Battery dead

[zhackwyatt]

My dealer has paid for a rental for my 15 y/o car which defiantly is not in warranty.  One time because they had my car apart and ran out of time in the day.

[plus 3 golfer]

I thought rentals were paid by Ford when warranty work is being done?

Read the warranty manual specifically the disclaimers, the dealer and Ford are not required to pay for a rental while warranty work is being performed.  Otherwise, everyone dropping their car off in the morning will want a free loaner.  But generally for warranty work that runs days, the manufacturer will pay for the rental.  

[zhackwyatt]

Read the warranty manual specifically the disclaimers, the dealer and Ford are not required to pay for a rental while warranty work is being performed.  Otherwise, everyone dropping their car off in the morning will want a free loaner.  But generally for warranty work that runs days, the manufacturer will pay for the rental.  

I guess that's what I really meant, as he was talking about a multi day event.

[andeeca]

  Update (nothing new):

March 21st, car was dead in garage, jumped it.  Called Ford line (800-392-3673) to report so that we have a reference number.

 

SEL 301A package, built Oct 4, 2012, had 5800 miles

 

 

Hasn't been dead since, haven't had cold weather(?).

 

Today went in for first oil change and they did TSB 13-5-1 for the electrical.

 

 

Service manager had never heard of anyone having battery problems.  I don't think he understands how car works because he kept asking if it was trying to "turn over".  Luckily he wasn't the one working on it. 

 

:-)

[Maxy]

Got my car back today. They did TSB 13-5-1 AND 13-4-13. They could not find anything wrong. I guess I'll just keep my fingers crossed? 

[Don O.]

My 1st post.

      Bought my CMAX -201A in mid-Dec. 2012.

      Had 1st dead battery in mid Jan. '13. Was dead in garage. Tow truck man jumped it in garage (using my little 12V battery charger) in order to get it on the roll-back. Lights came on almost immediately with the charger hooked up. Drove it onto rollback towtruck. Dealer service could find no problem, but decided to change the battery anyway.

      2nd dead battery (again in garage not driven in 3 days) in mid-Feb. '13. I jumped it & drove it to the dealer. They kept it over the weekend & it started with no problems for them. They could find no problem.

      3rd dead battery 1st week of May '13. Talked with service foreman. I jumped it again & drove it in. They checked all the wiring for the doors and lift gate. Could find no problem there. They performed TSB 130501 and 130413.

They monitored the voltage level for about 8 hours. I picked it up and drove it home. I hope the latter TSB will do the job. Only had the CMAX back now for 2 days. 

[Temp61]

From Ohio

 

My wife emailed this morning that her Cmax was dead again.   This is the 5th time we have had the battery drain issue.  An hour ago the Cmax went down the street on the back of a tow truck.  The bad news is that we have had all the TSB's installed except the recent DC/DC converter voltage boost one issued last week.

 

I have traced an issue on my car to the EVAP  Canister Purge Valve assembly which is an assembly attached to the underside of the car above the rear axle.   After I drive the car and then park it, there is a delay of about 10 minutes and then a relay kicks in and the solenoid on the valve assembly starts to hum.  It will cycle on for a minute and then off for about 10 seconds.  After 15 minutes it stops.  I recorded the sound on my cell phone and have it ready for the service department at my local Ford dealership.   I think it is the Engine Off Leak Test which Ford calls EONV  (engine off natural vacuum)  and my guess is that the control module continues to call for the test for a small leak over and over again. It doesn't take a lot of current for the test but if repeated enough times it could be draining the relatively small 12v battery.    My dead batteries have all been in the morning after the car sat overnight. 

 

My local dealer has been great, they are very concerned and frustrated that a fix has not been found.  I'll keep you posted.

[Laurel]

Don O and Temp61 do have SE or SEL model?  Sorry for your problems!

[erwhitham]

Good luck. You must be extremely frustrated. I'm impressed with your technical knowledge.

[Don O.]

Hi. I should have written that I have an SE model. The 3 dead batteries since mid-Dec. 2012 have come with now a total of 2200 miles on the car.

 

Side note; I have noticed that some 86 people have provided mpg values on the gov. site. Likely a somewhat biased sample as people would seem to be more likely to enter data if their results are low. The ave. of the 86 entries is 39 mpg. With 2200 miles on mine, my average is 37 mpg.

Doesn't sound like 47 to me...

[Laurel]

You sound pretty bummed out Don.  I would be too with the 3 dead batteries.  Our life time is only 6.6 L (which is 35 mpg US) but it is really averaging much better now with the warmer temperatures and we have around 1800 miles on it.  We are happy because we like the car so much, but with a series of dead batteries we would be bummed too.  I hope things soon get resolved for you.

[Don O.]

Laurel. Oddly I do like the Cmax. It seems solid, responds well, is quiet, & easy to drive.

I am just frustrated with the dead batteries & lower than expected mpg (which is a primary reason in my decision to buy the Cmax).

 

One thing I noticed in the user supplied mpg data is the 2 lowest reports (28 & 29 mpg) were from Utah and Maine, & the 2 highest (54 & 56) were from Florida. Hills and cold vs flat & warm???

[Laurel]

I think you are correct with your thoughts on mpg data.  I notice the forum rarely hears from our Alaska and Montreal members since they got their cars.  Both have extremely cold winters.  We are in the Pacific North West which is very moderate climate generally.  We aren't too dismayed with our winter mileage as we bought it for other reasons.  But I do maintain that the dealerships should be very forth coming with info on the effect of climate on the C-Max.  Our dealership knew nothing when we bought. 

[BobJustBob]

Temp61:  You are the second C-Max owner who has reported that he has suffered 5 dead batteries.  The other fellow, who lives in Florida, stated that he was so frustrated that he was looking into invoking Florida's lemon law.

 

Don O:  I had those same two TSB's applied one week ago (May 3rd).  I am keeping my fingers crossed that that fixes the problem.  I suffered two dead batteries within one week in late March.

[Temp61]

From Ohio.

 

My Cmax follows the same pattern as most of the problem vehicles.  Early build date, base SE model, 4.5" radio display.  

 

Erwhitham - thanks for the compliment on my technical knowledge but it comes from jacking the vehicle up, putting stands under it, crawling under my new car and carefully placing a long screwdriver against all parts near the rear axle. First I found the vibration, then after checking to make sure the part had nothing to do with the large battery pack above it,  I listened to my screwdriver and confirmed the noise.  Crawling out from under my car with pride, I felt like a "undercar detective".  A few hours research on the Internet increased my knowledge base about large and small leak tests, all mandated from the EPA dept. in Washington DC, not Ford. The tests are now so sophisticated that it takes a Motorola processor in the control module to run the tests.  I believe the large leak test is performed while the engine is running and the small leak test starts a few minutes after you turn your car off.

 

Ford will fiind the problem but I'm afraid my wife might leave me if it doesn't happen soon & no doubt I'll see her taking our other reliable car as she disappears down the driveway. 

 

That's okay, I have a bicycle plus a stationery car on jack stands to look at. 

[salman]

Ford engineers are also advising that battery draining short circuits  are being caused by water intrusion into electrical connectors. See my posts on this under a separate thread with that info in the title.

 

There was no reason to suspect water intrusion on my car. I live in Los Angeles and it has been a drought year with near record low rainfall. It is not like the car was in Hurricane Sandy. But my car had just gone through a car wash, courtesy of the dealership that had just completed the TSB updates for the display screen and DC converter. The engineers suggested checking the connectors because they have found the problem on other cars with dead 12 volt problems.

 

My post on the other thread lists the connector numbers that the Engineers said should be checked.

[Don O.]

Lemon Law? As mentioned in this forum, states vary on this. I have checked the law in KY. It also speaks to 4 unresolved 'failures' as a starting point for negotiations...or something to that effect. I have already talked with the dealer salesman re this & said if it happens again, say in the next month or so, that will be the 4th time & I shall seriously think about turning it in. I hope this doesn't happen! I don't feel carrying around a portable charger (& having to check that it keeps its charge!) is a solution for me!

 

My last car was a 2006 Escape which I gave to my son as his '97 (used) Chevy truck was going to require some major work. I had the Escape for close to 7 years. 42,000 miles on with the only service being a tire change and oil changes. I would look to an Escape if the CMAX battery issue has not been solved.

[Missyopu]

Sad to say , I am now on the list of people with dead batteries. I noticed that my phone battery drained yesterday when I was in the house and I was worried so I checked the car to make sure it was not attached via Bluetooth and it was fine. the car battery was good and the Bluetooth icon was not there. the phone was in the house and the car was in the driveway and it has not been an issue. I have had the car since February and it has about 2600 miles. it was built at the end of last year. it is at the dealer now. I have let them know that if it happens twice more I will need to get rid of the car. my job requires I have a reliable car. I would hate to do it but I can't have a car that does this. today I really regret getting this car. I wish I had my old reliable Honda element that I absolutely loved but the gas mileage was not as good. it was sold within a couple of weeks after I traded it in or I would love to have it back.

 

I should add se model only upgrade was a power lift gate

Edited May 10, 2013 by Missyopu

[oxnard]

There is hope.  My C-max was at the dealer for a little over a month due to the battery issue. My car got the TSB 12-11-8 (?) change when it was first issued around March 19th.  It has been working flawlessly since.  When I get a chance I will take the car in to do the other TSB to charge harder.  Only issue now is that sometimes Sync doesn't find my "mobile apps" on my phone and I have to reboot the phone.  No biggie.

 

Marty 

[barrier2entry]

Hi. I should have written that I have an SE model. The 3 dead batteries since mid-Dec. 2012 have come with now a total of 2200 miles on the car.

 

Side note; I have noticed that some 86 people have provided mpg values on the gov. site. Likely a somewhat biased sample as people would seem to be more likely to enter data if their results are low. The ave. of the 86 entries is 39 mpg. With 2200 miles on mine, my average is 37 mpg.

Doesn't sound like 47 to me...

 

I have had similar experience.  I just got my car back, this morning, from the 3rd dead battery incident.  They installed the latest TSBs (but only after I pointed them out and insisted), so we'll see.

 

I've also had poor mileage (~32 mpg lifetime average, so far, for 1400 miles).  No-one at Ford or my regional server rep seem interested in talking about the poor mileage performance.

[kbf1kbf1]

What am I missing?!? There almost 600 posts about owners experiencing FORD -Found On the Road Dead with their C-Max's, better named POS's, and there's no recall, there's no fix. I got my C-Max Energi just two weeks ago after exchanging it for another that had so many problems (I couldn't even drive it off the lot the day I bought it)  that the dealer found me an identical vehicle and exchanged it for the original, and guess what?? Yes that's right, FORD-Found On the Road Dead. Dead battery, dead car! Who gives a damn about hybrid, fancy technology, etc etc if the car is not just plain old reliable. When I go out to my car I want to get it in and go to my destination. No muss, no fuss.

 

I see that literally hundreds of Cmax owners have reported the same on this blog, many multiple times, which means there are likely thousands of instances of this. So what are you people doing about it? is there a permanent solution or should  I just take my C-max (POS) back and move onto to Toyota, Honda or Suburu. I don't want a car where every time I go to use it, a little voice is in my mind is wondering--is it dead?

 

Has a recall been demanded? I don't about where you are, but out here in California Ford is advertising the hell out of these POS's and I think we all need to start a viral campaign on twitter, Facebook and other social media sites warning people not to buy C-max's until Ford resolves all these issues.

 

If anyone has any facts as opposed to opinion or speculation, please respond. I want a reliable car!

[Laurel]

Sorry that you are disappointed, and I would be too in your shoes.  I have been on this forum since its early days.  I think there are about 30 or less people with battery problems, and hundreds without.  Most of the problems have been with the SE, but a few with the SEL and Energi.  I believe that Ford will resolve these issues, and their engineers seem to be working hard to find the problems.  Several people with persistent problems have had their cars bought back by Ford.  In your shoes with having only had your car for two weeks, it seems your dealership needs to step up and take the car back.  With the first Energi, what were the problems that didn't allow you to drive it off the lot?

[Laurel]

Jus and Adair, I may have responded to spam above.  Doesn't sound right somehow--i.e. highly exaggerated and inflammatory??

[kbf1kbf1]

It is absolutely right, and yes I am angry. Two brand new Energis, both DOA! Moreover, a simple count of those who have reported dead batteries just on this blog alone numbers in the hundreds. I don't know where you're getting the number 30 from. Do you work for Ford?

 

Remember, I asked for facts, not opinion, judgement, speculation. Tell me how to have a reliable Energi.

Edited May 11, 2013 by kbf1kbf1

[ceemax71]

I understand your anger and frustration.

 

Your dealer needs to look up this Technical Service Bulletin (published 5/2/2013) if they have not done so already:

 

TSB 13-5-1

 

Some 2013 C-Max, Fusion Hybrid, Fusion Energi and MKZ Hybrid vehicles may exhibit a 12 volt battery which is unable to maintain a charge or becomes discharged when the vehicle is operated with maximum electrical loads for short drive cycles and then left unattended for several hours.

 

See this link.