Battery dead

[Max Power]

Interesting note, Li-ion batteries have a Peukert constant of only 1.05, versus lead acid at 1.1-1.3.

[DaveofDurham]

Interesting note, Li-ion batteries have a Peukert constant of only 1.05, versus lead acid at 1.1-1.3.

 

Peukert constant?

 

I should have known (according to e-how.com)  "The Peukert number is a value that represents how efficient a battery can hold a charge. When a Peukert number is close to 1, it means that the battery loses very little charge. The higher the Peukert number, the less efficient the battery is. This value can be calculated using the formula n (Peukert's number) is equal to the logarithm of C (theoretical capacity) divided by T (discharge time) to the base of I (the current)."

Read more: How do I Calculate Peukert Number? | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_6902091_do-calculate-peukert-number_.html#ixzz2NXQLjE17

[Tom]

I, like many others, have been following this issue closely.  A number of posts seem to state that the HV battery starts the C-Max -- not the 12 volt one.  If this is the case, why are people not able to drive their cars and recharge the dead 12 volt battery?  I have very little knowledge of electrical matters so bare with me.  Thanks. 

[zhackwyatt]

I, like many others, have been following this issue closely.  A number of posts seem to state that the HV battery starts the C-Max -- not the 12 volt one.  If this is the case, why are people not able to drive their cars and recharge the dead 12 volt battery?  I have very little knowledge of electrical matters so bare with me.  Thanks. 

When the car is powered off, Relays open which electrically disconnect the car from the HV battery.  The 12-volt battery is required to close these relays to re-connect the HV battery to the rest of the system.

[Tom]

When the car is powered off, Relays open which electrically disconnect the car from the HV battery.  The 12-volt battery is required to close these relays to re-connect the HV battery to the rest of the system.

Thanks!

[Tom]

Does anyone know if Canadian C-Max owners are experiencing this battery problem to the same degree as those in the US?  I ask because It is my understanding that Canadian C-Maxes have daytime running lights--which is a further draw on electricity.  Canadian experience may be helpful to those trying to diagnose this problem.

[Laurel]

No battery problems thus far--got our SEL at the end of November.  I always drive with the regular head lights on as we live in a very rainy grey area and with the running lights you don't have tail lights on.  I never drive without head lights on--not even on bright summer days--just a habit to turn them on as I feel much safer.

[2peaches2oranges]

2013 C-Max Hybrid

SE 201A Package

Purchased 2-18-2013

1st Dead Battery 3-16-2013

Mileage 838

MPG 41.3

Sat overnight and in the morning, found it dead.

So. Cal. Temps overnight 40-50.

 

Even though the car was dead, I heard a sound, like a cell phone alarm vibrating under rear seat.

Called Roadside assistance and a tow truck w/battery jumper put me back in business.

I keep my lights on AUTO.

Nothing charging in the car like ipod, phone, etc.

Two days before, I noticed that the radio kept playing even after I took key out of the ignition, but shrugged if off.

Buzzing noise in front of the car when driving off.

After regularly gaining .4-.5 MPG daily, the EV has been coming on less and less and MPG kinda stagnant and not growing.

 

I did not take it to the dealer yet.

edit to note that I cannot get the clock to set the current time now. When the car powered up after the tow truck jump, it read 9:52. After driving it several times today, it has only changed to 9:59. I tried to set it to the current time several times with NO luck. Also the clock in the EFFICIENCY LEAVES area is wrong as well, but at least the time is changing/moving.  Any ideas on how to fix/reset the clock after a dead battery?

Edited March 17, 2013 by 2peaches2oranges

[mrobinso8]

Take it to the dealer.  It should be their problem, not yours.  Ford ultimately is paying for the dealer's work on the car.  If people make the dealers do what they should eventually Ford may realize there is a problem with Ford Hybrid electrical systems.

[mbedit]

Two days before, I noticed that the radio kept playing even after I took key out of the ignition, but shrugged if off.

Buzzing noise in front of the car when driving off.

After regularly gaining .4-.5 MPG daily, the EV has been coming on less and less and MPG kinda stagnant and not growing.

 

I did not take it to the dealer yet.

edit to note that I cannot get the clock to set the current time now. When the car powered up after the tow truck jump, it read 9:52. After driving it several times today, it has only changed to 9:59. I tried to set it to the current time several times with NO luck. Also the clock in the EFFICIENCY LEAVES area is wrong as well, but at least the time is changing/moving.  Any ideas on how to fix/reset the clock after a dead battery?

 

Def take it to the dealer. My first failure was around 800 miles. :-(

 

I can only add the issues your describing are key questions Ford has asked, that is, any clock issues, Funny biz with the radio, etc.

 

On mine, the radio keeps playing until I open the door... So I can remove the ignition key... which I think is normal. But if it kept playing after you opened the door, then that's wrong.

[flatbat]

update:  since we got the cmax back about a month ago (after they fixed the pinched wiring harness), we've not had any more incidents.  I'm still not willing to trust the car fully, but i'm getting there. and gas milage is getting much better now that the heater is getting used less.  good luck everyone.

[mbedit]

Great to hear flatbat! I know how you feel. After I got my replacement, I bought one of those jumper starters. Mines been running great, but it takes a bit to get over it.

[oxnard]

I know I've posted this on other threads but I thought I'd share the news:

 

Called the dealer today.  Been in a month.  He asked me if my "ears were burning?"  Because he said he just got a software update and the tech was installing it now and I could pick up my car today.  Hope the problem is fixed?  I told him I would pick it up tomorrow.  Let's see if it starts then! LOL!

[oxnard]

Hi My buy back claim is still at Ford corporate. The customer service rep said 5 to 8 (I assume business) days. So I might hear something tomorrow. Otherwise it's just me and my Corolla rental. Cheers Andrew

Brian at the dealer is installing new software on yours and my C-Max's. I just talked with him around an hour ago. I am picking my car up tomorrow.  Hopefully it is fixed and will start.  We shall see.  Lets keep each other posted.

--Marty

[salman]

Marty & Andrew

 

Thanks for the news about the software patch. Please let us know if there is a TSB number for the software. I'm eager to find out if it works.

[andrewwx]

Hi All:

 

Well this is interesting news. I must admit it does not make me happy. I am sort of over this car. Ford promised me an answer in 5 to 8 days on 3/7 even giving them the benefit of the doubt and assuming they meant business days, even though they did not say it, I should have heard something from them today. There was no phone call, no email, no nothing. I really just wanted a check so I could buy a new car that I do not have to walk up to with apprehension about whether or not it will start. Now I guess they want Oxnard and I to beta test this new software for them.

 

I wonder if they will call me tomorrow.

 

Andrew

[bymaine]

edit to note that I cannot get the clock to set the current time now. When the car powered up after the tow truck jump, it read 9:52. After driving it several times today, it has only changed to 9:59. I tried to set it to the current time several times with NO luck. Also the clock in the EFFICIENCY LEAVES area is wrong as well, but at least the time is changing/moving.  Any ideas on how to fix/reset the clock after a dead battery?

2peaches2oranges -

 

When my SE died last month, the clock was stuck exactly like yours. It advanced 1 minute each time I started the car. I couldn't reset the time by pressing the 'clock' pushbutton on the console, but was finally able to reset the clock and date by accessing time/date thru the 'menu' push button on the front console. I don't have the MyFordTouch in my SE, but rather the push button version of radio. After going thru menu/clock, the clock has been running properly for about 2 weeks...(so far) 

[oxnard]

Hi All:

 

Well this is interesting news. I must admit it does not make me happy. I am sort of over this car. Ford promised me an answer in 5 to 8 days on 3/7 even giving them the benefit of the doubt and assuming they meant business days, even though they did not say it, I should have heard something from them today. There was no phone call, no email, no nothing. I really just wanted a check so I could buy a new car that I do not have to walk up to with apprehension about whether or not it will start. Now I guess they want Oxnard and I to beta test this new software for them.

 

I wonder if they will call me tomorrow.

 

Andrew

 

I wouldn't count on them EVER calling you.  They have only called me once because I badgered them so many times.  Wouldn't have known about the "fix" if I didn't call them to ask about my car.  Hope it starts today!

[mbedit]

Andrew,

 

I would recommend (if you haven't already done so) sending a certified letter to Ford (in writing) that you want a refund.

 

Looking at California law, (section b of the tanner act) it sates:

 

(b) It shall be presumed that a reasonable number of attempts have been made to conform a new motor vehicle to the applicable express warranties if, within 18 months from delivery to the buyer or 18,000 miles on the odometer of the vehicle, whichever occurs first, either

 

1) the same nonconformity has been subject to repair four or more times by the manufacturer or its agents and the buyer has at least once directly notified the manufacturer of the need for the repair of the nonconformity or

 

(2) the vehicle is out of service by reason of repair of nonconformities by the manufacturer or its agents for a cumulative total of more than 30 calendar days since delivery of the vehicle to the buyer. The 30-day limit shall be extended only if repairs cannot be performed due to conditions beyond the control of the manufacturer or its agents. The buyer shall be required to directly notify the manufacturer pursuant to paragraph (1) only if the manufacturer has clearly and conspicuously disclosed to the buyer, with the warranty or the owner's manual, the provisions of this section and that of subdivision (d) of Section 1793.2, including the requirement that the buyer must notify the manufacturer directly pursuant to paragraph (1). This presumption shall be a reputable presumption affecting the burden of proof, and it may be asserted by the buyer in any civil action, including an action in small claims court, or other formal or informal proceeding.

 

Which is similar to my case. What I found, was that even when Ford agreed to the buy back, they required the procedure to be met to the letter, which  delayed the process by several weeks. You need all the documentation of repair attempts and total time in the shop.  They want all this, plus any bill of sale, receipts for  expenses incurred, etc.... and then have to send it to a processing center. All this takes time, which is frustrating, but they have their procedures and they must be followed.

 

Just going to the dealer won't be enough. The dealer comes into the picture once everything has been authorized by Ford, and then they will have you sign the vehicle back over and handle the final paper work. 

 

I was told, that mine took less time because I opted for a trade rather then just cash back.

 

Anyhow, sorry to hear about your frustrations, but make sure your proactive and hopefully you will get through it faster!

[andrewwx]

Hi All:

 

Oxnard - did you get your Cmax back today? Did they say anything about what the software does?/

 

mbedit - thanks for the info - I will check into that. I thought they were doing that. Ugh. If this was a refrigerator it would have been fixed/refunded by Sears in a couple of days. I don't know why the auto industry is so far behind in terms of customer service especially with so many options to choose from and social media to spread the word.

 

Andrew

[oxnard]

Got the car back a couple of hours ago.  All seem well. The software update is supposed to fix the power drain during the night. They wouldn't let me have a copy of their in house communications to Ford, but they did turn their backs when I took a picture of it with my phone.  Hopefully I have attached the picture. They said that there should be more updates in the near future.  Remains to be seen. I will let everyone know if it fails again. Andrew, keep us all posted on your progress.

--Marty 

 

[mbedit]

That's interesting! And I might adds seems to be consistent with comments that Ford Engineering has made to me. It sounds like they are working on another software update though that will actually keep the 12V charged better. It would also explain why the bulk of people experience this issue seems to be a base model as it has that 4.2 FCB my ford display.

Edited March 21, 2013 by mbedit

[salman]

Oxnard

 

Brilliant of you to snap a photo and wonderful of you to share it.

 

Just want to make sure I am reading the TSB # correctly: is it 12-15-11?

Edited March 21, 2013 by salman

[DaveofDurham]

Oxnard

 

Brilliant of you to snap a photo and wonderful of you to share it.

 

Just want to make sure I am reading the TSB # correctly: is it 12-15-11?

 

Double click on the image in Oxnard's post and the image will open in the gallery, then right click on the image in the gallery and you will get image size options.  On the large size image, the TSB # is clearly 12-11-8.

Edited March 21, 2013 by DaveofDurham

[andrewwx]

Hi Oxnard:

 

Shows how good Vista Ford is. I have no problems with them.

 

This is why I did not hear from Vista today. I have an SEL with the big screen. So this will not help me. For what is worth I truly believe that my power drain is somewhere in the dash / radio / nav screens and or the black boxes that control them. But no one has been as dedicated as the one tech that fixed RedLdrs car.

 

I wonder what will happen with me

 

Cheers

 

Andrew