly higher than X-Plan pricing. For X-Plan the dealer admin fee is capped at $100. So, that's about $295 less than normal dealer admin fees. I can't remember what the admin fee was under Costco but I believe it was the normal dealer doc fees. Also, all options are priced under the formula for X-Plan pricing shown below. So, on a $28,000 invoiced vehicle, X-Plan out of pocket cost would be = (Invoice - $112 + $275)X-Plan Pricing + $100 dealer admin + advertising fees (if any) + destination + taxes + registration - Private Cash - Incentives. Costco would be about $132 higher (assuming a $395 dealer admin fee) which really is not much at all.

People are currently getting 5 months for $25 and I believe that's the $15 / month package. If you feel like reading, look at this thread (might want to start with newest first). I continually get mail offers for my other car in the range of 6 months for $25-$30 for the $15 / month package.

I couldn't find an easy way print the entire manual. I could only print the lowest level subsection in the Workshop Manual at one time. For example, the Climate Control Diagnosis and Testing subsection has 53 pages which would be printed to one PDF. But many of the subsections are only a page or so. So since there are a lot of subsections in the workshop manual, I'm only printing to PDF the pages that could potentially be useful to me. However, for the wiring diagrams one can print all the pages under a section shown in the table of contents. For example, one section in the table of contents may contain from 1 to XX pages. But, I could only get the multiple page selection process to work running XP under a VM. I could not get the multiple page print to work with Win 7. So now in the VM, when selecting the print icon and if there are more than one page in the section, a popup box now appears allowing selection of the page being viewed or multiple pages. Thus, I could save all sections of the wiring diagram in about one hour (IIRC about 50 sections and probably 250+ pages).

I have a one month subscription to C-Max service publications so I can print files to PDF.

Ford released TSB 13-4-13 today which supersedes 13-4-7 shown above to update the title and issue statement. The service procedure remains the same.

For $10.95 you can get a 72 hour subscription for the shop manuals at MotorCraftService and print files to PDF. I purchased the monthly subscription. You have to remove the front bumper cover and then you can remove the grilles. There's many push clips / screws on the top, front inner fender, and underneath the bumper cover which you should be able to locate without the manual. The link by jmckinley should suffice.

When the dealer works on your car, you should receive a copy of the work order indicating the problem being addressed and the work the dealer performed on the car. Even if it is covered under warranty, you should have also signed the service order. There are 2 TSBs 13-4-7 (effective April 11, 2013) and 12-11-8 (effective Nov. 12, 2012)and both instruct the dealer to update the firmware with 85.01 or later. Check the service order or call the dealer and ask about the TSBs. Time will tell whether the firmware update fixes the battery issue. Others, who have monitored 12 V battery voltage, see higher and more stable battery voltage after the update than prior to the update.

Well, I got my second one recently for a C-Max and of course there is a limit of one per household. The two Fords I've owned prior to this one were '66 Mustang and '86 Sable. I doubt Ford see's any loyalty in me (at least not yet).

Had you asked Ford for a brochure for the C-Max on the internet, Ford would have mailed you a brochure. AFAIK, everyone that requests a brochure receives a Private Cash Offer to get into a new C-Max (Hybrid or Energi). The Offer used to be $1000 and now it's $750. It's called a Private Cash Offer because it's not shown on Ford.com and can only be redeemed by the person who requested the brochure. Generally, all other incentives available to the public (like those listed on Ford.com) can be used with this Private Cash Offer like the current $750 incentive that is available on the Hybrid but not the Energi.