plus 3 golfer

+ 2 I virtually always buy TopTier gas but still dump two bottles of Techron in each year in our vehicles. Costco from time to time has Techron in their stores.

Unfortunately, your scanner is not manufacturer specific. If you really want to diagnose / trouble shoot your C-Max, I recommend spending $25 for a Service Manual on Ebay, the FORScan App ($6, IRRC) and an ELM327 (you may already have this) to connect your a smartphone. Here's a snip of the code. Also, you might want to read the attachment on how the monitor works that sets the code starting at page 63. OBDSM1503_HEV.pdf

First, a new HVB is about 7.6 kWh. You have lost 3.4 kWh out of 7.6 or 45% of the capacity. You still have about 55% capacity left. So, my suggestion is to stop charging it and simply operate it as a hybrid. You can then expect to get well over 200 k miles. If you want to continue to use the remaining 2.1 kWh of usable range and mitigate the degradation, do the opposite of what I’ve listed below as likely cause of the degradation. If there are no codes, the HVB is fine and has simply been abused by the previous owner and the HVB has degraded to a capacity of about 4.2 kWh likely due to a combination of cycling the HVB very frequently (maybe twice a day), charging in high ambient temperatures, and running in EV at very high speeds (very high discharge Amps). Lithium ion batteries will degrade faster if operated in those conditions.

Service Manual is $25 or less on eBay. FORScan app for smartphone is $6 and an ELM327 to connect to OBDII port is <$20 on eBay for a “Chinese” one. No splash guards on the underbody behind the rear wheels. https://forscan.org/home.html

12M02 ? Which was good for 5 years for Fords from date of warranty start for MY 2013 and 2014 and has more than likely expired as the original purchase would have to be after Feb 12, 2015.

No, the chemistry is the same in the Hybrid and Energi battery. IMO, the difference in the loss % relates to AZ heat and number of charge / discharge cycles of the Energi to near 100% capacity. The normal operating range of the Hybrid battery in between high 30% to mid 50% SOC. Yes, if one doesn't charge the Energi to 100 % each time, the losses would decrease. Here's my attempt to relate my Hybrid battery health to the INL tested hybrids at 105k miles. I believe, the INL data and my data are very similar. The standard method for measuring the capacity of a lithium ion battery is to discharge the battery from full charge at a 1C rate or in the case of the Hybrid battery at a rate of 5 A = 5Ah (nominal capacity rating) / 1 hour. So, the appropriate curve to look at is the curve labeled 0-10 A to capture all data which when averaged is very near 5 A. As seen on the graph, the 10-20 discharge current curve is very close to the 0-10 A curve. As discharge current increases, the curves drop.

As long as ICE supplied no energy to the HVB, 20 miles per charge is the correct range from wall power for that owner. EPA tests are no different. The car is driven on a dynamometer following the standard driving cycles which would include regenerative energy when the car is braking or coasting. Just like an ICE vehicle, mpg and mpge will vary depending on how the car is driven. But, their driving range is not an appropriate measure of HVB capacity loss when comparing with others’ driving range. However, if an owner drives the same route day in and day out, the owner can use a change in range over time as an rough estimate of % HVB losses which would include regeneration providing their driving style is virtually the same. Then, the owner can multiple that % by the accepted usable kWh available for EV only operation to get kWh losses. For example, when new the owner got an average of 28 miles on a charge for his daily commute in the summer. Now, 100 k miles later the owner gets 20 miles per charge over the summer, The owner has lost approximately 28.6% of the nominal new 5.6 kWh of usable EV only capacity or about 1.6 kWh. But, this 1.6 kWh loss when compared with the full capacity of the HVB of 7.6 kWh represents about a 21% loss.

Here’s HVB losses vs miles curves I prepared from the INL data and posted about 2 years ago for the C-Max and Fusion Energis and the C-Max Hybrids. The Energis suffered over a 20% or about a 1.5 kWh loss at 160 k miles. The Hybrids suffered about a 9.4 % loss at 160 k

I guess you've had some "bad" luck. The transmissions have a well documented known issue with the transfer shaft / bearings. Google or search this site for Ford's CSP 14B07 as there's no need to start another thread explaining it.? Also, there are plenty of recent posts about the issue with links to Ford TSBs.

Although the Energis are not specifically listed, the parts list shows a transfer shaft kit for both Hybrid and Energis (different gear ratios). AIso, the thread that lists owner's transmission failures has both listed. I believe the issue is in both. One will likely want to install the latest transmission strategy to the TCM. So, the installation program requires the info from the tag on transmission (strategy number and ID number) to be entered so that the latest program is installed. Your guess is as good as mine if one installs a brand new transmission into a 2013 MY or a 2014 used transmission into a 2016 MY car without the "correct" strategy - probably nothing significant.

Your radio will stay on after key off if you don’t open door for a period of time based on SOC of the 12V battery and the age of your 12V battery. If you reset the battery age PID (which is done when battery is replaced) and the SOC IIRC is above 40%, the radio will remain on for exactly 10 minutes. As the health / age of the battery declines, the time the radio remains on decreases. For very low SOC, the time on is very low ( around a minute or so) until the radio turns off. Try it and see how long it takes for your radio to turn off. I believe the dead battery issue associated with radio not operable is virtually always the APIM not the radio as the APIM won’t go to sleep and drains the battery.

Attached is the latest TSB 18-2328' MC-10148717-9999.pdf

What Ford allows dealers for labor hours is in the TSB. IIRC, it around 10.6 hours but dealer can do whatever if it's not covered under warranty. Look at the TSB as that gives a list of all parts and supplies required to replace transmission.

I seem to recall reading that you may have to remove a heat shield to get to it from underneath the car. Here’s the parts diagram (green item). I don’t believe it is on the firewall.

I can’t help you with the noise as mine is OK. I suggested to a recent poster to record the noise and post and perhaps those who have had the issue will chime in. With respect to goodwill, you might be able to get some help since you are not too far out of warranty. Try to develop an argument that the noise was progressive as the failure progressed. You can point out that you heard the noise several thousand miles prior and didn’t think it to be an issue. But the noise became more noticeable over time. So, you just found out about the potential issue with an internet search. Be cordial, polite, and do not make threatening statements like I’ll never buy another Ford again. I’d start with a larger dealer that has done Hybrid transmission replacements. I’d ask if they could test drive it and listen to the noise first and give an opinion. Hopefully, they won’t charge for that. If they say it’s definitely the transmission, then you can make your case for goodwill. As you may know, if the transmission case isn’t damaged then there is a transfer shaft kit that can be installed. But the dealer has to open up the transmission to check. The TSB show about 13 hours labor for transfer shaft replacement. Otherwise the transmission has to be replaced. if dealer refuses to negotiate on parts and labor, you can then open a case with Ford. If you’ve done past business with dealer or bought other Fords in the past might help with goodwill. If the above fails, you can go the route of SS and others on transmission replacement.

Same host as this forum.

No, but if one does not scan for DTCs soon enough and the issue is no longer present, the DTC can be erased / cleared. I think I posted this before but if not here's Ford's description of the 3 types of DTCs and how they are handled. Note the red text as to how DTCs are cleared without a scan tool assuming problem is no longer present. There are three types of continuous DTCs: an emission related malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) code which illuminates the CHECK ENGINE indicator in the instrument cluster. a non emission related, non MIL code which does not illuminate the CHECK ENGINE indicator, but illuminates the powertrain malfunction indicator (wrench), HAZARD, or both indicators. a non emission, non MIL code which does not illuminate any indicators. For emission-related MIL DTCs, the PCM stores the DTC in continuous memory when a concern is detected for the first time. At this point the DTC does not illuminate the MIL and is considered a pending code. The purpose of pending codes is to assist in repair verification by reporting a pending DTC after one drive cycle. If the same concern is detected after the next drive cycle, the emission related MIL code illuminates the MIL and sets both a confirmed MIL DTC and a permanent DTC. The MIL remains illuminated even if the concern is intermittent. A permanent DTC is stored until three consecutive passing drive cycles have been completed after a repair and the MIL turns off, or after a request to clear DTCs has been made using the scan tool and the next monitoring cycle has completed and passed for that DTC. Confirmed emission related MIL DTCs and any non emission related, non MIL DTCs are erased approximately 40 vehicle warm up cycles after the concern was last detected, or if the DTCs are cleared by the scan tool. Pending emission-related MIL DTCs that never detect a concern on a second consecutive drive cycle (and never light the MIL) are not retained in memory for any number of vehicle warm up cycles; they are immediately cleared when the next monitoring cycle has completed and passed for that DTC, or until a request to clear DTCs has been made by the scan tool. Any scan tool that meets OBD requirements can access the continuous memory to retrieve emission related MIL DTCs. However, not all scan tools access pending and non emission related, non MIL DTCs in the same way. During most diagnostic procedures in this manual, it is required that all DTCs be retrieved and cleared. Permanent DTCs cannot be directly cleared by the scan tool. When a scan tool clears DTCs, pending and confirmed DTCs are immediately cleared. Permanent DTCs will not clear until the next monitoring cycle has completed and passed for that DTC. For additional information, refer to Section 1, Powertrain Control Software , Permanent Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC).

Ford made three MY 2013 C-Maxes - SE, SEL, and an Energi - and the emblem should be above the Hybrid on the rear liftgate. Someone must have pulled it off - about $10 or so for a stick on emblem. I doubt this issue is related to the model of the C-Max. Look on the dealer Service Order and it should describe what they found / did. If no codes listed, then there were no DTCs stored. Unfortunately, you are experiencing a Limited Operating Strategy (see below). Normally, you should be able to drive at "limp speed" for a good while as I believe you were likely in EV mode running off the HVB. Once stopped, the software will not allow the car to move. After car is shutdown, the car may restart if all startup software monitors, which check critical systems, allow a restart. Is there anything similar between the two stop safely now events, like driving conditions, weather, engine running or on EV, high voltage battery symbol extremely low, coasting and so forth. Yes, the problem is if no codes and it can't be duplicated, one likely has to "wait" for a hard failure. I can't think of anything that one can do if the event happens but to get off the highway as soon as possible. "Limited Operating Strategy (LOS) Modes The PCM may initiate one or more of the LOS modes for some hybrid electric system concerns. The objective of the LOS modes are to manage vehicle operation after one or more of the following systems are disabled due to a concern: engine transmission high voltage traction battery regenerative brake system Some LOS modes limit the vehicle capability to a limp home condition. Other LOS modes fully disable the vehicle. The PCM initiates the appropriate LOS mode depending on the severity of the concern that was detected." - Service Manual

Really can't speculate without Diagnostic Trouble Codes. If your CEL is still on, get the DTC read (dealer or I think Autozone will still read them for free). It is also possible that there are codes stored in memory. What do you mean "not sel or se"? Do you have the Energi? It could be an anomaly and never happen again. Generally, the software detects a condition where it cannot determine the state of the vehicle while you are driving or it is getting mixed signals as to what is happening while your driving and for ones safety, tells you to stop safely now. If the state continued to exist on restart, the software will not allow the car to start. So, whatever caused the message is not present now.

Now based on the definitions of emissions certification classes in my preceding post, a hybrid like our CMax (not a PHEV) would have to be classified as an SULEV and have no evaporative emissions (which I believe our hybrid qualifies for) to be classified as a PZEV. Since we have an internal combustion engine which uses gas to charge the HVB, it will be difficult for a hybrid to be 90% cleaner than the average new car. A PHEV with sufficient range when being tested under the EPA emissions dynamometer tests, would likely meet the 90% target. The results of these tests are available for download by year. I use data from these files when comparing fuel economy and Road Load Horse Power among vehicles. Here are links on the emissions standards for California and a link to the EPA data (both emissions and fuel economy). I have also noted in research that some Hybrids can achieve the SULEV standard. https://dieselnet.com/standards/us/ld_ca.php https://www.epa.gov/compliance-and-fuel-economy-data I have attached below a snip of filtered results for the C-Max emissions test data. You can see that the Energi is certified to a lower emissions level than the Hybrid. I believe the bottom line is unless the Certification Sticker under the hood shows the vehicle is a PZEV, one will not get the benefit of the CARB emissions warranty.

I believe many have been assuming that CARB states were different. Here’s what WIKI says about levels of emissions certification. Fuel cell vehicle “California defines a ULEV as a vehicle that has been verified by the California Air Resources Board (CARB), United States to emit 50% less polluting emissions than the average for new cars released in that model year. Under LEV II regulations, the Tier I and TLEV classifications were removed for 2004. The ULEV is one of a number of designations given by the CARB to signify the level of emissions that car-buyers can expect their new vehicle to produce and forms part of a whole range of designations, listed here in order of decreasing emissions: TLEV (transitional low-emission vehicle) The least stringent emissions standard in California. California phased-out TLEVs in 2004. LEV (low-emission vehicle) The minimum standard for all new cars sold in California as of 2004. ULEV (ultra-low-emission vehicle) SULEV (super-ultra-low-emission vehicle) SULEV emissions are 90% cleaner than the average new model year car. PZEV (partial-zero-emission vehicle) A PZEV meets SULEV tailpipe emission standards, but has no evaporative emissions (i.e., no unburned fuel leaves the fuel system). A PZEV has a 15-year / 150,000-mile warranty on its emission control components. AT PZEV (advanced technology partial-zero-emission vehicle) An AT PZEV meets the PZEV requirements, but also meets some of the necessary conditions of a ZEV. AT PZEVs include dedicated compressed natural gas vehicles and hybrid vehicles with engine emissions that meet PZEV standards. ZEV (zero-emissions vehicle) A ZEV has no tailpipe emissions. These include battery electric vehicles and hydrogen vehicles (fuel cell vehicles).”

Correct transmission fluid.

Yes. The only question would be if all that was needed was the transfer shaft assembly, would Ford consider that as part of the Unique Hybrid Warranty. I don’t recall reading anywhere that one had a transfer shaft assembly replaced. Early on the transmission failures (before the TSB on the bearing issue). Ford replaced the entire unit. With issuance of 14b07 and TSB dealer must open up transmission and inspect for damper side case damage and if no damage replace the transfer shaft only. 14b07 covered transmission and transfer shaft until it expired in 2016. With subsequent TSB, it’s not clear if transfer shaft is covered under the Unique Hybrid warranty. Can you record the noise and post so others that have had the issue can give their opinions? I still think a UOA would be useful as a high elevation in metals would likely indicate a problem. Blackstone charges $28 for it. If metals are normal, you likely do not have the transfer shaft bearing issue. If you do record noise or do a UOA, consider starting a new thread on your transmission. Here’s a thread describing a whining noise first prior to the thumping grinding noises.

Are you sure? There have been questions on this before. My 2013 shows it has a ULEV 2 certification (sticker under hood). I believe the Energi is a PZEV which means it would meet the requirements below. Check your sticker. From the 2013 C-Max Warranty Guide: “Vehicles Eligible for California Advanced Technology (AT) Partial Zero Emission Vehicle (PZEV) Emission Warranty Coverage California Advanced Technology (AT) Partial Zero Emission Vehicle (PZEV) extended emission warranty coverage applies if your vehicle meets the following two requirements: • Your vehicle is registered in a state** that has adopted and is enforcing California AT PZEV emissions warranty regulations applicable to your vehicle at the time of repair, and • Your vehicle is certified as an AT PZEV in California as indicated on the vehicle emission control information label.”

IMO, since you hear the sound, I would get a UOA kit from Blackstone Labs and send the sample to them for analysis. If you catch the problem before the shaft bores a hole in the transmission case, you can get a transfer shaft kit instead of a used transmission savings maybe $1500 or so. https://www.fordpartsgiant.com/parts/ford-gear-and-shaft-asy_fg9z-7h348-d.html